Looong term food storeage

[bilmac]

I look at Mormen web sites [they are encouraged to keep a years supply of food on hand] and they emphasize rotating the stock because they say the quality of the food diminishes over time. OK, but who wants to have a steady diet of the kind of stuff that stores well, I don't want to have to eat rice, and dried eggs, and powdered milk until I have to.

But in thinking about it, I wonder if the nutritional value that they worry about declining is mostly the vitamines. I am thinking that the starches and sugars and protein in the food will almost always be there if the food is stored well. So, if I have to rely on foods that I have stashed maybe several years previously, the calories to keep me functioning will still be there, and I will only have to worry about vitamine deficiencies. A much smaller supply of freshly canned or dried fruits and vegetables should suffice to provide them, or even a jar of vitamine supplement pills.   

[Lloyd Smale]

ive at some pretty old sea rations and K rations that werer still fine to eat. I know some of them were probably 20 years old.

[bilmac]

I think oil is hard to keep for a long time, it can go rancid, but it is not a real necessity, it just makes other foods a lot more palatable.

[hillbill]

mormons tend to hav large families, or at least in my area. so it might be easier for them to sneak some of the survival food in now and then in the large pot and then replace it later with fresh stuff.but myself i kinda like brown beans, white beans, pinto beans, rice, brown rice etc.

[Dances with Geoducks]

At Bob's Red Mill in Portland OR, Bob says his 25lb sacks of grain foods are good for 5-7 years.
I put mine in a 5 gallon buck. Ill tell you how they are in 2013-2015.

[bilmac]

Yup, that is exactly the kind of stuff I don't understand. I was hoping some smart nutritionist or Dr. would pipe up and enlighten us. What do these folks mean when they say their flour is only good for 5 years? The flour is still there, and I can't help but think that the value of the carbohydrates is mostly undiminished. It's common knowledge that vitamins degrade over time, and yup you can become unhealthy over time from vitamin deficiencies. But quit putting fuel ,sugars, starches, oils, in your ol' body and it is gonna stop working pretty fast. I know if I have a bucket of grain that is 10 years old and some winter I get real hungry, I'm sure not going to throw it out. I'll bet it would do me a lot more good than boiling leather like our forefathers had to do occasionally.

I kinda think that maybe this is a bit of a sales gimmick so that people like me who like to be prepared won't buy our buckets of grain once and then never come back again.

[Lloyd Smale]

probbaly so you dont eat 20 year old rancid grain and sue them for selling it. Some people are to stupid to see mold or bugs. I was told by a survialist once that one of the best things a guy could have if shtf is dog food. Its nutritious enough to substain you and virtually will last forever if kept dry in a closed container. He said you could live healthy for years on just dog food rice and peanut butter.

[Rex in OTZ]

Old grain I had run some 3 yro field corn through a mill, the corn bread was not palatable, I found that long grain brown rice also has about a six month shelf life before it takes on a funkey taste.
Ketchup / Mayo also get funkey.


A gallon of Bleach loses 19% of its effectiveness every 12 months, you need allot of old bleach to do the same job as new.

[bilmac]

Maybe I'm wrong. I also had this theory in my head that whole grains will last a long time whereas if you grind them into flour they will go bad.

[teamnelson]

That part is true; whole grain lasts longer than flour. Buddy of mine got a barrel of grain and a hand mill for Y2K, still makes good tortillas.

[bilmac]

You read about caches of ancient grains that are found and the stuff still germinates and grows, but I guess I've never heard of anyone seeing if it makes good cornbread. Well I always figure I can get an answer to any question on Greybeard, even if I don't like them sometimes.

[Oldshooter]

I was told by a survialist once that one of the best things a guy could have if shtf is dog food. Its nutritious enough to substain you and virtually will last forever if kept dry in a closed container.

I'D have to have eaten the dog first! Then save the food in that container for a rainy day!

I've been thinking along these lines but if a fella aint far enough off the beaten path somebody will likely kill ya for your food if you have it stored and packed up for em.

[Lloyd Smale]

thats another reason he recomended dog food. He said alot of people would stick there nose up in the air about eating it and many wouldnt even equate it to being people food and that would give you a slight chance of them leaving it with you.

I was told by a survialist once that one of the best things a guy could have if shtf is dog food. Its nutritious enough to substain you and virtually will last forever if kept dry in a closed container.

I'D have to have eaten the dog first! Then save the food in that container for a rainy day!

I've been thinking along these lines but if a fella aint far enough off the beaten path somebody will likely kill ya for your food if you have it stored and packed up for em.

[Cornbelt]

Lots of times old grain will sprout, though maybe not with 100% germination. If you plant it, you know what you grow will be fresh.
  Had some 10 yr old Indian corn I planted last yr, and it nearly all came up.
  For making stuff with malt, which is sprouted grain, it needs to be used up pretty soon after grinding before the enzymes go to pot.
  As for the dog food, if a guy keeps a layer on top of regular food, maybe nobody will want to swipe it.   ("Imminent Domain" includes food.)

[SHOOTALL]

probbaly so you dont eat 20 year old rancid grain and sue them for selling it. Some people are to stupid to see mold or bugs. I was told by a survialist once that one of the best things a guy could have if shtf is dog food. Its nutritious enough to substain you and virtually will last forever if kept dry in a closed container. He said you could live healthy for years on just dog food rice and peanut butter.

Just be carefull chasing cars ! In Va. dog food is checked for content more so than some foods . Certian chemicals are not allowed on fields that are for animal consumption . But then the guts and feathers from chicken plants go to the dog food plant .

[teamnelson]

bilmac, multi-vitamins lose potency over time too. That's a tough one. I'd say we should all be planning to start a garden as soon as circumstances allow, and also hunt like a survivor which means eat the whole animal to get the nutrients. I don't like liver, kidney or brains, but chop it up and mix in some beans, adobo and some chiles and its more nutrition rich than the meat.

Dad used to make sonoran enchiladas with pork heart; all you need is oil, water, flour, and dried seasonings (store alot of those).
Low in sodium
No sugar
Very high in iron
Very high in niacin
High in pantothenic acid
High in phosphorus
Very high in riboflavin
Very high in selenium
Very high in thiamin
High in vitamin B6
Very high in vitamin B12
High in zinc

[bilmac]

My thinking is you can go without the vitamines for awhile in winter, but you've got to have the calories. Then come spring catch up from all the new green stuff. I don't even think about minerals living here in the desert, our water has plenty.

[Empty Quiver]

I have delivered raw ingredients to a dog food factory. For the most part it is all good stuff. However, meat was trucked in in hopper bottom trailers, it was already cooked but it sure wasn't refridgerated. I'm pretty sure those trailers weren't washed between loads maybe once a day but I ain't betting on it. The grains I hauled were pretty darn high grade and they were very particular.

Y'all eat whatever you want, I'll pass on the dogfood for a while. I've been storing provisions right near my belt buckle for years, bought and paid for I might add. If something doesn't happen soon I may have to go through my stock and trim back some of the oldest, if you know what I mean.

Keeping the oxygen away from your stored food would likely help. I've read many places about using argon gas, or CO2 to displace the air in buckets and such then seal tightly. Dry ice is an easy source of CO2 throw a hand full into a container fill with drygoods and when ice is gone seal tight.

[billy_56081]

Empty Quiver I have probably done some work at those same dog food plants you have delivered your load to. While not filthy places they are definitly not up to food grade cleanliness standards. In fact I may have even held you up a little bit at those plants while we worked on the truck scales.

[Empty Quiver]

Well Billy, you didn't slow me down as this was in Kankakee, Il.  I gave up on the entire Ag industry about 15yrs. ago, traded job satisfaction for a living wage. Then moved to Mn. from Il., like moving from Red China to France. Next stop is Wyoming, but I'm a bit tired of packing my bags.

[Cornbelt]

I used to work in a turkey hatchery. Sometimes a dump truck would come from the processing plant with about half a load of pretty fresh ground turkey. Then we would top it off with ground up dead birds, rotten eggs, etc. So there was plenty of protein, calcium, etc. But I think I'd rather feed it to the dog.    -Then eat the dog!

[chefjeff]

Just forced myself to watch this Viggo Mortensen movie "The Road" . It was a thought provoker on a post apocalyptic "society". I would suggest acquiring some heirloom seeds in proper storage. Think about what you would do without power or fuel,prepare yourself, and pray for a natural death.