kdfw townhall meetings

[ted]

Went to a kentucky fish and wildlife townhall meeting in Louisville this past week. Went to ask if they might consider adding centerfire handgun to the muzzleloader season. they said this is something they might consider in the future.
  Interestingly, 80% of the open mike discussion was about the proposed hunting of the sandhill crane. Lots of bird groups there oppossing this and some hunters were against it too. What are your views about this? Me, I think it should be allowed as it is in other states and I haven't heard any negatives form the few people I have talked to that have hunted them.

[JonD.]

I like the centerfire handgun idea. I wish they would add .35 caliber and bigger single shot rifles to that also.

The sandhill crane-- not sure I know what your talking about here. Are they also called blue herron's? Is this the tall legged birds you see catching minnows in creeks?

[littlecanoe]

Migratory birds.  Saw a few hundred flying over the Friday after Thanksgiving.  They have a different verbalization and fly in v formation like Canadian Geese.

I'd like to see an expansion of turkey season to the use of center fire or magnum rimfire for one of the fall weeks.

[ted]

Also brought up was WHY (capital emphasis) the kdfw made the last 6 days of zone 3/4 ANTLERED DEER only? Most of the hunters had been under the belief that taking f does is the way to control and improve the quality of deer as this had been the kdfw policy for years and the kentucky deer population in KY has been steady and has quality deer. The KDFW explanation was that this 6 day antlered only would make the hunters take a bigger buck and leave the small ones alone which would end up making a better buck population in the future.
  I think this is the wrong way to go. The KDFW said all changes are good for two year so time will tell.

[littlecanoe]

Did anyone talk about the real numbers in decline in the deer herd due to blue tongue that hit 3 years ago?
I'm still hearing stories about the decreases some are seeing in the herd.

[ted]

  That was mentioned briefly. What was mentioned was that the kdfw said initially that blue tongue appeared not to have an effect on the deeer population BUT now, (two years later) that their are indications that blue tongue has had an effect on the deer population.
 I do want to add that I think the kdfw is doing a very good job. Don't always agree with everything they do but, they offer a great amount of hunting and fishing opportunities. They even stated at the start of the townhall meeting that they know they can't please everyone all the time but through conversation (townhall meetings), can work through and find a happy medium and find things that work for most of the people.
  Case in point, one thing mentioned by a guest was lifelong hunting fishing licenses. The kdfw said they have looked into this and have talked to other states and have basically been advised they are not a good idea as they don't generate the sustainable funds they need but, a 3 or 5 year license is a workable solution they said they are seriously looking into.

[littlecanoe]

I like the idea of innovation on the hunting license.  I just wish that they would not be so political or politically correct with weapon options.  Innovation is needed here also.  A fall rifle week for turkey is a good idea to thin the population in some areas.  Night hunting for coyote is a great idea.  They need some flexibility rather than lumping all varmints together and saying no night hunting.

I know that there is no way they could have influenced the blue tongue epidemic and in our area there seems to be a comeback in the herd.  I've been told that in some areas of the state there was a catastrophic decline in the herd. 

[JonD.]

 

I've been told that in some areas of the state there was a catastrophic decline in the herd.  

That sure is the case around the Bradfordsville(Marion County) area. Over the last 12-15 years there has been a steady decrease in deer population. We just don't have deer like we used to. 15 years ago, you would see as many as 15 deer on a morning or evening hunt in just about any area of woods you decided to hunt that day. Now if you see two or three deer in a season of hunting, count your blessings. I hunted a particular farm of 1000 acres of woodland in which there were very few other hunters allowed to hunt, and saw a total of six deer in 5 years. I did take one deer in this 5 year stretch that was a nice eight pointer, the only buck I saw the entire time. A few years before on this same farm, my dad, two uncles, and myself took four nice bucks and four does(tagged out) from the same treestand on opening weekend. And saw several bucks and does besides.

In addition to blue tongue as a major contributor to declining populations, I think coyotes have done a number on deer as well. 15 years worth of unlimited doe season has taken its toll also.

[ted]

Do you think poaching has had an impact too?  Has the habitat changed much in that area  in the last 15 years also? Both those could be factors.

[littlecanoe]

JonD may be onto something with the Coyote.  A friend who hunts southern Adair county down toward Cumberland Co has watched coyote pushing deer, trotting behind to wear them down.  He has seen a decline in fawn survival in the area that he hunts.  This is why night hunting coyote is a good idea.  You will never eliminate them by night hunting but we could really decrease the number of predators and still have them in the food chain.  Other than cars, what kills a coyote?

I'm thinking that poaching is an issue too. 

[JonD.]

Do you think poaching has had an impact too?  Has the habitat changed much in that area  in the last 15 years also? Both those could be factors.

There was quite a bit of poaching going on then, but it has dropped dramatically since the outlawing of spotlighting. The habitat is still the same, knobs and woodlands with river bottoms and fields of corn and soybeans, however, there is not as much agriculture going on as it was then.

[JonD.]

JonD may be onto something with the Coyote.  A friend who hunts southern Adair county down toward Cumberland Co has watched coyote pushing deer, trotting behind to wear them down.  He has seen a decline in fawn survival in the area that he hunts.  This is why night hunting coyote is a good idea.  You will never eliminate them by night hunting but we could really decrease the number of predators and still have them in the food chain.  Other than cars, what kills a coyote?

I'm thinking that poaching is an issue too. 

We have personally witnessed coyotes chasing deer as well. We had one that was chasing a deer to stop and come toward my wife, her mother, and our two young children as they walked down our road. My wife told her mother to take the kids and get to the house while she started running at the coyote waving her arms and hollering at it. It finally stopped and took off, but it really didn't want to. I guess it decided that the two little "fawns" weren't worth the fight it was going to have with the "doe" that was going to flog it. In my personal opinion, coyotes are nothing but a nuisance and most certainly need thinning down if not killed out. They kill young calves as well as fawns and I have never observed anything useful from them.

[littlecanoe]

A friend is a biologist with Fish and Wildlife.  He, and F & W, feel that they are needed to balance the food chain.  I'm like you, maybe destroy them, at least thin them to a minimal number.  With present regs, they effectively have no predator to control them. 

[ted]

Hadn't thought about the coyote issue. Have family in Jefferson county with chickens/ducks and they have had issues with a fox or two!
  Just checked the telecheck resutls for Adair county and compared it to last years'. About 300 less deer this year were taken in Adair compared to last year! Sounds like the blue tongue had a major factor in this.
 Also read the article on the two bears taken legally . Saw on telecheck that a female bear was taken in Adair county in Feb. 2009. Anyone know if this bear was result of poaching or how it was taken?

[littlecanoe]

There have been bear sightings in Adair and surrounding co's for years. 
These are documented. 
I haven't heard or read about a bear being taken in Adair.
Do you have a link to an article?
I would not be surprised. 
There is a lot of wild country in all of the counties in that area.

[LEO]

In my area EHD had a huge impact on the deer herd, in some places it virtually wiped it out.  I agree coyote populations are expanding as well and while KYFW says they don't prey heavily on deer they would have to eat some and and I would guess a significant number of fawns.  As far as reducing the numbers of coyotes, I would like to see them close the coon season for the month of Feburary and prohibit dog training as well for that month.  This would enable a person to wage full war on the coyotes with traps without having to worry about setting their traps in a way to minimize the chances of catching someones coon hound.  I know that I have seen coyote sign numerous times and didn't set on it because there was sign of coon hunters using the area as well.  I know some people would say the trapper has as much right to be there as the coon hunter, but I try to be a good neighbor.  In fact, I often release sow coons and small coons from my traps because they really have no commercial value so why not let them grow up and have more coons.  I know the coonhunters wouldn't like shortening their season but I bet it would improve coon hunting in the long run as well because coyotes eat coons as well plus Feb is the breeding season for coons.

[ted]

I think Adair had a shorter deer season which would have accounted for the lower deer count also.
 Here's the info on the bear killed last year. It was poached.
 http://fw.ky.gov/pdf/newsletter0609.pdf

[bobg]

  The sandhill and blue heron are two different birds.  Both wadeing birds but different in appearence.

[powderman]

Coyotes have taken a huge toll in game in my area. Rarely see a rabbit anymore. They have pretty well killed the fox in the area too. There had been fox dens for many years not far from the house, the trail going to them is almost indistinguishable anymore. Last snow I saw 1 rabbit track, 1 squirrel, several turkeys, NOT ENEN ONE DEER track, but plenty of coyote tracks. One baited my 2 small dogs trying to get them to follow it into the brush. I hollered and they finally stopped short of being killed. POWDERMAN. 

[KYBOY]

Here in Eastern, Ky wild dogs are a worse problem than the yotes. Im a trapper (and a farmer) too and you would be supprised how many farmers think its yotes killing off stock when it turns out to be dogs  Yotes take their share for sure but around here dogs get as many or more 

[powderman]

KYBOY. We went to war on the dog packs over 20 years ago. One pack had 22 dogs in it. The law was no help so neighbors got together and started killing all strays. One farmer lost 20 goats to a pack, another farmer was drug off his tractor, another neighbor came to his rescue. I was attacked one winter by a pack of 6. I killed a couple and the rest chewed up my collie who probably saved my life, she saw them and never hesitated, knowing what they would do. I carried her home, she lived. POWDERMAN.