Author Topic: What should I know about my new Garand?  (Read 2109 times)

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Offline 300grJHP

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What should I know about my new Garand?
« on: December 29, 2010, 03:41:15 PM »
Hello all,

I just got my first M1 Garand for Christmas.  The receiver is Springfield and built during October 1943.  Aside from that, I know very little about this gun.  So my questions to you all are:

1. What should all new garand owners know?
2. How do I care for this rifle?
3. Do I have to have the en bloc clips or can I load it strait?
4. Anything else?

thanks,
300

Offline mechanic

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #1 on: December 29, 2010, 05:55:46 PM »
Hello all,

I just got my first M1 Garand for Christmas.  The receiver is Springfield and built during October 1943.  Aside from that, I know very little about this gun.  So my questions to you all are:

1. What should all new garand owners know?

When you shove the rounds in the magazine the bolt will attempt to remove your thumb...know as "M1 thumb"

2. How do I care for this rifle?

Manuals can be found with an internet search, surplus cleaning kits are readily available.

3. Do I have to have the en bloc clips or can I load it strait?

Now you've got me, I've never tried it without the clips?????


4. Anything else?

Congrats, you've just bought one of the most durable military guns ever made. And accurate to boot!

thanks,
300
Molon Labe, (King Leonidas of the Spartan Army)

Offline Curtis

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #2 on: December 30, 2010, 12:16:53 AM »
Get Scott Duff's book "Owning and Shooting the M1 Garand" I think that's the title.  I found it invaluable.

"M1 Thumb" is usually a result of not pulling the bolt fully back.  In this case, not the regular catch but the magazine follower is holding the bolt back and can release unexpectedly.  From what I've heard, you will only do it once!

Don't use commercial hunting ammo in it.  The pressure curve is not correct for the gas system and can result in a bent op rod or other damage.  Use military surplus 30-06 or rounds loaded specifically for Garands.

Curtis
Lord, please help me to be half the man my dogs think I am.

Contender in 17 Rem, 22lr, 22k Hornet, 223 Rem, 256 WM, 6TCU, 7TCU, 7-30, 30 Herrett, 300 Whisper, 30-30 AI, 357 mag, 357 Herrett, 375 JDJ, 44 mag, 45/410..... so far.

Offline shot1

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #3 on: December 30, 2010, 02:42:03 AM »
You have to have enblock clips to load the Garand to shoot semi-auto. You can single load one in the chamber and shoot it single shot without one.

Get a manual and learn how to clean and lube it properly or you will have problems.

Never shoot a bullet over 180 grs in weight. There are some company's that make ammo just for the Garand pressure curve. Hand load with H or IMR 4895, Varget, IMR or AA 4064 with 150 to 177 gr bullets in the mid-velocity range is what you should use. Always use a full length size on the case and DO NOT USE FEDERAL PRIMERS. The cup is too soft and with the free floating firing pin you can have a slam fire. I had that problem when I first started loading for the Garand. I have used Rem, CCI, and WW primers with no problems at all.
my most accurate match load consist of this. Lake City Match cases, CCI BR2 primers, 48 grs IMR 4895, 155 Nosler Custom Competition HPBT bullet. OAL 3.334 and I use a Lee Factory Crimp Die on it. 

You might want to change the op-spring for a new one. 60 some odd years has a way of loosing it's snap.

Offline AtlLaw

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #4 on: December 30, 2010, 06:12:50 AM »
I just got my first M1 Garand for Christmas. 

Somebody likes you!  A LOT!   :D

Quote
The receiver is Springfield and built during October 1943.

Cool!  One of my Garands is a '43 Springfield   ;D

Quote
1. What should all new garand owners know?

This answer applies to all your other questions as well.  Reasearch the Garand.  You can do a good bit of that on the internet.  Read things by Scott Duff as has been said, go to the CMP and Fulton Armory website, check out the Garand Collector's Assn..   There is just to much information about Garands out there.  Our server would run outa memory if we tried to type it all!  Not to mention our poor finners!   :P

But lessee here...  :-\  The first few things that pop into my mind are:
a)  The Garand is meant to be operated dry except for dabs of grease at certain spots.  Don't pour oil all over the place or down the gas cylinder assy trying to "slick it up."  Lack of oil is NOT the cause of the rifle failing to cycle.  ::)
b)  The bend in the operating rod is 'spose to be there... the bend is NOT the cause of the rifle failing to cycle.   ::)
c)  Don't look for "matching numbers!"  The weapon's serial number is stamped one place.  All the other markings you see are "drawing numbers" which may or may not be "correct" for your rifle.  As a note here, whether the drawing numbers are "correct" for the receiver serial number makes absolutely no difference at all and is NOT the cause of the rifle failing to cycle.   :D
You'll understand the above better with a little research on your part.  c) alone is a subject of hours of discussion!   :D

Do you know where the presentor got the rifle? ???
Richard
Former Captain of Horse, keeper of the peace and interpreter of statute.  Currently a Gentleman of leisure.
Nemo me impune lacessit

                      
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Offline 300grJHP

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #5 on: January 01, 2011, 02:46:53 PM »
Thank you for your replies.  I am purchasing the Garand book from Amazon.

Also, the Mrs. gave me this rifle...she bought it from a local gun store and paid $800 for it.

Other things about the rifle that people may be able to help me with are:

1.  There is no cartouche on the stock.  The stock also only as a few dings in it and has no cracks.
2.  Where the bayonet hooks on there is a "C" in the metal
3.  The bolt cover says "D28287-I W.R.A."
4.  The left/right rear-sight adjustment says "HRA-W"
5.  In front of the trigger safety there are numbers that begin with "C4602" but I cannot read the rest of them.
6.  I can find no other marks or numbers on the rifle.

Does anyone know what any of these markings mean?

Thanks,
300



Offline mauser98us

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #6 on: January 01, 2011, 05:34:45 PM »
WRA is Winchester repeating arms. HRA is Harrington and Richardson and is of post war manufacture.The number are drawing numbers. What most people don't know is most Winchester parts are out of spec.The Springfield parts are best and within specs on the drawing numbers.

Offline AtlLaw

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2011, 06:48:22 AM »
the Mrs. gave me this rifle...she bought it from a local gun store and paid $800 for it.

There are so many possible pitfalls in buying a Garand that doing so probably requires more knowledge of all aspects of the weapon then is necessary for any other firearm.  We're talking common problems like rewelded receivers!  I think, as if anybody cares what I think,  :D that the only safe way for the novice to buy a Garand is from the CMP.  But it sounds like the missus got you a good 'un.   ;D

Quote
Other things about the rifle that people may be able to help me with are:
...
Does anyone know what any of these markings mean?

Yes.   ;)

See my previous post. Especially:

"You'll understand the above better with a little research on your part.  c) alone is a subject of hours of discussion!"

Each of your questions is a common one and an appropriate response can range from one short sentence for #2 to book length replies for 1 & 6.  You can type in a google query faster then I can type a response!   :D
Richard
Former Captain of Horse, keeper of the peace and interpreter of statute.  Currently a Gentleman of leisure.
Nemo me impune lacessit

                      
Support your local US Military Vets Motorcycle Club

Offline diddlyv

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2011, 03:43:10 PM »
You have to have enblock clips to load the Garand to shoot semi-auto. You can single load one in the chamber and shoot it single shot without one.

Get a manual and learn how to clean and lube it properly or you will have problems.

Never shoot a bullet over 180 grs in weight. There are some company's that make ammo just for the Garand pressure curve. Hand load with H or IMR 4895, Varget, IMR or AA 4064 with 150 to 177 gr bullets in the mid-velocity range is what you should use. Always use a full length size on the case and DO NOT USE FEDERAL PRIMERS. The cup is too soft and with the free floating firing pin you can have a slam fire. I had that problem when I first started loading for the Garand. I have used Rem, CCI, and WW primers with no problems at all.
my most accurate match load consist of this. Lake City Match cases, CCI BR2 primers, 48 grs IMR 4895, 155 Nosler Custom Competition HPBT bullet. OAL 3.334 and I use a Lee Factory Crimp Die on it. 

You might want to change the op-spring for a new one. 60 some odd years has a way of loosing it's snap.

You can add winchester 748 and AA 2520 to the mix of powders you can shoot.  It will also handle 180 grain sierra or any other 180 grainers.   Do not try to over load to get the last bit of velocity.  You may end up buying an op rod.  I always used Winchester Primers when shooting high power matches.  Watch out for high primers.

You can get 2 rd and 5 rd enblock clips.  Actaully if you cross the rounds in a 8 rder you can shoot two rounds at a time.  I would not detail disassemble it very often.  Some of the stocks get kinda loose and wear more if taken on and off a lot. 

Offline maddogg

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2011, 10:30:36 AM »
Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his
level and beat you with experience.

Offline jpuke

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #10 on: April 18, 2011, 06:21:49 AM »
One of the best things I figured out was that a 1/4" socket drive fits perfectly into the gas cylinder plug if you need to remove it.  That is, if you have one of the "cross" or "phillips-head" type cylinder plug.  Get a hold of a gas cylinder wrench, and use a 1/4" socket drive and you won't have any problems taking off or tightening a gas cylinder plug. 

I bought one of the multi-tools that's specifically for the M1 and found that the tool used for the plug was entirely inadequate. 

If any of you know that actual type of gas cylinder plug that I'm referring to, please let me know.  I like to get my nomenclature right when I can.

Offline LanceR

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #11 on: April 18, 2011, 11:27:43 AM »
Don't believe any of these guys.  The M1 is a horrible nasty thing and you 're really going to hate it! I mean, you'll truly despise it!   Just save yourself the pain by boxing it up and shipping it to me.  I'll "take one for the team" and suffer through it all.... ;)



Seriously, they are a great bit of history that actually has real world utility.  Everbody ought to have a couple in the back of a closet somewhere.

There are lots of good publication available and it would also help to see if you can find a Civilian Marksmanship Program (CMP) Service Rifle Clinic in your area.  Go to CMP.org and follow the links.

The most common GI spec ammo available now is of Greek manufacture.  It's made to US and NATO specs, is of high quality, is non-corrosive, and comes in a sealed tin can.  While you are at the CMP site, check the store and see if they still have any for sale.

An "M1 thumb" is the result of letting your thumb get partially chambered while depressing the follower to release the bolt without loading a clip.  The way to avoid it is to keep your hand well back over the receiver and have only the ball of your thumb out in front of the bolt.  If you "blade" you hand (think like a karate chop) and keep your wrist and elbow firm the bolt will ride out from under your thumb.  You'll figure it out pretty quick and it will become second nature.

However, if you don't show proper respect for the strength of the operating spring then you'll join the millions of folks who've managed to partially chamber their thumbs.  I suspect that when it comes right down to it, for those who use their rifle fairly often there are only two kinds of shooters when it comes to giving yourself an M1 thumb: them that have and them that will.

When you clean the rifle, position it horizontally with the sights down and the trigger group up.  Keep the muzzle slightly downhill of the receiver.  That will keep any solvents and lube from flowing through the gas port and gumming up the gas system or draining back into the receiver. 

When you clean the bore you should avoid a segmented rod (unless you have a coated segmented rod) and use a one piece rod.  Pushing a segmented rod into the muzzle risks damaging the crown and the end of the rifling since the seams at the joints are often rough.  It is a good practice to push the rod tip, without a patch or brush, into the receiver.  Thread the brush on or put your patch on from the receiver end and pull it out the muzzle.  Remove the patch or brush and repeat as needed.  Pushing a patch or brush into the muzzle will accelerate bore wear since the rod will bow and rub the rifling.  M1 bores are not chrome lined and they are more prone to wear than modern military firearms.  Additionally, pushing a patch or brush into the muzzle will inevitably result in pushing solvents or crud into the chamber and action.  Cleaning it the way I've described will keep the action cleaner and keep solvents and lubes off the stock in the receiver area.  They will soften the stock.

Check with the local shooting clubs; many have "Garand" matches, either formal or informal, for unmodified M1s, M1903, M1917 etc rifles.

It is well worth the expense to find a gunsmith who is familiar with Garand rifles and have him check the rifle out.  Since they have been around for so many years and have been reworked so many times by both professionals and, in some cases, by fools it would be the safe thing to do. 

The advice to change the operation spring is good advice.  A tired spring will result in the bolt pounding into the rear of the receiver and will also lead to feeding, chambering and locking issues.  If it were my rifle I'd replace all the springs (except maybe the sights) so I know what I'm starting with.

Lance


Offline tdoor4570

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #12 on: May 09, 2011, 08:04:58 AM »
If you have any problems with your new Garand, just place it in a box and ship it to me I'll give it a GOOD home.  congrats

Offline mannyrock

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #13 on: May 10, 2011, 04:28:51 AM »

   I always wanted an M-1 Garand, but one day I was at a friend's house, holding his, and happened to see myself in a full view mirror.

   I looked like Woody Allen holding an enormous boat oar.

   I realized that I looked so utterly ridiculous, that I could never own one!  :-)

   Mannyrock
 
   

Offline Curtis

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #14 on: May 10, 2011, 04:40:12 PM »
I avoid mirrors for MANY reasons!!!  ;D

Curtis
Lord, please help me to be half the man my dogs think I am.

Contender in 17 Rem, 22lr, 22k Hornet, 223 Rem, 256 WM, 6TCU, 7TCU, 7-30, 30 Herrett, 300 Whisper, 30-30 AI, 357 mag, 357 Herrett, 375 JDJ, 44 mag, 45/410..... so far.

Offline diddlyv

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #15 on: July 14, 2011, 08:58:21 PM »
If you are worried a bout boogering up the crown and you use a 22 cal rod.  You can drill out the primer pocket of a 5.56 round and use that as a bore guide.
 
My M1 has never let the bolt close when I shove in a new clip.  Have always had to bump the op rod handle

Offline rdmallory

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Re: What should I know about my new Garand?
« Reply #16 on: July 15, 2011, 04:08:42 AM »


Quote
   I always wanted an M-1 Garand, but one day I was at a friend's house, holding his, and happened to see myself in a full view mirror.

   I looked like Woody Allen holding an enormous boat oar.

   I realized that I looked so utterly ridiculous, that I could never own one!  :-)

Soooo.

You think Obama is wrong to stop the re-importing them  because they will be used to hold up liquor stores?