test targets. Are they real?

[Lloyd Smale]

My new 300 wby vanguard came with a test target that has 3 into about a 1/2 inch. What range do they shoot them at and why if it really shot that well didnt it get picked to be a moa gun?

[BUGEYE]

I think most of them have a 100yd inside range.  we, of course, have to shoot out in the real world with its heat mirage, wind and the sun in our eyes.
your rifle is one of the best and I have no doubt that it will shoot tiny groups  when conditions are right.

[Graybeard]

I'm not sure anyone really knows outside the factory unless perhaps someone has visited and saw them being fired. When I bought mine they weren't even using the stock on the rifle to fire the groups. Now some folks say they are firing it with the stock in place that you get with the rifle. I've also seen it said they now fire the groups at 47 yards.

Bottom line to me is Weatherby isn't being very honest with customers about the accuracy of their rifles and might as well stop shipping targets with them unless they are gonna clean up there act and tell us what they are really doing.

Mine wouldn't even close close to shooting the group the test target showed with the exact same ammo nor with any other either.

[mauser98us]

I'm thinking they don't have a 100 yard indoor range.When I visited the Federal plant in Anoka  Minnesota,their test fire area was about 40 yards. I figure that's about normal for pressure testing etc.I think like Bill does the targets are a gimmick. I did get a target with my CZ 550, and when you look at how small it is,and you figure they are not gonna waste time adding optics, the range has to be real close.

[Lloyd Smale]

im sure there at least mounted in some kind of  jig that takes human error out of it at least and it would take a pretty big building to hold an 100 yard range indoors so id have to doubt the 100 yards stuff too. Ill give them one thing though. this is the first one ive boughten that had the box and paper work and i was impressed that the owners manual had instructions for ajusting the trigger. You dont see that much anymore.

[parkergunshop]

I too have my doubts about test targets  shipped with factory guns, that is why I spent a lot of time back in my gun smithing days doing accuracy work, glass bedding factory stocks, working on triggers and working up loads for the rifles I worked on.

My experience is that a Douglas, Shaw or other custom barrels in the same price range, will shoot circles around most factory barrels, the only two factory barrelled actions I worked on with 1/2 inch or less accuracy at 100 yards were both in 7 M/M Mag a Remington 700 and a Savage 110 both stocked and glass bedded by me.
I did not find Weatherbys to be any more accurate than an off the shelf Remington 700 or Savage 110 and no Weatherby was as accurate as my Douglas, Shaw and Hart barreled Mauser, Springfield or Enfield actioned sporters glass bedded in synthetic or wood stocks. 

I took my factory barrelled Savage 110 action in 7 M/M mag, glass bedded in a laminated maple stock to a sporter rifle match and after being laughted at by the.243 and  6 M/M factory rifle bunch for showing up walked away with the trophy for 3 shots in .432 inches at 100 Yds.  None of the factory rifle crowd even approached this group size.

[LanceR]

I'd guess that there is no need for a conspiracy theory.  Weatherby, like most makers, makes a lot of pretty accurate rifles.  I doubt that they pull more than a small fraction of them for the Sub MOA line.

Savage, I know, does theirs at 100 yards.  I have always suspected that they use a fixture and likely don't have anything but the barreled action to work with.  That seemed to be confirmed, at least for their muzzleloading 10ML II, when I had my barrel replaced.

In discussing the work to be done I was told that after the rifle was assembled they proof tested it and shot it for accuracy verification prior to roll stamping the barrel with it's data.  That indicates that, at least for some rifles, they are not in a stock when tested because I doubt they would take the time to disassemble it to stamp the barrel.

I also suspect that the size of the target paper does not matter.  If they use a fixture they target could be pretty darn small.  My last two Savage test targets and my CZ 550 test target were little squares about 3-4" square and they had been cut from a larger sheet with scissors.  Maybe a whole line of fixtures aimed at different parts of one target sheet to speed things up?

Another thought was that even Superman would show the effects of recoil an hour or less into a day of continual firing.

Lastly, since a lot of rifles that don't have iron sights come with test targets that would also argue for a fixture....

Lance

[torpedoman]

A friend bought a cooper and brought it to my range it shot horrible for him and me the test target was a joke in fact i got out an old Mossberg 22 and we both outshoot the cooper with it. rifle went back and forth to them several times the last time he took it back personally and asked them to duplicate their target or refund his money. he did not return with the gun.

[james]

I bought a synthetic Vangard .270 at a Walmart close-out and it grouped about the same as the test target, which was slightly less than one inch.   I traded it off after one range session for a 6.5x55.

[Slowpoke Slim]

Direct from the Weatherby website, support page "FAQ"...

Why didn't my Vanguard® rifle come with a factory shot target?

In an effort to contain costs and keep the Vanguard as affordable as possible, we discontinued the inclusion of a factory-shot target in each Vanguard box in July 2009. However, every Vanguard rifle continues to be made to our exacting specifications and quality control. And as always, it is backed by a written accuracy guarantee (Guaranteed to shoot a 1 1/2" 3-shot group at 100 yards from a cold barrel when used with premium (non-Weatherby calibers) or Weatherby factory ammunition).


Does Weatherby® have an Accuracy Guarantee? And what should I do if my rifle does not shoot within the guarantee?

All Weatherby® (Mark V® and Vanguard®) rifles are guaranteed to shoot a 1- 1/2" (or better) 3-shot group at 100 yards from a cold barrel when used with Weatherby® factory ammunition. For Weatherby® rifles chambered in non-Weatherby® calibers, the guarantee is effective when premium loads are used. If for some reason your rifle does not shoot within the guarantee, Weatherby advises you to send the rifle to a Weatherby-authorized service center. After being tested by the service center, if indeed it does not shoot within the guarantee and the rifle has not been altered, the service center will repair the rifle under warranty, or forward it to the factory for inspection and replacement approval, if deemed necessary.

Weatherby guarantees that your rifle will shoot at a minimum one bullet type and grain weight within our accuracy guarantee.  We do not guarantee that every bullet type or grain weight for every caliber will shoot within our accuracy guarantee.

Select models (SUB-MOA) are guaranteed to shoot .99" or less at 100 yards when used with specified Weatherby® factory or premium ammunition (3-shot group).

[NickSS]

I recently bought a Whetherby Vanguard in 308 Win and shot it for the first time a month or so ago using some ammo I loaded up over 20 years ago for my Model 70 Match rifle.  The ammo was tight so I had to deliberately close the bolt for each shot as the ammo had only been neck sized an fit in a different rifle.  I was really pleased with the result as I shot 4 10 shot groups once the rifle was zeroed at 100 yards using standard 25 yard slow fire pistol targets.  Three of the groups were all in the X ring and the last one had two bullets that drifted ouside the X ring into the 10 ring.  Average groups size was was right at 1 inch for the four groups.  I thought this was outstanding for a factory rifle fresh out of the box.  Actual groups size center to center for the 4 groups were: .82", .85", 1.05" and the last one (I was getting tired) was 1.21".  All were measured with a caliper and read to the nearest thousandth of an inch.

[huntwithme2]

  i have a vangard moa in 257 weatherby.  it came with a .89  target with it. as of today my best group is .44 with 110 accubond at 100 yards.   the moa is piller beaded and has a different stock.  i believe that is the difference between the vangard and the moa. 

[Lloyd Smale]

didnt know that. I thought they just grabbed the ones that shot well when test firing.

[Graybeard]

I think they do Lloyd. I still do not believe they are fired with the stock on at least not the one you'll get with it. So any that they think shot better than average they stick in the other stock and call it sub moa.

[Lloyd Smale]

they must not have needed any 300 wby moas that day as looking at this test target if that gun shot it it sure would have qualified.

[valvesinmyhead]

My Vanguard 270 Win shot better than the test target. The CZs that I have owned have all lived up to their Test targets.

[evilstepdad]

First Hello,

My first post on the forum and this site.  Was looking for some Vanguard info when I ran across this forum and was pretty excited until I read this thread LOL.

I live in Oregon and the Bi-Mart stores are selling the Vanguards for $359.99 right now as they are getting rid of them and will no longer sell them after they are gone, reason I got was that Weatherby is raising the price and they are going to replace the Vanguards with a lower price point rifle of a different make.

So I wen in last week and they did not have one in .243 so I called the other two stores close by and they did not have them so it was a bummer of a deal.  yesterday I called a couple of places out of the area that were not Bi-Marts and they had them but not in .243, so I go back to Bi-Mart to see if they will try and get one from another store if there are any left and the guy asked me what caliber and I tell him .243 and he says we have one and I tell him no the guy looked it up and you didn't have any more, he go's to the book and says we have one just got it in on the 20th. 

Well I am as happy as a lark and the guy comes out of the back with it and he is smiling ear to ear and tells me I am going to be very happy as this is an older one that has the test target which they have not put in for awhile.  He opens the box and he smiles again when he takes out the target and looks at it and says this rifle has been bouncing around for awhile because if this target would have looked like this within the last year or so they never would have shipped it to us, all 3 shots were touching.

I was so happy to see that until I read this thread and now it might not be that big of a deal.  I hope nobody minds to much if I just ignore the 47 yard distance and not shot in the same stock that you get with the gun, at least until I get a chance to take it out and shoot it LOL.

Anyway, hello to everyone

evilstepdad

[LanceR]

Evil, welcome aboard.  Find yourself a rocker on the porch and set a spell.

Lance