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Offline Dinny

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Ejector Problems
« on: April 18, 2011, 02:31:25 PM »
My Stubby Handi has an ejector problem. It seems that it sits too low as it will not pick-up a cartridge rim when it's being loaded. The cartridge passes by the edge of the ejector and can be loaded into the chamber without it. Since it doesn't have space to pass by when being closed, I have to partially close the action just enough to get the ejector to rise about .80" and catch the rim while loading. This doesn't seem easy to do when just shooting at the range, I can't imagine doing it excited, scared, with gloves on, with cold wet fingers, etc...

Can the bottom edge, around the upward curve, of the ejector be shimmed to make it sit higher all the time?

As I am only somewhat able to effectively communicate, I will try to post pics later showing what I speak of.

Thanks, Dinny
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Handi Family: 357 Max, 45 LC, 45-70, 300 BLK, 50 cal Huntsman, and 348 Win.

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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #1 on: April 18, 2011, 02:42:27 PM »
Sound sounds like the latch spring is missing/broken/worn if it's an ejector,  are all the parts there? See the FAQs to see what's supposed to be there, there won't be a lift button, it's for rimless only.

Tim
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Offline cwlongshot

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #2 on: April 18, 2011, 02:55:42 PM »
My first thought was the lift button. Then reading Tim's post realized its not there on yours...

When I rebuilt the 223 after the blow up I didn't install the button and it did this very thing...

I agree with Tim, Dinny. Check the exploded views and see of you can ascertain what could be going on. 

CW
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Offline Dinny

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #3 on: April 18, 2011, 04:24:15 PM »
Thanks guys for the ideas. I did read through earlier but didn't think to compare them for missing or broken parts. Otherwise, the ejector works fine, it shucks them a good ways.

Thanks, Dinny
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Handi Family: 357 Max, 45 LC, 45-70, 300 BLK, 50 cal Huntsman, and 348 Win.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day that my child may have peace"
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Offline Dinny

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2011, 06:19:51 PM »
I took it all apart tonight and performed the ejector to extractor conversion. That went well and was easy to do with my Dremel tool. I found that all the parts are present and intact. I actually stretched the rear spring (small vertical spring) a little to see if it would help. It didn't... I have found that the difference in height is coming from the forward (larger) roll pin is being pulled down and therefore the ejector lip is being brought down. Is it possible that it is pivoting too far? The wife helped me take pics, they will be posted tomorrow. OR-E-Gun Bill had a temporary fix for the conversion that looks like it might also help alleviate this problem too. The pin is being pulled down too far. Any other ideas on a possible fix?

Thanks, Dinny
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Handi Family: 357 Max, 45 LC, 45-70, 300 BLK, 50 cal Huntsman, and 348 Win.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day that my child may have peace"
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Offline necchi

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2011, 06:29:47 PM »
My 223 does that every so often, after I did the conversion.
 Some times a round will slip past when I load, sometimes the extracted case will slip back in after firing if I fumble with my fingers. I just close the action then open again and it works.
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Offline Dinny

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2011, 06:48:39 PM »
Quote from: necchi on May 01, 2011, 06:29:47 PM
My 223 does that every so often, after I did the conversion.
 Some times a round will slip past when I load, sometimes the extracted case will slip back in after firing if I fumble with my fingers. I just close the action then open again and it works.

Mine does it every time and that makes it difficult to load. It will not close unless the lip is in the rim cutout on the ejector.

Thanks, Dinny
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Handi Family: 357 Max, 45 LC, 45-70, 300 BLK, 50 cal Huntsman, and 348 Win.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day that my child may have peace"
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Offline Dinny

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #7 on: May 02, 2011, 03:50:22 PM »
Here are the pics I promised. As you can see, the more the roll pin is pushed down, the more the ejector is lowered. When lowered, the ejector doesn't catch the brass while loading. The barrel can't be closed if the cartridge rim isn't fitting in the notch just right.





Pressure on rear roll pin:



No pressure on rear roll pin:




The pics were brightened to show the dark areas in question.  Anyone have any ideas how to fix this problem??


Thanks, Dinny
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Handi Family: 357 Max, 45 LC, 45-70, 300 BLK, 50 cal Huntsman, and 348 Win.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day that my child may have peace"
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Offline jeepmann1948

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #8 on: May 02, 2011, 04:25:09 PM »
Try a longer roll pin. yours does not look like it is long enough to engage the rails in the side of the receiver.
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Offline Dinny

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #9 on: May 02, 2011, 04:29:04 PM »
Quote from: jeepmann1948 on May 02, 2011, 04:25:09 PM
Try a longer roll pin. yours does not look like it is long enough to engage the rails in the side of the receiver.

Actually it does work and, I believe, that's part of the problem. The pin engages the rails and that's what pulls it downward causing the ejector to move down. I wish there were a way to adjust how far it moves down...


Thanks, Dinny
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Handi Family: 357 Max, 45 LC, 45-70, 300 BLK, 50 cal Huntsman, and 348 Win.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day that my child may have peace"
Thomas Paine

Offline Dinny

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #10 on: May 02, 2011, 04:38:08 PM »
Is it possible that, during the stubbing process, a mistake was made in measuring how deep the ejector channel should be? Could the bottom be shimmed to decrease any downward movement? This picture shows where I'm considering a shim.


Thanks, Dinny
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Handi Family: 357 Max, 45 LC, 45-70, 300 BLK, 50 cal Huntsman, and 348 Win.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day that my child may have peace"
Thomas Paine

Offline phatgemi

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #11 on: May 02, 2011, 05:11:02 PM »
Dinny, I had/have this exact same issue with a .223 barrel I traded for. I also did the ejector to extractor conversion but I am seeing same thing you are with mine.

I shimmed it up a bit and it works much better. I made my shim a temporary fix and still contemplating how to make the fix permanent.  Good luck.
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Offline Dinny

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #12 on: May 02, 2011, 05:27:24 PM »
Quote from: phatgemi on May 02, 2011, 05:11:02 PM
Dinny, I had/have this exact same issue with a .223 barrel I traded for. I also did the ejector to extractor conversion but I am seeing same thing you are with mine.
I shimmed it up a bit and it works much better. I made my shim a temporary fix and still contemplating how to make the fix permanent.  Good luck.

I was just messing with the shim idea a few minutes ago. I cut a small washer with wire cutters until I got a piece that would fit under the width of the ejector. The JB Weld epoxy is setting right now and I will give it a try in about 30mins. I'm hoping that my eyeball thickness guesstimate is accurate. If not, I will settle on measuring the gap.... ::)

EDIT:  I did rough sand the bottom of the ejector and the shim to make for a better bond of the epoxy.

Thanks, Dinny
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Handi Family: 357 Max, 45 LC, 45-70, 300 BLK, 50 cal Huntsman, and 348 Win.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day that my child may have peace"
Thomas Paine

Offline Dinny

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #13 on: May 02, 2011, 06:04:21 PM »
The shim idea is working. Initially, I didn't measure the gap and so now I'm letting a thinner one set in the epoxy. It was close enough to see that it will work, but just a little too long so the dummy round wouldn't chamber.

Thanks, Dinny
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Handi Family: 357 Max, 45 LC, 45-70, 300 BLK, 50 cal Huntsman, and 348 Win.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day that my child may have peace"
Thomas Paine

Offline Dinny

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #14 on: May 02, 2011, 06:55:05 PM »
I finally got it right! All it took was a brass 0.010" shim to get the ejector up where it needs to be. Here's the "after" pics:











Thanks, Dinny
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Handi Family: 357 Max, 45 LC, 45-70, 300 BLK, 50 cal Huntsman, and 348 Win.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day that my child may have peace"
Thomas Paine

Offline OldSchoolRanger

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #15 on: May 02, 2011, 07:21:32 PM »
You got it working, good for you! 
I had the exact same problem, you just solve my problem for me.
Thanks!
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Offline Slowhanddd

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #16 on: May 03, 2011, 01:20:55 AM »
Good work there Dinny.
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Offline cwlongshot

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #17 on: May 03, 2011, 02:25:35 AM »
That should work just fine Dinny. After seeing your pics, That's what I would have done as well.

CW
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Offline gcrank1

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #18 on: May 03, 2011, 05:00:54 AM »
Well done! and the pics are great!,
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #19 on: May 03, 2011, 05:52:08 AM »
CRS strikes again!!  ::) Seems to me LONGTOM had the same problem with his 225 Winchester and shimming was the cure, nice work Dinny.  ;)

Tim
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Offline Dinny

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #20 on: May 03, 2011, 06:27:47 AM »
Is this a candidate for the FAQs? I can take more pics of the disassembled ejector, if it would help.


Thanks, Dinny
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Handi Family: 357 Max, 45 LC, 45-70, 300 BLK, 50 cal Huntsman, and 348 Win.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day that my child may have peace"
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #21 on: May 03, 2011, 08:59:06 AM »
It is indeed good info for the FAQs, but a change I'd recommend instead of trying hit or miss shim thicknesses is using a shim thicker than needed, then file it to a functional fit, I also changed the term extractor to ejector to avoid confusion later on when a newbie reads it. ;)

Tim
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Offline OR-E-Gun Bill

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #22 on: May 03, 2011, 09:27:30 AM »
I can see this being a solution for rimmed cases but wonder if it wouldn't be problematic for rimless cases. Maybe a bit taller ejector lift spring would help those with rimless cases?


Bill
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Offline Dinny

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #23 on: May 03, 2011, 12:55:00 PM »
Quote from: quickdtoo on May 03, 2011, 08:59:06 AM
It is indeed good info for the FAQs, but a change I'd recommend instead of trying hit or miss shim thicknesses is using a shim thicker than needed, then file it to a functional fit, I also changed the term extractor to ejector to avoid confusion later on when a newbie reads it. ;)
Tim

Tim,
  Maybe I didn't let it set completely, but I would be worried that the shim would shear off from being filed. It didn't take much to pry it from the bottom of the ejector. Then again, I did hit it with a chisel right on the edge where the two pieces meet....

Thanks, Dinny
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Handi Family: 357 Max, 45 LC, 45-70, 300 BLK, 50 cal Huntsman, and 348 Win.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day that my child may have peace"
Thomas Paine

Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #24 on: May 03, 2011, 01:16:28 PM »
You could just use a good epoxy and file it to fit, JB Weld or Superweld would be a couple good choices. Surface prep is critical when using epoxy tho, you can't apply it to a smooth surface and expect the best results, I alway rough the surface up with course sandpaper or a grinding stone to give the epoxy a place to adhere to, thousands of little scratches will make the difference between success and failure, it also removes any oil that may prevent a good bond, good prep is the reason why I've never had a shim pop loose on a barrel fitting, but many others complain about it.  ;)

Tim
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Offline gcrank1

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Re: Ejector Problems
« Reply #25 on: May 03, 2011, 03:45:28 PM »
Likewise on using some heat from a propane torch (or the gas cook stove) after roughing to just cook off any residual oil. Most all 'adhesives' say to apply to clean & dry and it sure is so for best results.
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      ><   ->
We are only temporary caretakers of the past heading toward an uncertain future
22Mag UV / 22LR  Sportster
357Mag Schuetzen Special
45-70  SS Ultra Hunter with UV cin.lam. wood
12ga. 'Ol' Ugly OverKill', Buck barrel c/w  SpeedStock  and swap 28" x Full bird barrel, 1974
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