Author Topic: A domino falls (Read 1484 times)

Junior1942 · « **on:** May 25, 2011, 03:52:46 AM »

From Yahoo! news: Medicare key to shocking Dem win in NY House race http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110525/ap_on_el_ho/us_new_york_special_election

"The Democrat rode a wave of voter discontent over the national GOP's plan to change Medicare and overcame decades of GOP dominance here to capture Tuesday's special election in New York's 26th Congressional District.

Hochul [the Democrat] defeated Republican state Assemblywoman Jane Corwin on Tuesday night, capturing 47 percent of the vote to 43 percent for Corwin, to win the seat vacated by disgraced Republican Chris Lee. A wealthy tea party candidate, Jack Davis, took 9 percent."

I'm betting the Republican voters there finally saw the truth behind tea party propaganda and decided they'd rather see big-oil pay income taxes than see their grandmothers kicked out of nursing homes. What say ye, oh, fellow forum members? Exxon-Mobil or grandma?

oldandslow · « **Reply #1 on:** May 25, 2011, 04:04:45 AM »

I have no idea what the voters were thinking but this forum member says anyone that thinks business pay taxes needs to rethink that little deal. The consumer pays taxes. The business may actually send a check to Uncle Sam for taxes but it's cost is includes in the price f their product. If ExxonMobil actually has their tax rate increased you will pay for it in increased prices of gasoline, diesel, lubricating oils, and any other product they make.

As far as Medicare keeping Grandma in the nursing home: They don't. They will pay for a few days while she recuperates from an illness and then she's on her own. She can pay for it out of her pocket or get on state medicaid if she's broke enough.

magooch · « **Reply #2 on:** May 25, 2011, 05:58:38 AM »

The last time I looked, big oil pays enormous taxes to the federal government. As a matter of fact, the governments--state and federal--make more from oil and gasoline than big oil.

As far as a Dumycrat being elected in New York--big wow. I guess that means that Medicare will be fine.

gypsyman · « **Reply #3 on:** May 25, 2011, 06:20:16 AM »

Anybody that thinks that big business doesn't pass these tax increase's on to the consumer is living in a dream world. They couldn't stay in business if they didn't. And, what that means is, the consumer is paying more, plus a higher rate in sales tax also. A widget that maybe costs $5, and sales tax rate is 6%, your paying $5.30. Company has to raise the price of the widget $6, to cover higher corporate tax, and sales tax is now .36. Now the consumer is paying $6.36. Company is still making their profit to stay in business, govt. pulled in an extra $1.06. Who paid the extra, consumer, thats who.
And, as far as govt. taking care of grandma, that's what kids are for. My brother and I took care of both our parents till they died. No govt hand outs. Thats the way it should be. gypsyman

magooch · « **Reply #4 on:** May 25, 2011, 06:35:08 AM »

My plan is not to be a burden to my government, or my kids.

mechanic · « **Reply #5 on:** May 25, 2011, 07:20:23 AM »

People can "pollytic" all they want, but the real truth is, this country is broke. If they took ALL the income from the so called rich, they couldn't settle this debt. If it's not dealt with now, it will only get worse. Playing democrat against republican won't fix it.

If they don't do something to fix this, we have at best a few years, and more likely a few months before we find out what happens when the US becomes insolvent.

Just to pay back what we owe, comes to over $47,000 per citizen, not worker but citizen. To pay the "unfunded mandates" like SSI and medicare plus myriad other, is an unfathomable number.

Best to all,

Ben

powderman · « **Reply #6 on:** May 25, 2011, 02:03:28 PM »

HEH. New York electing a dem?? Real shocker. POWDERMAN.

lakota · « **Reply #7 on:** May 25, 2011, 03:16:15 PM »

Keep hope alive because there will definatley be CHANGE come 2012

srussell · « **Reply #8 on:** May 25, 2011, 03:25:24 PM »

Quote from: lakota on May 25, 2011, 03:16:15 PM

Keep hope alive because there will definatley be CHANGE come 2012

that you can count on

squirrellluck · « **Reply #9 on:** May 25, 2011, 04:02:52 PM »

Interesting. Dem got 47 %, rep got 43% and teaparty got 9%. According to my math 52% of the voters didn't like the dem

dukkillr · « **Reply #10 on:** May 25, 2011, 06:17:05 PM »

I've said it before, I'll say it again. There's conservatives who mean it, and then there's a whole pile of conservatives who mean it right up until you start looking to making cuts in their social programs.

Democrats have aligned themselves as being pro-New Deal programs, and Republicans generally against, at least in their traditional form. Older Conservatives will bail ship and vote for a Democrat if they think their monthly paycheck is going to be effected. It's just a fact.

Lost Farmboy · « **Reply #11 on:** May 25, 2011, 06:41:37 PM »

The last domino to fall is the constitutional republic. Their falling faster and faster.

LunaticFringeInc · « **Reply #12 on:** May 26, 2011, 01:30:38 AM »

Quote from: gypsyman on May 25, 2011, 06:20:16 AM

Anybody that thinks that big business doesn't pass these tax increase's on to the consumer is living in a dream world. They couldn't stay in business if they didn't. And, what that means is, the consumer is paying more, plus a higher rate in sales tax also. A widget that maybe costs $5, and sales tax rate is 6%, your paying $5.30. Company has to raise the price of the widget $6, to cover higher corporate tax, and sales tax is now .36. Now the consumer is paying $6.36. Company is still making their profit to stay in business, govt. pulled in an extra $1.06. Who paid the extra, consumer, thats who.

That's a concept that Liberals just don't comprehend, which is why liberalism should be classified as a incurable mental illness

ironglow · « **Reply #13 on:** May 26, 2011, 02:44:57 AM »

Squirrelluck had the situation dead on...
I predicted the situation right here on GBO, just a couple days before the election.
http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=7099;area=showposts;start=30

I live just a few miles outside that district. . The congressman was was in that seat just last term (Tom Reynolds) is a personal friend of mine.
That is a basically, conservative district..but some voters are still not very observant or analytical. Jack Davis, the Democrat's selected "spoiler' did his job well. Davis has been a lifelong Democrat but for this election he pretended to be an independent and hired professional campaigners to come in from Massachusetts to "till the garden" so to speak.
Davis even claimed to be 'Tea Party' , even though none of the TP regulars wanted anything to do with him. He had one fellow claim to be a Tea party boss ..then endorse Jack Davis. I guess nobody has yet copywritten the Tea Party name !
His 9% would have almost entirely went to the GOP candidate, nmaking about a 5% win for Corwin. The national Democrats poured millions in behind Hochul, even though she disavowed many of Obama's ideas (she had to).
People in the know locally, view it not as a Democrat win or Republican loss...but more as the lightly informed voter especially, saying " I don't want either major party". Many of the voters are lightly informed...

The Dems touted this as a "win" for Obamacare because the big vote in the senate yesterday..they needed it..and spent many millions, plus financing a "stalking horse" campaign to do it .

The big lesson is to conservative voters is, watch out for Democrats pretending to be "independents"..."wolves in sheep's clothing"..

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #14 on:** May 26, 2011, 03:20:08 AM »

Can't help but think iof we still run the country like the founding fathers did where would we be ? Only land owners voting , would the nanny state exist ?

beerbelly · « **Reply #15 on:** May 26, 2011, 03:31:36 AM »

Well we have over half of the people in this country getting government assistance in one form or another, including social security. We have all ready passed the tipping point, there is no way to save this country!
While I don't consider SS welfare, we paid into it and the government borrowed the money to give to the poor, so now SS is in trouble. But it matters not in the not so long term this country is doomed!

Gary G · « **Reply #16 on:** May 26, 2011, 05:03:02 AM »

Junior, whether you know it or not, you want oil companies to make good profits. They plow about 70% back into exploration and development. Without that, (as when the government takes it away), the unintended consequence is that we pay more at the pump. Prices are determined by supply and demand (and the value of a depreciating dollar). On average, they are making 6-8 cents per gallon. Gasoline taxes are $.40 to .80 depending on the state.

ironglow · « **Reply #17 on:** May 26, 2011, 05:29:34 AM »

Quote from: SHOOTALL on May 26, 2011, 03:20:08 AM

Can't help but think iof we still run the country like the founding fathers did where would we be ? Only land owners voting , would the nanny state exist ?

...

Shootall;
Our nation's founders were very wise men..

Junior1942 · « **Reply #18 on:** May 26, 2011, 05:35:35 AM »

None of you seem to know the difference between an oil production company and a gasoline refining company. They are seldom the same company. One pays little taxes beyond property taxes on its wells, and the other one is overloaded with taxes. Making one pay income taxes on its enormous profits would have little to nothing to do with the consumer price of the other one's product. The price of the crude oil delivered to a refinery is determined by Wall Street, not by the income taxes paid by the well owners--if they paid income taxes, that is.

ironglow · « **Reply #19 on:** May 26, 2011, 05:38:50 AM »

Doesn't matter Junior...additional taxes keep coming back to the retail customer.. Any added tax to them, comes out of you and I...

Gary G · « **Reply #20 on:** May 26, 2011, 05:44:06 AM »

Junior knoweth (not)

Quote

None of you seem to know the difference between an oil production company and a gasoline refining company. They are seldom the same company.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_oil_refineries#United_States

billy_56081 · « **Reply #21 on:** May 26, 2011, 08:38:25 AM »

Darn it Gary those facts you pointed out weren't on the liberal ipad talking point app. That is pretty low down and sneaky to fight a liberals emotional blather with facts.

ironglow · « **Reply #22 on:** May 26, 2011, 08:43:55 AM »

Yeah Gary;

You know how liberals hate those stubborn things !

Junior1942 · « **Reply #23 on:** May 26, 2011, 10:22:30 AM »

Quote from: Gary G on May 26, 2011, 05:44:06 AM

Junior knoweth (not)
Quote
None of you seem to know the difference between an oil production company and a gasoline refining company. They are seldom the same company.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_oil_refineries#United_States

Like I said, oil producers are not necessarily gasoline producers.

jimster · « **Reply #24 on:** May 26, 2011, 10:55:05 AM »

Quote

The last time I looked, big oil pays enormous taxes to the federal government.

Yep, they do...big write up on this in our local paper a couple weeks ago, confirmed numbers by the IRS...also told about the money they lose in trying to deal with regulations as well...losing 4 billion dollars just recently after spending this on equipment to get oil out of the ground while waiting a couple years for the "paper work" to get done to actually drill for it...they were turned down...after investment...4 billion down the tubes again. Anyways...people think taxing them more will help them at the pump, pretty much brain dead people I guess.
The feds take in over 2 trillion in taxes...you would be surprised at what percentage is from the oil companies...A LOT! People begging for more taxes to be paid by the wealthy pay nothing and use government services...go figure.

And....Walmart makes more on the dollar than the oil companies do as well. The oil companies are often made out to be the bad guys...bad guys are in government actually.

Far as electing a Dem to office, should be no surprise, that has been happening for 6 decades and Dem's have held power in congress most of that and although it got people 14 trillion in debt, they are too stupid to to vote another way...go figure. Nobody ever said American voters would be very smart.

ironglow · « **Reply #25 on:** May 26, 2011, 05:45:33 PM »

The oil companies testified before congress that they make about 7 cents profit on each gallon of gas; The government rakes off over 60 cents per gallon. Now who is ripping off the American people ?

OldSchoolRanger · « **Reply #26 on:** May 26, 2011, 06:49:15 PM »

Quote from: magooch on May 25, 2011, 05:58:38 AM

As far as a Dumycrat being elected in New York--big wow. I guess that means that Medicare will be fine.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but medicare as you know it has been changed. It was already gutted by the Obama health care law. You just won't feel it for a while. Meanwhile the Democrats are using the scare tactic of Republicans changing medicare, and putting "gramps" into the street, while in reality, the Republicans are trying to restore medicare back to the way it was, providing for "gramps" to get coverage.

For more information, read the article: "Who ended 'Medicare As We Know It"?

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/opedcolumnists/who_ended_medicare_as_we_know_it_raxcMMv2SRVw4G73ZjCxZO

beerbelly · « **Reply #27 on:** May 27, 2011, 06:06:45 AM »

The democrats set the social security trap and the republicans jumped right in it! I believe they will pay dearly for trying to be honest with the people.

ironglow · « **Reply #28 on:** May 28, 2011, 01:21:56 AM »

Unfortunately, Beerbelly is correct here, in these issues..being totally honest can hurt. the ones who lie most (in this case, the Democrats) can gain.
Obama has already stolen $500,000,000,000 worth of benefits from Medicare..but Medicare recipients (mostly retirees) still pay the same premiums..or even a bit more.
Then Obama GIVES the $500,000,000,000 to medicaid, people who pay no premiums and many Medicaid have never worked..and some of which are young & healthy...and STILL WON"T WORK ..

Some call that, "spreading the wealth"... others call it communism.

ironglow · « **Reply #29 on:** May 28, 2011, 04:27:36 AM »

True; the oil companies make great profit on just 7 cents per gallon. Of course there is some small risk involved, the oil companies could conceiveably have a tanker incident, a well blowout, such as with BP etc. but they usually do OK. The govt on the other hand, gets their hugely excessive 60 cents per gallon WITHOUT ANY risk...just suck up the money. The oil companies on the other hand must answer to their stockholders while the govt squanders the almost 900% greater profits..and answers only to politicians who are each waiting to suck up their share of the money they rip off us fuel buyers !