New Reloader, Old Questions

[FWiedner]

... and yes, I read the definitive thread.

I've been saving stuff up for 30 years, because I 'might' start reloading.  Figured I'd get started by cleaning up and prepping a pile of brass.

I've got enough brass in several calibers that I figure it'll be worth my time to purchase a good tumbler, media, cleaning and polishing potions, etc.

But I'm confused on a couple of elementary points, and keep in mind that I've not yet even mounted my press onto my workbench yet so I'm not quite sure how that contraption works yet.  I've done some reading, but that's about it.

Here's my first question ever about the reloading process, which has to do with prepping brass for cleaning.

Do I need to punch the dead primers out of the old brass first before I clean the brass?  That's called 'decapping', right?

Seems like that would be the best way, but I don't know, so I'm asking.

I have a Lee single stage press (that's been in a box for 20 years) and last night I was reading the instructions that came with it, and from my reading the "decapping' die also does the full length resizing of the brass, or have I mis-unstood what I read?

If I have to run the brass through a sizing die to decap, that means I have to lube the cases before I clean them, which just seems not quite right.

Anyway, I want to decap a bunch of old brass and get it cleaned up.

Where do I start?

Thanks for your help.

 

[guzzijohn]

I prefer to tumble mine after decapping and resizing. You are correct that the same die does both at the same time. Keep in mind that you will use very little lube per casing. I just give them a quick wipe down after going through the die and then put them in the tumbler. That way empty primer hole gets cleaned too. Just be sure the primer hole is clear of cleaning media when you take them out. If the brass is dirty enough to be abrasive to the die I wipe them down by hand before going into the die. The other reason I like to resize first is that if a neck is going to split or something it will more likely show up after resizing and is easier to see after being tumbled. My .02 worth, your mileage may very.
GuzziJohn

[FWiedner]

Thanks.

That at least gives me some confidence that I'm reading and understanding the instructions correctly.

 

[FWiedner]

Another question, this one is about tumbler media.

What are the differences or advantage from one to the other between walnut and corn-cob media?

Which cleans best, which polishes best, and is there more of an advantage buying treated media or adding cleaners or polish into untreated media?

Maybe just depends on how much is used?  A how cost effective is it type of thing?

I read that walnut is kinda dusty if you don't wet it down and that corn cob is static-y.


Thanks.
 

[huntducks]

First of all are you doing rifle or pistol?

This is for a rifle case

I tumble mine first then deprime if i'm FL (full length sizing) I use imperial case wax if you use the spray on buy a RCBS stuck case remover before you start try to get very little lube on the case neck or you will have dimples a little in the case mouth is fine ( I use a Q-tip for that) and do about every 5-7 cases makes the ball go in and out easier.

After I deprime if FL I measure the cases and trim if needed, then I use a RCBS case mate clean primer pocket and chamfer inside outside of necks bullets seat a lot easier and straighter.

As far as tumbler media I use corn cob both fine and medium i'll add either chrome polish or nu-car wax the liquid type make sure you run your tumbler for 20-30 min to mix in the wax or it will stick in your cases and be a PIA to get out.

Put a dryer sheet in your tumbler gets rid of that static stuff.

[res45]

I determine how I tumble my brass by the condition of the brass itself,if it dirty as in range pickup or has crud on the outside of the brass that will get in my resizing die I tumble it first before resizing and depriming.

For my personal brass that's relatively clean due to where I shoot and that doesn't have to be lubed to resize like stright wall pistol case that use carbide dies I tumble it with the primer in,for brass that I have to use lube on to resize the cases I always throw it back into the tumbler  to remove the lube before loading,if any media gets into the flashhole it's removed when I clean the primer pockets. 

One media,walnut is more abrasive than corn cob it will do a better job of cleaning dirty brass but it can be a bit dusty and some of the treated walnut can leave a lot of crud inside your brass. Walnut will clean your brass well but it doesn't put the shine on brass like the cob media does some don't mind that but I like the bling.  I mainly use walnut for cleaning dirty range brass that I pick up and do my final polishing with corn cob,probably 95% of my brass just gets tumbled in corn cob media.

You can add strips of used dryer sheet to either the walnut or corn cob media to help remove the dust and other crude the media  takes off the brass it will help keep you media cleaner and last longer and work better,just put new strips in when the old ones get to dirty to be affective any longer.  You can add polish to both types media as well,I buy plain walnut and cob at the pet store and ad a couple cap fulls of NuFinish car polish to the media when I first fill the tumbler and let it run about 15 min. before adding the brass I just add another cap full as need usually about ever third or so batch of brass.  Dillion and Frankford Arsenal also make a good brass polish if you choose to add some to your media.

 

[Graybeard]

If they are real nasty like most range pick up brass or stuff that's been stored for 30 years I prefer to tumble them generally in treated walnut hull media first. Then I spray RCBS lube on from the pump bottle and size/deprime them.

Then they go back into my other tumbler with corn cob media. they come out nice and shiny and clean as can be. That way I don't have the messy chore of removing the lube which I absolutely refuse to do by hand. I have arthritis in my hands quite badly and I just can't use a rag to clean many at a time until my hands ache so badly I have to stop.

There is a special decap die you can buy that doesn't require cases be lubed to use and some folks use that so the primers are out the first time in the tumbler. I've never bothered with that as it seems an extra step since ya gotta run them thru the sizer anyway so I just deprime then.

[FWiedner]

This is everything I needed to know about the step I'm working on right now.

Thanks a million for your help, Guys.

 

[mdi]

If you are gonna size when you decap, you might need more info. Google "full length sizing" and/or "neck sizing vs full length sizing" and you'll get a bunch of info about sizing your brass. Personally I clean everything first, in a wobbler, with plain old corncob nuttin' added http://www.drillspot.com/products/499763/econoline_526020g-40_40_lbs_blast_media, and inspect/sort when clean.

[GH1]

I use walnat lizard bedding in my rotary tumbler, it works well and is inexpensive.  I tumble with the spent primers in the cases so I don't have to worry about tumbling media being caught in the flash hole. I load for .38, .357, and .380 ACP.
GH1

[Lloyd Smale]

pistol brass gets dumped in the tumbler when i get home from shooting and is loaded using carbide dies so it doesnt need to be tumbled afterward. All my rifle brass gets tossed in the tumbler when i get home and is tumbled for maybe an hour before its loaded. After lubing the cases and sizing/depriming i put them in the tumbler for a couple hours to clean the lube off then continue loading. Only exception to this is .223 and 308 and 50 beowolf which i load progressivly. For them i tumble a couple hours  load them and tumble the live rounds long enough to get the lube off. Ive pretty much standardized on walnut. Corn cob may shine a case a bit better but it plugs up small bottle neck cases.

[parkergunshop]

After tumbling cases I use a primer pocket reamer/uniformer to clean and standardize the size of the primer pockets before sizing the cases for reloading, any media that will plug the case necks on smaller calibers will definately plug a primer pocket and cause inconsistent ignition.  I don't tumble again after resizing, just wipe the lube off with a paper towel, then hand prime before charging and seating bullets.

This is a benchrest shooters technique.

But case cleaning is cosmetic in nature, adds little to nothing to the performance.    Case trimming, neck sizing vs full length sizing, sorting cases by brand/weight all have much more effect on performance and accuracy.

If you buy nickel brass the need for case cleaning is basically gone.

[Dand]

I bought a tumbler to clean brass before sizing  and decapping it to protect the sized die from dirt and wear.  Also, decap and size after tumbling helps assure the primer pocket and flash hole aren't plugged with tumbling media. But it means I need to clean out primer pockets.  For primer pockets I use a Lee tool for that on small batches  or my RCBS Trim Mate with Hornady primer pocket bit for big batches.  I am using walnut media. HTH

[noylj]

I use a Lee Universal Decapping die. When I come back from the range, I sort, inspect, and deprime all my brass.
I tumble in nothing but 20/40 corn. This grit size does not clog up the primer pocket or lodge in the flash hole.
Even if some grit did get into the flash hole, it would be knocked out when I size my brass.
I have never seen any advantage to doing any more "cleaning."
All you should do is wipe off the case exterior to eliminate any grit/dirt/dust that might scratch your sizing die or the case.
Anything beyond that is done to make the reloader happy and will not make any difference on target.
Read some reloading manuals and don't listen to those who are suffering from OCD.

[LaOtto222]

I have both a vibratory cleaner and a tumbler. I keep walnut media in the vibratory cleaner and corn cob in the tumbler. When the cases are really dirty I run them through the vibrating cleaner. When they are not so bad, I run them through the tumbler. I have a lid for the vibratory cleaner to keep the dust down and of course the tumbler is enclosed.

I run the cases through one or the other depending on their condition. I then remove the primer with a special die for this purpose in a cheap Lee press. I check the cases for imperfections at this point. If I can, I try not to lube by using carbide dies or using Lee neck collet dies. If I do have to lube for neck sizing or full length sizing, I use a pad and RCBS Case Lube II. The lube is water soluble so I do not have to wipe down the case or rerun the cases through cleaning media again. I can use the lube for the inside of the necks too, since it will rinse out. I apply it to the inside of the neck with a Q-tip or scrap it along the pad to pick up lube in the inside of the neck. I dump the cases in a small bucket and the run warm water in on them and swish with my hands for a couple of minutes. Warm water will evaporate quicker than cold and it feels better on my hand. I then lay them out on a towel to dry over night. If I am in a big hurry, I put them in an old cake pan and put them in the oven for 30 minutes or so at 180 degrees to dry them out. Just make sure they are dry when you start the priming and case charging cycles. I look at the primer hole, if there is no water in the hole, I then check a few cases inside with a flash light. If every thing looks good; I start priming.

BTW I use RCBS Case Lube II for forming cases out of bigger cases. I have made 221 Fireball cases out of 223's for instance when I could not get 221 cases. I have never stuck a case with this lube, but have dented shoulders when too much is used. A little goes a long ways. When I re-lube the pad, I put a little on the middle of the pad and work it around with a piece of single thickness cardboard or 60# paper. I make it even across the whole surface of the pad. When it is right, there will be a very thin layer on the whole surface of the pad. If there is too much, I scrape it off. It takes a little practice, but it is not too difficult to master. If nothing else you can scrape the pad, wash the pad and start over or apply a little more lube, which ever the case maybe. A little lube goes a long ways. If I start running the case in the die and if I start to feel the case drag, I back out immediately and lube again. Heavy pressure is normal when full length sizing or reforming but the case going into the die should feel smooth during the stroke, not draggy. I use a single stage press, because I have better feel with what is going on in the die. This applies to seating bullets as well as sizing. When the pad gets nasty from dirt and burnt powder, I wash it with plain water and dish soap, rinse and let dry, re-lube; it is as good as new and ready to go.

Good Luck and Good Shooting

[Dezynco]

I lube and decap my bottle neck cartridges first, then run them through the tumbler to clean them and remove the case lube.  If the cartridges are gonna be loaded on my Dillon, I use a universal decapper in the first postion to clear the flash holes.  If I plan on loading on my single stage press, I inspect each primer pocket to be sure there's no media in the flash hole, and if there is any I use something pointy like a small nail or drill bit to pick it clean.  I very seldom clean the primer pockets on any of my brass.

[FWiedner]

I took a big cross-section of the fine advice offered here, and here's what I did for my first "batch".

I bought an RCBS vibratory and put treated walnut media in it.  I tumbled several batches of .356Win and .357Mag brass in batches of 100 and 150 each, for (350) .356Win and (1050) .357Mag.  They look OK.  Not new, but not bad.

So far I've decapped and resized about 600 of the .357Mag.  I've got a single stage Lee Challenger press (one of the old ones) and because of the volume, this is quite a chore, LOL.  I used a little RCBS primer pocker tool to get some of the carbon residue out of the ones I've handled.  I didn't have to lube the .357's because I found out that I have a carbide resizing die.

Even though I tumbled the cases I've decapped so far, they look like the still have a minimal amount of carbon inside of them.  I wouldn't think this would matter as log as it's not obstructive, but there is also... what is it, jewleler's rouge?... from the treated walnut in the tumbler.

I've still got to do the .356Win cases, and I've opted for the RCBS spray lube in the little pump bottle "Case Slick".  I reckon I'll just lay 50 or 100 at a time in a cake pan, hose 'em down, roll 'em over and repeat, and then run 'em through the decapping/resizing die.

I've still got like 1000 .357Mag that need to be cleaned, and then there's the .30-30, .308, and .45-70.  I'm not sure I'm going to do the .30-06 or .223.  I guess I could pace myself.

Geez, I wanted to have some fun and relax doing a little reloading.  You know, a gentleman of the shooting sports...

This is hard work.

LOL 

[huntswithdogs]

I've always liked tumbling my brass with the old primers still in place. I did it the other way once and spent too much time trying to poke out the pieces of media stuck in the pockets. If the cases are pertty dirty or nasty, I've been known to load up the tumbler, turn it on and go to work. Leave it running all day and you can get some shiney brass!
When using a spray type lube, I set my cases in a reloading tray and spray them at an angle, making sure I get a little inside the case necks. Give them a spritz, turn the tray, etc. After resizing, I wipe them down and inspect each case. Then I clean the pockets if they're too bad and check the length.  After all that....LET THE LOADING BEGIN!

HWD