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Author Topic: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?  (Read 1527 times)

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Offline mattri

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Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« on: August 11, 2011, 05:40:50 PM »
Do H&R barrels chambered in 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?  If not, what are they?
Thanks, Matt. 
 
 
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Offline geezerbiker

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #1 on: August 11, 2011, 05:59:23 PM »
The .45 Colt should be .451 and the .45-70 is .457".  I say should be because with Handi rifles, they're often a couple thousandths oversize...

Tony
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Offline cowboyup453

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #2 on: August 11, 2011, 06:53:12 PM »
Quote from: geezerbiker on August 11, 2011, 05:59:23 PM
The .45 Colt should be .451 and the .45-70 is .457".  I say should be because with Handi rifles, they're often a couple thousandths oversize...

Tony
What he said. ;)
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Offline knight0334

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #3 on: August 11, 2011, 06:53:52 PM »
They don't, and they shouldn't be. 

45 caliber handguns(Colt & Schofield) are supposed to be .450"bore and .452"-.454"groove. 
45 caliber rifles are supposed to be .450" bore and .457"-.459" groove.   
45GAP, 45ACP, and 45AutoRim are supposed to be .450" bore and .451" groove.

The groove on my 45Colt is .452" +/- .001.     The groove on both of my 45-70's and my 45-120 is .458"-.459".  The bore on both, 45Colt and 45-70/120 are .450".

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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2011, 07:57:58 PM »
I've dropped .452" jacketed bullets clean thru a couple of my 45-70 barrels, in another it stopped about half way, didn't force it any further tho.

Tim
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Offline bikerbeans

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #5 on: August 12, 2011, 04:05:04 AM »
Quote from: quickdtoo on August 11, 2011, 07:57:58 PM
I've dropped .452" jacketed bullets clean thru a couple of my 45-70 barrels, in another it stopped about half way, didn't force it any further tho.

Tim

I think the last 45-70 barrel is the full choke model. ::)
 
BB
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Offline tobster

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #6 on: August 12, 2011, 04:47:31 AM »
Or the rumor is true that most  gun builders measure with a micrometer and the boys at Remington use tape measures.
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #7 on: August 12, 2011, 05:39:18 AM »
Quote from: bikerbeans on August 12, 2011, 04:05:04 AM
Quote from: quickdtoo on August 11, 2011, 07:57:58 PM
I've dropped .452" jacketed bullets clean thru a couple of my 45-70 barrels, in another it stopped about half way, didn't force it any further tho.

Tim

I think the last 45-70 barrel is the full choke model. ::)
 
BB

Dropped em from the muzzle, every H&R barrel I've slugged is more open at the muzzle by ~.0005" than the breech end, likely due to not being stress relieved.

Tim
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Offline Catshooter45

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #8 on: August 12, 2011, 06:54:46 AM »
 The only way to find out a bore diameter is to measure it.  They can vary, a lot.
 
I have .45 ACP weapons that run from just barely .451 to .456+.
 
This is true for any bore, not just Handis.
 
 
Cat
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Offline knight0334

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #9 on: August 12, 2011, 07:07:06 AM »
Quote from: quickdtoo on August 11, 2011, 07:57:58 PM
I've dropped .452" jacketed bullets clean thru a couple of my 45-70 barrels, in another it stopped about half way, didn't force it any further tho.

Tim

WoW!  Thats seriously messed up!  A .452" bullet shouldn't even engage without force in a .458 caliber gun.   There should be at least .002" of swaging to the rifling, .001" into the radius of the bullet.

Maybe I'm just fortunate enough to got some spec-on barrels.   Which might explain why I've had such luck in accuracy on my .458" guns.

Here is a Hunter's Supply .250gr FP  mic'd to .452" on top of my 45-70 Handi and my .45-120 BC.   My .45-70 BC is out at the farm to get a photo of it.


 

Here is a old .230gr FMJ .451" bullet for my 1911 on my Handi and 45-120.

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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #10 on: August 12, 2011, 10:27:33 AM »
One man's "messed up" is another's "pride and joy"!!! ;D Top target was shot from one of the .452" drop thru barrels(scoped BC) at 100yds with 350gr Hornadys, the other drop thru barrel was my 45-120, target was shot at 200yds, 525gr Beartooth Piledriver at ~1800fps, FP-Tk sight adjustment after the high shot since I had just moved from the 100yd targets and just took a WAG at the elevation adjustment.

Tim

 
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Offline knight0334

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #11 on: August 12, 2011, 10:35:03 AM »
Sorry man..   ...I didn't mean your guns are messed up, just the thought of such variances in H&R's barrels.   I mean no disrespect to your guns. :)

I've got other guns at of spec that shoot just fine too.
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #12 on: August 12, 2011, 03:13:42 PM »
No offense taken, facts is facts!!  ;D As you stated, the SAAMI spec is .450" +/- .002" if you measure .452" bullets, you'll find they're about .0005" undersize at .4515" which puts the bore within spec. New broaches(buttons) will cut a bigger bore than broaches that are used and have been resharpened, otherwise they'd have a lot less useful service life and our Handis would cost a lot more than they do.  :'(

Tim
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Offline Catshooter45

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #13 on: August 13, 2011, 10:47:50 AM »
Those are some sweet groups Tim.
 
 
Cat
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Do the 45 Colt and 45-70 have the same bore diameter?
« Reply #14 on: August 13, 2011, 11:09:03 AM »
Thanks, some of my good days!  ;)

Tim
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