Kentucky Historical Society - Military History Museum

[Cannoneer]

I saw this yesterday on C-SPAN, and it made me wonder just how many similar treasures might be housed in small museums across this country? The British three pounder is not only a beauty, but also has an incredible provenance.  Does anyone have any opinions on the appearance of the vent of this 3-pdr?

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/MilitaryHi

Click on "SIGNATURE STORIES" then click on cannon pic
http://www.history.ky.gov/military/

http://historicmonroe.org/ky/kentucky-prevails/index.htm

[Artilleryman]

I think the vent was made to hold loose powder if a quill was not available.  The carriage does not really go with the time period of the barrel, and was probably made in more recent times by someone without the benefit of Don Lutz's drawings.

Thanks for posting.  It was interesting material.

[oltom]

thank you!...i think mom and i may just visit next time i go 'home' to visit her........we always want to have something 'to do'
we haven't visited KY history stuff in a good while!
and as any good 'ridge runner' would say......frankfort is only a days journey from the house!

[IvarForkbeard]

Hmmmmm volley gun huh?
 

[Artilleryman]

I believe Kentucky has an original Williams gun in its collection.

[Cannoneer]

I can't really tell by looking at the vid of the "Burgoyne Gun", even though I paused it to try and get a better view, but something just doesn't seem right about that touch-hole. This gun also shows (unfortunately) another instance of a bronze gun being kept in a polished state. You can still make out the ring on the cascabel knob, but it is definitely getting worn away.
Of course you're right about the carriage, Norm; that barrel would have originally been mounted on a flask trail carriage. The narrator said that the original carriage was burned in a fire that occurred at the original arsenal in 1836, and the current carriage was constructed by "workers" at the state penitentiary.

I don't know all that much about Civil War era volley guns, but if this article is relaying the correct information on the one seen in the video, then the narrator is very misinformed about the operation of that weapon.

http://www.floridareenactorsonline.com/machinegun.htm

[exlimey]

My sentiments to on the vent, very strange. For a Verbruggen Lt 3 pdr not to have his engraving on the breech ring is iffy to; perhaps an American period copy !  It has the look of a well used 3pdr now a 4 pdr.

[Cannoneer]

exlimey,
I didn't mean to imply that I think the "Burgoyne Gun" isn't the genuine article, because with the timeline of its history known, I'd say that it is fairly certain that it's British made. I just think that the vent field may have been altered.
I'm going to send an email to Trevor Jones, and ask (among other things) if there are any decipherable marks remaining on the barrel.   

[guardsgunner]

I wonder why the narrator did not mention the "iconic" Ky. Williams gun? Williams was from Ky. and formed a Ky. battery (csa). Making it even more "ICONIC" is the fact that their Williams was captured by a Captian of the 14th Ky. Inf. (us) who stole it out of a Rebel camp at night.
Go figure.
 

[Cannoneer]

They only had that short time allotment from C-SPAN, so he probably chose a few of his favorite objects to showcase. You can see all those throw cloths covering up artifacts; I wonder what other 'good stuff' is being kept under wraps there until the remodelling at the Arsenal Museum Bldg. is completed?
I'll ask Mr. Jones for some history on their 'Williams gun' when I send an email, and maybe he'll even be kind enough to attach a few photos when/if he responds.   

[guardsgunner]

This is a re-union photo of thier williams gun.
 
 
 
 
http://freepages.military.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~us14thkyinfantry/photo/reunion.html

[Cannoneer]

Thanks guardsgunner, that's some good information to have, and I seem to recall that photograph too, I also think that it was originally posted on the board by you. Now, equipped with this info, maybe I can fool Mr. Jones into thinking that I'm halfway knowledgeable about CW ordnance.
I wonder if the gun is still mounted on that same carriage?

[guardsgunner]

Sorry for re-posting the link.
 
If it is on the same carriage, I will go see it.
 
Bob

[Cannoneer]

Bob,
Sorry for what? My thanks were sincere, I remembered the photo when I saw it again, but I certainly didn't remember the text.
I kind of doubt that it's going to be on that carriage, but we'll find out.


Now I've really got to get off this PC for awhile, before my wife literally throws a coniption fit.

[Swampman]

I've been there.

[Cannoneer]

But we love and need them; don't we?

[GLS]

Just got back into town.  As a kid back in the 60's I remember when a lot of the KY collection was just laying around everywhere (old style museum). Us kids would climb all over it and root through the piles of stuff.  The museum display now is compact but has all kinds of unique stuff including one of the largest Thompson machine gun collections.  I remember years ago an expert on Gatling guns stated in his book that there was no example left of a certain model for which I wrote him and told him to go see that non existant model at the KY museum complete and still in working condition (the museum has several Gatlings).  The entire collection is large and most is not on display.  I have tried in the past to see some of the other good stuff to no avail.  Maybe Trevor will be more helpful.  The armoury where this stuff is stored goes deep down into a cave system under the building.  Since my home is only 35 miles away from Frankfort, it is time to revisit and see what other old cannons they may have.

[Cannoneer]

I had a rewarding conversation with Trevor Jones this morning, and he pleasantly answered a few questions that I posed to him.

There is a steel vent insert (bouche) on the British bronze 3-pdr, but there's no documentation as to when, or why this was done. I suggested that it may have been installed sometime in the latter 1800's, or early 1900's, perhaps in preparation of firing the piece to celebrate, or honor some anniversary etc.
The only mark remaining on the tube is the English broad arrow, no other marks exist. He informed me that the gun is still polished (fairly obvious) as a regular maintenance procedure; and I told him that this was a controversial practice, which a vast majority of artillery collection curators do not presently follow.

The 'volley gun' is in excellent condition, except for the fact that one barrel is missing. This is entirely anecdotal according to Mr Jones, but the story is that sometime post Civil War, someone at the arsenal removed the barrel to use it as a fireplace poker, and it then got lost.

The 'Williams Gun' is definitely considered one of the museum's major artifacts, it was simply because of time constraints, that it wasn't shown on the C-Span video.
Open the link and type "williams" in the search box, (upper right corner) in order to view a couple photographs of the gun.     http://history.ky.gov/military/

The museum is going to re-open on November 11, 2011 (Veterans Day) at 2:00 PM.