Author Topic: 35 reminton with pistol bullets for youth deer? (Read 1770 times)

Sharps-Nut · « **on:** September 22, 2011, 04:25:13 PM »

Alright I am ready to be flamed. I am working with my daughter for a upcoming youth deer season. I wanted to start her out with a mild recoiling round. So I selected a 158 grain softpoint pistol bullet and mild charge of a pistol powder. My guess/ estimation is velocity is around 1300-1400 fps. The recoil is just what I wanted mild/very mild. Accuracy was scary, one ragged hole from 30 yards. My question is if our shooting range is going to be 50 yards and less would yor folks be affraid of said load for the hunt itself. I know she cant take a 35 rem factory load, I wont even try it. I can load load back a 200 grain soft point and help but the recoil is still pretty stout for small boney girl. She's got the accuracy down, so I feel very confident in her ability to hit a heart lung shot out to 50 my max range. The 200 grain facotry bullet loaded back will most likely not expand. The 158 grain speer at 1300-1400 might be a little over expanding but .... Opinions. Thoughts? Thanks for honest insight. SN

BBF · « **Reply #1 on:** September 23, 2011, 07:23:06 AM »

I have no experience with pistol bullets in a 35 Rem but have used the Speer 180 gr several times.
Looking at their No 13 Manual two loads would interest me.

Reloader 7 min. 26 gr for 1600 fps to a max. of 30 gr for 1900 fps

SR 4759 min. 18.0 gr for 1500 fps to a max. of 20.0 gr for 1650 fps

You can weigh your rifle, feed the above values into a recoil calculator and compare that with the pistol loads you have tried. Personally I feel better in using a rifle bullet in a rifle.

For comparison Speer loads for a 158 gr pistol bullet lists as the two loads with the least amount of powder:
IMR 3031 min 33.0 gr for 1900 fps and Reloader 7 min 33.0 gr for 2100 fps

I would not be surprised if the free recoil values are similar between the first and second set of loads.

Of course as always, the rifle must group acceptable with any of the above.

45-70.gov · « **Reply #2 on:** September 23, 2011, 07:36:27 AM »

sounds like you have nothing left to do but practice

Sharps-Nut · « **Reply #3 on:** September 24, 2011, 02:59:40 AM »

Thanks for the replies. I guess as long as I have been reloading/ hunting I should not need confirmation as to if something should be ok or not, but I hate to head out to hunt with a questionable load. I may look for some 180 grainers and try them. My "mild" load is about all this boney little girl wants for recoil. But I slipped a hotter load, that was target tested, in on my boys early hunts without him knowing or complaining to ensure a ethical kill. Likely I could do the same for her. Thanks again for the help. SN

Bigeasy · « **Reply #4 on:** September 24, 2011, 03:30:33 AM »

I down load my 358's and 35 Whelen with revolver bullets all the time. Basically, you are looking at the equivalent of a 6 inch 357 mag revolver - plenty for a deer thru the lungs. I would just make sure you use a quality bullet like the XTP, or maybe a Barnes. Your better off with a load she can shoot comfortably, and place her shots, then a more powerful load she may end up flinching with.

Larry

BBF · « **Reply #5 on:** September 24, 2011, 02:51:07 PM »

If you got the time and inclination you could check out the availabilty of suitable cast bullets. Cast bullets in the 200 gr range can be pushed to sufficient velocities.

Example from Lyman#48 Page 265
Mold # 358430 195 gr cast from Alloy#2 (this bullet has a generous meplat)

Powder 2400 Min 15.00 for 1343 fps max 19.5 gr for 1731 fps. from a 22" barrel.

BTW.I am presuming that the stock has been fitted to her with a good pad.

Sharps-Nut · « **Reply #6 on:** September 25, 2011, 05:33:16 PM »

Were thinking about alike, same velocity as a 357. My bullet selection will is as follows 158 grain speer sort points, or 158 grain hornady hollow points, pre xtp. I could go buy some newer bullet designs if it were nessesary, these are just what I got on hand. The gun is not fitted to the shooter. I just cant get myself to chop the stock on this 1966 gun. I do have a woss pad between her and gun. She seems to be able to shoulder it and come up on the scope ok considering its a little long. The shot will be fired from a elevated shooting blind so she will be shooting from a bench same as practice. I would send you a pic of the blind but you sould still be laughting this time tommarow. Hollow point or soft? I am leaning towards the hollow for expansion, but the soft point would be a sure thru and thru. The hollows could over expand due to the juiced velocity? I dont think I will go with cast. I cast and am not anti cast but a 150 grain lyman 4 gang is the only bullet I cast so the jacketed was getting the nod.

schoolmaster · « **Reply #7 on:** September 25, 2011, 06:56:50 PM »

Those soft points will kill a deer dead at 50 yards. Bullet placement is the most important factor. If she is shooting this load well, don't over think it. I just posted on my grandson's success with his .357 mag rifle. He shoots the 158 Remington soft point and has killed two deer out to 58 yards.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #8 on:** September 26, 2011, 03:13:20 AM »

the 35 i put together for my wife has killed hogs and deer with downloaded cast bullets and has killed deer with 158 sierras downloaded. I try to keep them under 1500 fps. If you want a fun load take your 35 and load it with 150 cast bullets and 7 grains of unique. My grandkids absoultely love shooting them and in a pinch i sure wouldnt be afraid to tackle a deer at 50 yards with them. The 15o round flat out of lee mold and 7 grains of unique will shoot a ragged hole at 50 yards out of my marling. you can also do what ive done before to my wife. She is recoil sensitive so i get her out practicing with those 7 grain loads and take the gun and resight it with heavier loads before hunting. Shes shot 2 deer and a pig with 200 grain factory ammo and never noticed the recoil differnce when she was shooting at game. the load i use most for her hunting is the rcbs 200 round flat at about 1600 fps. It has proven itself quite a few times.

yukondog · « **Reply #9 on:** October 01, 2011, 01:04:09 PM »

Sharps-Nut, have you setteled on a load yet? If your looking for soft points and cant find any I have about 50 mixed hornady and nosler [bullets] I would donate to the cause [getting another young hunter started], shoot me a PM.

BBF · « **Reply #10 on:** October 02, 2011, 07:13:49 AM »

There you go................ A Prince of a Dog.

Sharps-Nut · « **Reply #11 on:** October 13, 2011, 06:17:42 PM »

Sorry for being so slow on the response, jobs been eating up all my fun time. They blocked this site, freaking antigunners. Between church, boy scouts and teaching night classes I've been out. Went out and shot again tonight. She is in like flin with the 357 soft point mouse gun load. Streched her from 30 yards to 50 tonight and she did great. I put her on a deer sized target, looks like large photo of a deer so no bullseye. She whacked it right in the boiler room and it was late in the evening, just like the hunt should be. I feel good about her shooting and the load, we just need weather rut and three saturdays to pass to get youth season here. Yukon Dog thanks for the kind offer. Hunting/gun people are some of the best folks around. My speer box has about 50 left so I should be good. Cant tell you how much the offer means. I will post some follow ups on the hunt so you kind folks will know how it turned out. 7 deer were on the bean field the other night, we only need one brave volunteer and for her to keep her head in the game.... 22 days and counting....

BBF · « **Reply #12 on:** October 15, 2011, 12:00:06 PM »

Sharps-Nut:
I haven't gotten past that ill fitting stock. There has got to be a place that has or somebody that can make you a reasonable priced ( pallet wood) butt for that rifle that would fit her without you putting a saw to the original. Perhaps not this season, I presume your female child isn't done after this year, Right?

Sharps-Nut · « **Reply #13 on:** October 24, 2011, 04:37:15 PM »

I cant say if this a one season deal. She may take to hunting she may not. My son did. That was the reason I wanted to start her early. Also the reason she is not shooting the 30-30. Its the gun he hunts with and I will gift it to him at an age he will appreciate it and hopefully cherish it. I want her to be able to take her first deer with a rifle she could "speak for" in the future as hers, the one she shot her first deer with. The girl will most likely get a 336 30-30 as well that will be her hunting rifle, to be gifted to her at an age she will be able to appreciate it and cherish it. My boy got around the to long stock thing, its not ideal but I hate a cut down guns, as young one's are temp, to temp as far as I am concerned. Seems like yesterday he plugged his first deer, it was four years ago.

BBF · « **Reply #14 on:** October 25, 2011, 07:06:25 PM »

I'm going to beat on that horse one more time. If your daughter misses/wounds her deer or thinks she did because of that ill fitting stock and never again goes hunting, you will hate yourself for a long time.

Sharps-Nut · « **Reply #15 on:** October 30, 2011, 02:59:41 AM »

Your a good man Scatterbrain. I like a guy that sticks with his values/beliefs. I will look tonight and see of a youth set is available. Couldn 't hurt, might help, got one more little girl coming thru the ranks. She most likely will shoot her deer with a marlin 336.

BBF · « **Reply #16 on:** October 30, 2011, 04:04:04 AM »

Sharp-Nuts

Consider you have been given a handshake or if you prefer, a pat on the shoulder.

dpe.ahoy · « **Reply #17 on:** October 30, 2011, 06:08:55 AM »

Check here to see if there is a butt stock for sale or wander on over to www.marlinowners.com and check out the for sale section there for a pre-shortened or reg. stock you could cut down. To bad ya didn't do that for your son, woulda had one for the daughter now.

DP

troopermark111 · « **Reply #18 on:** November 09, 2011, 05:15:51 PM »

You could check out the Outers Ramline Cadet rifle stock, they are made shorter than a standard stock. Part number 33608. I have used them, they fit well and are very tough.

BBF · « **Reply #19 on:** November 09, 2011, 06:29:41 PM »

I'm waiting for some results/reports.

Sharps-Nut · « **Reply #20 on:** November 10, 2011, 04:08:14 PM »

I typed up a long complete story of the hunt and darn mi-fi battery died loosing my work. We went my take off stock failed to show up so we went full size. Warm and windy was the weather not exactly ideal. Saturady am hunt we saw 7 deer total, 3 on the firel when we walked in, 4 during the hunt. None within out preset 60 yard window of proficiency. Sat night warm and windy deer appearantly layed up, we never saw a critter. Sunday morning same story warm and windy, no deer. Sunday evening was shaping up for the same, despite seeming like a waste we went. Last of the leagal hunting ours in walks a young doe, east end of the bean field 160 yards away with zero intrest in coming out way. Time was fading so I risked a little doe bleat. She came our way, we like to never stopped her for the shot. 50-60 yards broadside, stopped bang , small jump ran a cicle then walked/trotted to the other end of the field where she came from. Soppped twitcher her tail , went in the timber stood, twitched her tail then disappeared. We gave her a hour just in case we did actually hit her which I doubted. Taking note she stood behind my culti packer I had me a good maker. We looked for two hours any sign of of blood or hit and found nadda. So long story short dad botched it by not buyting the youth set and taking a chance of getting a wood take off stock in on time. Did that cause her to miss, dont know maybe, maybe not. She is still excited about hunting. Regular rifle season is coming up but my small farm I allow a guy at church to hunt. I hunt a buddys place from the ground with no scouting, no blinds, no stands just play the wind and enjoy a old school fair chase wooded encounter. I will take my boy hunting at this place, its just right. Half the time I fall asleep, but I never deer drive, I never take running shots, and always have fun. I dont think its a set up I want to take her to due to the off hand shot situation. If the guy I let hunt my place scores early I will take her back out for some more quality time with dad. I will try and post some pics of our set up, its pretty redneck, but she liked it. Best of all I got to spend some, ok alot of time with her telling her the only boy she can trust is me. SN

BBF · « **Reply #21 on:** November 10, 2011, 06:20:43 PM »

!!

Sharps-Nut · « **Reply #22 on:** December 01, 2011, 12:59:33 PM »

Long time on a follow up but here goes. The deer got smarter as the season went on but I did not. I moved my little girl over to a 257 roberts loaded with 87 grain soft points and a starting charge of blc2. She shot it at home a did great, no more recoil than the 35 but alot more options on distannce. Sunday night, last weekend of deer season, she proved he abilites on a coyote. Darn chicken thief. The next night she shot a mature doe at 140 yards one shot bag flop, sandbags and a good shooting rest is a little girls best friend. She was delighted and the hunt was made double special as that is her granddads old rifle so it will be passed down to her at the appropriate time. I would post pick but does not seem to be within my skill level. SN

BBF · « **Reply #23 on:** December 02, 2011, 09:40:58 AM »

Congrats !! First think I noticed after the little cutie sitting by the deer was that bolt rifle, certainly not a 35 Rem!

Ahem, do I even dare ask about that stock lenght situation?

Sharps-Nut · « **Reply #24 on:** December 04, 2011, 03:13:51 AM »

Dads old rifle. The stock is still, uh official length. Traded one ill fit for another. I told you the deer got smarter but I did not in the post. After the "experience" this year I think I will change things up. I learned alot. Dont order stuff days out from a hunt. Dont count on deer coming in as close as they would if it were just you hunting, and yea get a youth gun. I like the marlins, but may end up buying a youth 243 or something for her and the one coming up. Getting the recoil down and keeping the gun to where it is an ethical killer is a problem with the marlin. The good news is I gave the property a good search after the fisrt encounter and feel very confident we did not wound a deer. Second spot of good news is I did not turn her off of the sport. My youth lenth stock could be put on a 30-30 and that could still happen to keep her in a marlin.