Searching for bullet for 357

[jeff686]

I'm not sure where to look, but thought I'd ask for some help here...

Conditions:

Handi in 16 inches
Silenced (must avoid lead deposits)
Must be subsonic for noise
Bullet profile should be for subsonic ballistics (external and terminal)
Maximize energy/momentum

I am currently loading 180gr Hornady XTP at 1050 fps.  It is the biggest jacketed bullet I can find.

My questions:

Will a cast + gas check still deposit lead in the silencer?  I am ignorant about how this works, and don't know if a gas check will help.  If so, my bullet choices increase significantly.

Can I copper wash or plate cast bullets?  Will this be cost effective, and will it prevent the lead in the silencer?

Can I shoot a 35 cal. bullet in my 357?  Hornady makes a round nose jacketed .358 in 200 and 250 grains. These are not ideal for terminal ballistics, but better than their spire point brothers.  Is this safe?  Is 1:15 at 1050 fps enough to stabilize the bullet?

Other advice or input is welcome.

[keith44]

The trick to shooting cast bullets is to match the alloy to the velocity and pressure.  These have always given me top performance without leading issues:


http://www.laser-cast.com/


give 'em a look

[slowshot]

 I would think ,swaged lead with copper wash (which the old Win Lubaloy's were) would give optimum terminal effect at subsonic vel. and no lead deposits ,probably tough to find in weights over 158 gr,but given the mission does it matter,in fact a double ended wad cutter with it's full caliber meplat is arguably the best choice for terminal ballistics at sub-sonic vel. out to 50 yds at least

[tacklebury]

I'd try something like this from Berry's:
http://www.berrysmfg.com/product-i14489-c13-g8-b0-p0-.38_Cal_158gr_HP.aspx
Quick expansion at lower velocity, copper plated to avoid leading and only slightly more sensitive on loading.  Just need to make sure you get a good seater stem to keep from damaging the tips.    I'm loading the flat point 158 gr. version of these in .38 special.

[LaOtto222]

You might give the Remington 180 semi-jacketed bullets a try. They have a large amount of soft lead exposed and have a thin jacket.

Here are two sources

http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=0005023646250

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/1601149498/remington-bullets-357-magnum-357-maximum-357-diameter-180-grain-semi-jacketed-hollow-point

They will expand at low velocities, not lead your "can" and are relatively inexpensive. I use the 125 grain version for home defense because I want them to readily expand at low velocity and not much recoil.

Good Luck and Good Shooting

[Dinny]

Is the silencer issue really lead build up or it is lube deposits? I have heard both terms used interchangeably in the past. If it's lube, would LLA help the problem any? I have some 230gr bore riding FP lead bullets in .38 cal.  In my .357 Maximum (factory barrel reamed), they shoot through nearly the same hole at 50yds. The velocities were just over 700fps and they have a large meplat that smacks hard. I'm sure they could be pushed a bit faster but I don't know how the accuracy would hold up. I use TB powder and they are already pretty quiet as is. Let me know if you want to try some.


Look on the left for the 230gr Thunderheads.


http://www.pennbullets.com/38/38-caliber.html




Thanks, Dinny

[jeff686]

Is the silencer issue really lead build up or it is lube deposits? I have heard both terms used interchangeably in the past. If it's lube, would LLA help the problem any?

Dinny,

I asked the silencer manufacturer, and they said no cast bullets.  Don't know if it is the lead or lube.  I can't disassemble it for cleaning.

What is LLA?

That Thunderhead is really cool.  Wish I could use it.

[Dinny]

Lee Liquid Alox. It's a type of lubing that is made for bullets with shallow lube grooves. It can be cut with mineral spirits to be thinner. My limited understanding is that a little goes a long way.


I'm just now starting to drift towards the dark side and shooting more cast bullets than jacketed. Seems to me I saw some cast bullets that were coated with something that changed their characteristics to something that more closely performed like a jacketed bullet. Maybe that might work??

http://www.precisionbullets.com/


Sorry, kinda a moot point since they don't offer any 38cal bullets, but that's the idea anyways...


Interesting article: http://www.fastexlubes.com/main.php?doc_id=333&cat_id=4

Thanks, Dinny

[keith44]

either one (lead or lube) would be detrimental to the performance of the silencer, too soft of either alloy or lube and the ports get clogged then all you have is a barrel weight.

[Default_Required]

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/594969/sierra-pro-hunter-bullets-35-caliber-358-diameter-200-grain-round-nose-box-of-50
 
 Might be a choice, 200 gr. and a flatter nose profile while still increasing weight over the 180gr bullets and not going the lead route. Just a thought.
 
  DR

[nanuk-O-dah-Nort]

at subsonic velocities, you do not need a gas check.  they only are needed when you try to push the pressure envelope, or have a poor fitting bullet

as for jamming up a silencer?  I do not personally have experience with one, but I do have interest in the concept, and have read a lot on it.
You will get no buildup of lead, cause the bullets do not touch the silencer.

as for lube, you may get some build up with that depending on the lube itself.  but as you are subsonic, it doesn't take much of a lube to perform well.  Contact White Label Lubes, and ask your questions there.
or you can try the LLA cut with MS.  most folks put it on too thick.  It should dry Non-tacky.   
or search out "Recluse Tumble Lube" using LLA, Johnson Paste wax, and mineral spirits.  drys hard and smooth.  should work well in your application

[ibgp3]

A gas check cleans the inside of a barrel, scraping any lead off as it passes through and blowing it out the end of the barrel.
Since the suppressor is at the end of the barrel, most of what the gas check cleans out of the barrel will be blown into the suppressor. The manufacturer said no lead, and for their purposes, gas checks make lead bullets worse.


Most Heavy hollow points won't expand when started sub-sonic, so invert them and fire a copper clad wad cutter.


Get a .357 sizer and push a jacketed .358 bullet through it. That is the over pressure that happens in your chamber as the bullet enters the rifling. It can be done, but I would think a break open rifle would be the worst place to do it.