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Author Topic: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R  (Read 1648 times)

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Offline kevinsmith5

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If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« on: November 20, 2011, 07:13:24 AM »
This appears to be on one of their standard actions with a special grip. I'd settle for a .22 barrel and a 45 Colt or .357 magnum, but the 45/410 is intriguing.
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/2BRZP4102211BS-1.html
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Offline necchi

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Re: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #1 on: November 20, 2011, 07:59:13 AM »
T/C does it too,
 I guess H&R/NEF wants to make a rifle and not a pistol. Pistols actually enter a whole nuther realm of licence and law. Too even put a pistol grip on a rifle frame changes the classification of the gun.
Wouldn't suprise me if theres a different grip somewhere on the market though.
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Offline kevinsmith5

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If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #2 on: November 20, 2011, 11:44:54 AM »
I want the interchangeable pistol barrels....as a pack gun that looks like a heck of a combination. And those little Contenders from TC cost a pretty (almost gorgeous) penny.
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Offline cwlongshot

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Re: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #3 on: November 20, 2011, 12:19:15 PM »
I may be in the minority, But I have to say,
 
I have ZERO interest in a H&R/HANDI handgun...
 
If I change my mind, and I SOLD the contenders to get the H&R's... I would go back with the Contender .
 
CW
 
CW
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Offline necchi

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Re: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #4 on: November 20, 2011, 12:20:27 PM »
Just another thought Kevin,
 When you shorten a barrel into a common "pistol" barrel length, the twist rate changes for optimum bullet stability. Pistols tend to be a faster twist, and different powders are used for velocity issues. It's all about reasonable accuracy.
Rifle ammo or rifle loads generally don't work well in pistol length barrels and rifle barrels generally don't make good pistols.
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Offline keith44

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Re: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #5 on: November 20, 2011, 12:33:50 PM »
Since H&R was (is) owned by Marlin, and now under the Remington Firearms Corp. there is a long history of long guns production only.  H&R produced budget handguns when it was a stand alone company, but now I see next to no chance of the company (companies) getting into that market.  While I like the Handi Rifles, I will not consider a single shot pistol.
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Offline ratdog

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Re: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #6 on: November 20, 2011, 06:34:57 PM »
i have had the contender with numerous barrels sold those years ago i like revolvers and handy's better but i think h&r could make some shorter barrels i have cut one of mine to 16.50 fun gun you really don't need a long barrel for a pistol caliber. 8)
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Offline wganzWork

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Re: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #7 on: November 22, 2011, 09:37:18 AM »
No dumber than a Taurus Judge and if it sells, who cares.
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Offline manatee1947

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Re: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2011, 10:28:23 AM »
If you cannot get NEF to broaden the caliber selection, anything more is not going to happen. I would love to see 16.5" barrels offered though, that with a youth length stock in synthetic would be great. In a 7.62 X39 it would make a great lightweight  stalking rifle, or in a 35 Rem unless they make the Max again, which is unlikely. Since the barrels are already being cut and crowned anyway, maybe getting some shorties in current calibers would be possible. The actions are just too bulky for a pistol.
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Offline Jimbo47

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Re: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #9 on: November 22, 2011, 11:04:55 AM »
What would be nice is if you could order your accessory barrel cut to 16 1/2" kind of like if you request a trigger job, how much more trouble would it be to cut the barrel and crown it?
 
There of course would be an extra charge, but it's making a few bucks more along with fitting the barrel.
 
I'm sure the guy cutting the barrels or keeping track of them won't like the added work though.
 
Listening Remington guys?
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Offline wganzWork

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Re: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #10 on: November 23, 2011, 09:44:01 AM »
Quote from: Jimbo47 on November 22, 2011, 11:04:55 AM
What would be nice is if you could order your accessory barrel cut to 16 1/2" kind of like if you request a trigger job, how much more trouble would it be to cut the barrel and crown it?
 
There of course would be an extra charge, but it's making a few bucks more along with fitting the barrel.
 
I'm sure the guy cutting the barrels or keeping track of them won't like the added work though.
 
Listening Remington guys?
<speculation>They may not be able to cut the barrel due that changing the specs from what is listed since that would be a different model which requires BATFE approval. This is why Ruger cannot add a .45 ACP cylinder to an existing .45 LC single action since it changes the model. </speculation>
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Offline Jimbo47

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Re: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #11 on: November 23, 2011, 11:26:37 AM »
This wouldn't be any different than when ordering what they have now in accessory barrels like a 22" versus an 18" it's still the same caliber, maybe listed as a different part number so they can figure it out, and nothing is changed but the barrel length as long as it exceeds the BATF minimum length rules what would be the problem?
 
Then again they make the rules, and I'm sure the guys at the factory can give 101 better excuses why they can't do it, but the BATF rule sounds as good as any I guess.
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Offline bighunt

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Re: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #12 on: November 29, 2011, 05:28:01 AM »
Quote from: necchi on November 20, 2011, 07:59:13 AM
T/C does it too,
I guess H&R/NEF wants to make a rifle and not a pistol. Pistols actually enter a whole nuther realm of licence and law. Too even put a pistol grip on a rifle frame changes the classification of the gun.
Wouldn't suprise me if theres a different grip somewhere on the market though.

Making pistols requires no different license than making a rifle.  The only difference is that the Federal Excise Tax on a pistol is 10% and rifles and shotguns are taxed at 11%.  Putting a pistol grip on virgin frame that has never had a shoulder stock on it is perfectly legal and it is classified as a pistol.
 
Taurus and T/C can offer a pistol version of their single shot rifles no problem as long as the frame starts out with a pistol grip attached.  All H&R would have to do is assemble their frames with pistol grips and short barrels and they could jump right into the pistol market no problem. If you could ever talk them out of a bare frame and get documentation from the factory that it was never assembled as a rifle you could build your own handi pistol.
 
But, removing a shoulder stock from an existing rifle and replacing it with a pistol grip and a shorter barrel that is either under 16" or gives an overall length of under 26" is considered making a "Short Barreled Rifle" or "SBR" and requires registration with the NFA branch and a $200 making or transfer tax. If someone is out there making pistol grips for Handi Rifles they are setting alot of unsuspecting people up for major time in Club Fed.
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Offline bighunt

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Re: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #13 on: November 29, 2011, 05:33:19 AM »
Quote from: wganzWork on November 23, 2011, 09:44:01 AM
<speculation>They may not be able to cut the barrel due that changing the specs from what is listed since that would be a different model which requires BATFE approval. This is why Ruger cannot add a .45 ACP cylinder to an existing .45 LC single action since it changes the model. </speculation>

Changing models or introducing new models does not require BATFE approval.  All you have to do is assign a unique serial number to each gun of the same model. I was unaware that Ruger now refuses to fit a .45 ACP cylinder to an existing blackhawk revolver.  I saw it offered as an option in the owners manual for $50.00 some time ago.
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If it has a barrel and shoots bullets I am interested in it and if I don't have one I want one.  Never met a gun I didn't like.

Offline kevinsmith5

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If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #14 on: November 29, 2011, 06:57:25 AM »
How is changing that cylinder different from fitting a new barrel to a Handi? H&R does that every day.
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Offline BAGTIC

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Re: If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #15 on: December 01, 2011, 01:15:25 PM »
It's the government. It's not supposed to make sense.
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Offline kevinsmith5

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If Rossi can do this, why not H&R
« Reply #16 on: December 02, 2011, 02:44:22 PM »
I don't think it is the government. I don't think Rossi had to get any type if magical approval for that pistol.
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