ANOTHER 356W Thread... UPDATED

[petemi]

CW, not much luck.  I found an ejector that looks like the right claw, and I found what I believe is the .357 extractor George sent back with the rifle.  If you want to modify the ejector, I'll put it in the mail to you.

Pete

[cwlongshot]

No worries Peter!!
 
 Brownells had a couple in stock and they are on there way to me in tomorrows mail!
 
I prepped 40 cases today. De-burring flash holes, trimming to uniform length then uniforming primer pockets. Lastly seating primers. I am gonna try H322.... I have had a pound from the 444 that I don't have any longer. Also gonna start with the Speer 220 FP.
 
I made up a couple dummy rounds and found I have a faulty seater die! It's a Redding I bought last month new, as I could not find my RCBS 358 set from years ago. It will not allow me to seat the 200g spitzers. It works fine for the 250g and just makes it for the 220g. Actually the 200g Hornady STD bullet would work, but I am just off the lands. The 200 FTX cannot get seated deeply enough to go into the gun. I'm gonna call them after I get these 40 pcs loaded and send it back. I did try the seater stem from a 35 Rem set as well as the stem form my 307 Win set. None will screw in any deeper. I also looked the die over and tried to tap the threads deeper... these dies are HARD!!! No dice with the tap... All the other dies screw in until the stem is bottomed. This set leaves more than 1/4" of stem exposed.
 
More to come...
 
CW

[dave29]

Nice work CW. I have been following all of your guys' threads involving the 356. Can't wait to see how she shoots.

[petemi]

Brian, I have thought about this before.  To raise the claw on the extractor slightly, would grinding a thou or two off the top surface of the extractor starting at the claw and tapering to zero within an inch or so relieve the fit allowing the claw to rise higher and engage the rimless case.  Perhaps a bit more curve on the spring also.  If you're going to change extractors anyhow, why not try it?

That's a bummer about the die.  It seems you're being plagued by nickle dime problems.  I wanted to load some of the .358  200 gr. SSPs for the Maxi and had to send to Lee for a seater plug.  The flat standard plug distorted the point only slightly, and the few I loaded shot ok,  The contour of the .358 seater was perfect, but I still couldn't make it work in the .357 die.

Today finally looks like a range day.  It's almost 6 a.m., clear, cold, no wind.  The ice is covered with an inch or so of crusty snow making it easy to walk on.  Hopefully this morning we'll know what the .356/.358 will do.  I want to compare both.

Good luck.  I hope you have her shooting in a day or two.

Pete

[cwlongshot]

Thanks guys!!,
 Yea I will play and adjust when the replacements come. For now it works perfectly with what its chambered for.. the 356!
 
I see you got out, targets look great!! I hope mine shoots as well!
 
Tonight I loaded 40 rounds, two different powders and 4 different charge weights each. I choose H322 and AA2520. Partially bacause they both meter flawlessly, partially bacause I have had luck with them in the past and mostly cause I don't currently use them! I was gonna use the H335 cause it works so well in the 307... But three diff manuels showed less velocity than H322 should be able to attain. Now I don't need top velocitys but getting a little more wont hurt anything.
 
CW

[petemi]

CW, an interesting thought:  I had a guy on another forum say that he's got a .356/.358 T/C Encore.  He said he loads the .356s to .35 Remington levels and the .358 to the max.  Makes sense in a way.  Why try to match .358 performance when you already have it?

Pete

[jeepmann1948]

You may be surprised when you get your 356 loads worked up and compare the speed of it to a 358.Over the years I have found that the factory ammo (except in rare cases} rarely meets published speeds.
I will also bet a case of your favorite beverages to a pound of coffee that Petes load will drop anything it hits (correctly)  as fast as a hookers drawers on Navy payday night.
If you want to shoot the 358 much I recommend necking up 308 brass for 358.Anneal the necks first and run them thru the 358 dies...instant 358.Just make sure the die it adjusted to where the newly formed cases just fit. There is not much shoulder on the 358 and if it is not right you may get some misfires.]

To be honest though, after seeing Pete's Target, the only thing I would do is load more of them.
Happy Trails
George

[petemi]

I had another problem that turned out to be an easy fix.  I was getting FTFs with the .356 handloads and somewhat more with the .358 factory stuff.  At first I thought "head spacing".  Then I looked at the primers.  The center of the strike was a sixteenth of an inch from the outside edge of the primer at 1 o'clock.  At Tim's suggestion, I read CWs "Off Center Firing Pin Strikes" in the FAQs under "Barrel Fitting".  I said to myself "Self, lets try something else first."  I had two spare SB2 frames.  It would not lock up on the first, but was perfect on the second I tried.  It was getting dark.  I stepped out on the back porch and flung two at the 300 yard gong.  No FTFs.  Now the pin strike was only about 1/16th off center.  Still not totally convinced, but too dark to continue, I let it go til this morning.  I ran 6 more through it with no FTFs.  By Jove, I think I've got it........just another reason to keep a couple of spare frames around.  Because of having had a succession of spare frames, none of my Handies are tweaked in any way except for the .308 which I had to just barely polish the latch shelf.

Pete

[cwlongshot]

I got to the range, but only had about an hour... I had loaded up 40 rnds for accuracy testing. This is , I forgot its a brand new barrel, never been shot before. Not sited in or anything...
So I threw together a last minute 20 rounds with 200g Hornady RN bullets and 4320 powder and a Win Primer... Just a starting load, 43Grs.
 
As it turned out, I only go to shoot the 4320 loads... but WOW...
 
The first shot outta the barrel went dead center low 6", but dead center. I loaded and fired 4 more rounds without touching a thing.
 
 

 
Believe it or not, the top holes have 4 shots threw them!
 
I took about 6 more shots to get the group at the top of the dot. Then I fired three more shots...
 

 
I never even got to my accuracy loads!!  These loads where just to get me "on the paper" and allow me to shoot the gun a few times...  WOW either I pegged a good load first thing or I have a real shooter... I prefer the latter.
To say I am happy is a understatement. 
 
CW

[jeepmann1948]

Cw it were me I would say "I have my load" Good job !!

[petemi]

Well Brian, since it's a used rifle, all I can offer you is 200.  You understand.

"I love it when a plan comes together"  If'n ya work at it ya kin git rid o dat vertical stringing

Seriously, Brian, That is really neat.  These babies are shooters.  It'd be interesting to get one really good rifleman to shoot both of ours in .356 and .358 and see which barrel works best for the mod..........the .35 Rem or the .357.  I don't qualify for the job.

Great shooting Buddy.

Pete

[petemi]

CW, you didn't say, but I assume the loads were .356 and not .358?

Pete

[cwlongshot]

Yes Pete, they are 356 Winchester loads..
Its just a starting load of IMR 4320 powder @ 43 grains and a Win 8 1/2 primer. Velocity should be just 2100 fps.
 
I had this same thing happen with the 454 when I rechambered. Just a guess, a light starting load and bullet shot into one hole after rechambering.
 
As for the minor stringing. I was shooting off my led sled because I had some 22RFs to wring out some accuracy loads with. Generally speaking I find handi shooting off them problematic. I did not bring along the lead shot bags as I said I was just shooting RFs and did not really need it... With the 356 it drove the sled back a inch or so every shot... If you look at the elevation screw at the bottom rear of the sled. You can even see where the screw dug into the becnh! 
 



CW

[jeepmann1948]

How would you compare the recoil to a similar stocked Handi in say a 307, 243 or 45-70 etc.?
George

[petemi]

I'm surprised it drove the sled back that way.  I guess I must be more recoil insensitive than I thought.  My perception of felt recoil with both the .356 and .358 is about the same as my .38-55 running hot, 2275 fps with a 213 gr bullet.  You know you've shot it, but it doesn't cause fractures or amputations.    As I said before, the muzzle blast seemed greater with the .358 in that short 18 inch barrel, but again, not super offensive.  My first shots with it were at dusk and the muzzle flash was impressive.

Pete

[cwlongshot]

George,
 I don't really know abouts recoil. But I don't expect it to be even a consideration. I used the sled simply to milk every. It of accuracy from pops new Savage MKII 22RF and ck pair it to my old custom 880SQ. (The SQ is more accurate ). Not for the sleds recoil elimination. I would expect Peters observations correct. About the same as a 307,308 or even my 454. I am sure it will  e more than my 243 tho. A bit less than my 1600/400g 45/70 loads. I would also guess it Much less than my 500 S&W loads or my heavy 2000/400g 45/70 loads. (I don't even shoot those in my handis!! )

It was getting dark and no muzzle flaw was noticed with the 356... But the 17" Maxi with 22g of H110 was a flame show!!!! Lol watch your eyebrows when shooting that one!!


Gonna try to get out and shoot it more this weekend. But we will see, weatherman calling for 6-8" of the white stuff tomorrow. If so, I'll be pushing that around and what I should have done will get pushed back to Saturday/Sunday.... ;(. Extra $$ yes but right now I would. Rather go shoot my new "shooter"!!! LOL
CW

[tom548]

35 Rem. barrel reamed to .358 Win. shoots some of the best groups I get with the Handi. Most of the time one large hole with a 180 bullet. It does  have a solid kick but not that bad.  I have got to make time to shoot some more of the .356 rounds and see how they compare to the .358 win.

[cwlongshot]

35 Rem. barrel reamed to .358 Win. shoots some of the best groups I get with the Handi. Most of the time one large hole with a 180 bullet. It does  have a solid kick but not that bad.  I have got to make time to shoot some more of the .356 rounds and see how they compare to the .358 win.

Good to hear Tom!

I was thinking 200g Hornadys as primary bullet. But started to lean to the Speer 220's... Now seeing how these 200's shoot. More testing is in order. 336 told me some time back he shoots that 200RN up to a velocity of 2600 with great results. So if it keeps shooting this well when I get to 24 or 2500 I may just keep using it!!!

Have you tried heavier bullets in yours?

CW





I need to alter my extractor to extract the 358. But no rush on. My part I built it for the 356!