Author Topic: .300 wby mag for whitetail (Read 6987 times)

joeinwv · « **Reply #90 on:** November 25, 2012, 05:32:22 PM »

It's loud. Bullets are expensive. Otherwise, have at it.

As above, hardest shooting rifle I've handled was a 760 in 30-06. Dad offered me his dad's, told him to give it to my brother.

Here in the eastern woods, I don't take 300 yard shots. Most kills here are under 100. In that range, on whitetail, I think 7-08 is about perfect.

ironglow · « **Reply #91 on:** November 25, 2012, 11:33:13 PM »

Since the Vanguard series is made in Japan Howa..the ammo is standard ammo, not Weatherby's super costly stuff, so it isn't out of line. http://www.chuckhawks.com/wby_vanguard_rifles.htm
Unless you are planning on hunting something larger than WNY whitetail & black bear...perhaps you could keep it unfired and go to the dealer who furnished the gun and arrange a swap for something more compatible to WNY hunting. However, if you plan other hunts.. keep the Vanguard.
Actually, a fellow hunter safety instructor uses a 300WM and he thinks it is just right. He hunts the power line right-of-ways, and so makes some very long shots..a 300WM at 200 yards is ballistically, much like a 30/06... at 100 yards; check it out!

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #92 on:** November 26, 2012, 01:17:11 AM »

Ironbow makes a good point. the same guys that will jump up and down saying a 300 wby or any other mag rifle is to much for whitetail dont take that into consideration. They will go out whitetail hunting with there 308 or o6 where there shots will never be any more then a 100 yards and bash someone with a 300 mag whos shooting at longer ranges when in fact there o6 is way more overpowered at 50 yards then a 300wby is at 300.

peak98 · « **Reply #93 on:** November 26, 2012, 04:05:38 AM »

I hunted with a Weatherby Mark V 300 Weatherby Mag for five years. I bought it to deer and elk hunt with but never got around to going elk hunting. I liked the gun when I was deer hunting (never felt the kick) but I HATED to target practice with it and I love to shoot. The rifle I had kicked like a mule, to me anyway. I would should 6 or 7 shots at the range and that was ALL I wanted, lol. I sold the rifle and bought a 7mm-08 to hunt with, the felt recoil is much less than the 300 Weatherby. I would not buy another 300 Weatherby for two reasons. First is because of the recoil, second is the high cost of the ammunition for this caliber. Weatherby builds a fine rifle, I killed 20+ deer at ranges from 17 yards to 332 yards, none required a second shot. That said, your weapon sits on top of your shoulders, everything else is just equipment. Know your equipment, practice often and you'll have no problems.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #94 on:** November 26, 2012, 04:31:33 AM »

Id agree for a non hanloader but then if i didnt reload i couldnt afford to shoot my guns and would probably only own one or two. It cost only pennys more to load a 300 wby then it does a 7-08

ironglow · « **Reply #95 on:** November 26, 2012, 01:48:37 PM »

Tell 'em Lloyd..reloading is a big part of "gun joy"..

RevJim · « **Reply #96 on:** November 27, 2012, 05:19:15 AM »

Where I grew up hunting (SE Texas) a 30.06 was the biggest cartridge used, and usually in a Mod 740 and later, the Model 742. The rest were either surplus 8mms or 6.5 "Eyetalians" ha. When I got out of the Army in '73, I bought a BAR in 7mm Rem mag, my intentions were to use it on deer/hogs but mainly on elk in Colorado. I caught unholy hell from everyone on our lease for using a "magnum', everyone felt "compelled" to tell my why, how come and how stupis it was to use a magnum on deer. I just used the factory 175 corlokt and my kills looked just like the guys who used the 30.06! Later on, when clearcuts became normal on the lease, with longer shots, and pipeline right of ways, 7mm Rem mag was more common than the 30.06 and some guys used the 300 WM! My point is there will always be folks who want to tell a man what he can't do, can't have, can't use,etc. ha Really, the only real "objection" I have is Swampy's white shrimper boots...what a Cooney! ha.

ironglow · « **Reply #97 on:** November 27, 2012, 05:32:42 AM »

A similar debate has arisen here where I live..
Regular bow hunters don't want crossbow hunters to use the same woods at the same time as they do! Now, I'm not a bow hunter but I am still puzzled by the reasoning..
So, Charlie hunts with a conventional bow...what difference should it make to Charlie..if Joe holds his bow vertical or horizontal?

Just wondering...I have asked that question elsewhere and never seem to get a straight answer..I thinking it's more of an "ego thing".

RevJim · « **Reply #98 on:** November 27, 2012, 06:35:05 AM »

Yep, I bowhunted from '76 to '85 with a compound bow. We caught it from the Recurve shooters, no kidding! I liked recurves, just could shoot better/farther with a compound. Out here in Utah, in '92 I started taking advantage of the muzzleloading deer season. The guys with Hawkens griped about the guys with In lines ; I was a hybred, I used a fast twist bbl on a TC Renegade with an aluminum ramrod and a Williams peep sight, so I caught it from them too. It didn't matter that I could get 1.5" groups with a 500gr conical and they got 5" groups with a patched ball, I wasn't "traditional"....I was prepared for it from my BAR 7mm mag days, ha. Seems sportsmen can be their own worse enemy.

RevJim · « **Reply #99 on:** November 28, 2012, 03:39:55 AM »

Sorry Swampy...I just had to tease you about those Shrimp Boat boots! I admit it, I was a Lacrosse rubber boot man for SE Texas!

Darrell Davis · « **Reply #100 on:** November 28, 2012, 06:45:52 AM »

Well, read some of Lloyd Smale's comments a few post back and as happens a fair amount of the time, I'll come down in agreement.

Early on, I responded to this post as a years long 300win Mag owner/shooter/hunter, stating that there is no such thing as too dead and that much of my answer to the "O.P." comes down to bullet integrity.

AS an example to the bullet integrity issue, and not trying to hijack or change the subject, I'll flesh out the integrity comment a bit more.

This past Friday afternoon, a friends buck was hanging in my shop when I got home from hunting, so he was called to let him know I was there to help and we soon got to the cleaning and skinning.

Now I'll agree that a shoulder hit is very bad bullet placement, but this is afterall, "hunting" and such things happen. Caliber, 45/70. But the major problem was the bullet used, The Hornady levereveloution gummy tip and the meat loss and distruction was extreme. UGLY!!!!!!!!!!! Both Shoulders!

I love my RUGER #1 - 45/70, but if there is one thing my cast, 465gr WFN bullet do not lack, it is integrity.

But then to make the picture and lack of bullet integrity crystal clear, on Monday there was a message for me when I again arrived home from hunting, another friend had a buck down and needed help.

We got the field work taken care of, got the critter to my place, washed out, hung and skinned and there we have it, another side to side shoulder hit.

BUT!!! And note the big, "BUT" this is where the picture takes a real change for the better.

This second buck was taken with the second friend's 30/06 with 165gr Nosler Partition loads I developed for him, Summer before last.

The impact velocity had to be a 1000fps faster with the 30/06 then with the 45/70, but Ooooooooh the huge difference in distruction and meat loss.

So, the point is, go with the 300 if that is what you have, but go to the field with typical cup-n-core bullets and have something less then a good side to side -BEHIND THE SHOULDER- hit and you may well loose LOTS!!! and lots of meat.

The Hornady gummy nose bullet is a very poor and soft product, suffering greatly from a shortage of bullet integrity, something which it hold in common with a good number of the cup-n-core production presently available.

Will they put a critter down? Most of the time yes, but this is after all, as stated, "hunting" and as such not all hits are text book perfect and you do get what you pay for in bullet quality/integrity.

If I wasn't having so much fun with my 45/70, I'd likely be hunting with my 300, but using a bullet made with integrity of design and construction was a lesson learned long ago.

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

BPS slayer · « **Reply #101 on:** November 29, 2012, 02:29:41 PM »

I like my 300 Wby. mag as long as I am not walking a long way. I load the 165 grain Nosler Accubond now because in the past I had some Ballistic Tips come apart at close ranges. I am sold on the Accubond! My wife told me we needed freezer meat, and I was hunting a property with huge fields, so I took the 300 Wby. and shot a small buck in the morning and two does in the afternoon. All 3 died where they stood with shots 200-300 yds away. Now this is a Mark-V Deluxe with a Leuold 3.5-10x50 so it is HEAVY. However, I love shooting it because the Mark-V stock is comfortable and the weight controls the kick. For fields it is great.
Now if I am going to sit in the woods, then I will grab the Marlin 30-30 or Browning BAR '06. You just have to match the tool to the anticipated job.
(I guess you can tell I like the .308 diameter cartridges!!!)

Squib · « **Reply #102 on:** December 22, 2012, 10:36:01 AM »

for myself fit is number one. hardly any recoil at all, directed into a stock that doesn't fit me right, will be an issue if I'm not ready for it. for example, as a former marine, I am used to M16 A2/A4 solid stocks, having shot at least 20,000 rds in service. as a civilian I've found that with a short "M4" type with a rattling adjustable stock, I feel my skin crawl when I shoot. something about having my face jiggled really bothers me. it's not "heavy" at all, it just feels weird.

my 45-70 is a basic synthetic handi, and it used to beat me up when I first got it, I flinched bad after a box or two of ammo. I had to load that stock up with birdshot (and put a slip on pad when benching it) to work up my beastly handloads and shoot them off a bench repetively. after shooting it so much I got able to handle it enough to pull the weight (5 lbs) out. then I got smart and built up a monte carlo comb on it, and it is so minimal in perceived recoil I can hardly feel it when I fire... IF I PULL IT EXTREMELY TIGHT INTO MY SHOULDER! if I hold it lax it will bruise my face, everytime. other people who do not hold it like I do cannot normally fire it without getting a streak on the cheek. it's the "running start" and the "bump" in the face that get me and others from what I've observed.

I have a 12 ga 3/12 that is NOT modified and has no comb to settle into, and I cannot stand to shoot turkey loads and choke more than 2-3 times, my face and neck hurt and my shoulder gets beat up. I assume the recoil speed is a lot more on the shotgun, though how much more I cannot say. I am sure that the actual recoil "energy" is about the same as the 45-70 but much more viscious.I can handle buffalo killer loads but not goose loads, how weird is that?!

as for shoulder pain, my deltoids are thin and veiny, and they bruise from shouldering a rifle and dry firing because I pull them in so tight, the recoil makes little difference. I'm saying I get marks from squirrel hunting with a 10/22, about the same as shooting clays with normal 12ga loads. I put very squishy pad on anything that kicks good (except the handi) and it stops the bruising from increasing substantially. whether it's a 22 or 45-70 I just hold it tight and what happens, happens. if I'm hitting what I'm aiming at I'm pleased enough to ignore the hits on me- - - - - because I shot a lot with a 12 ga and 45-70 before and got used to "real" abuse.

as for bodily issues, head and neck sensitivity vary a lot. so does "body composition". a guy that is big and heavy but fat is going to bruise rather easily, and his fat will jiggle under recoil. I do not imagine that feeling good, or helping to shoot well- despite "soaking it up" with more mass. in my case my shoulders are ripped and bruise easily as there is no padding on the veins, they get hit and they leak. bulking up from 180ish to 220ish made no difference on that, my shoulders got a bit bigger but still bruise up really easily. in my case getting fatter would probably help. I also wonder if the more athletic of us might flinch worse, like buff people getting tasered or having seizures- they have much more violent reactions to muscular over-stimulation.

BUGEYE · « **Reply #103 on:** December 23, 2012, 02:22:30 AM »

Quote from: Swampman on July 29, 2012, 09:47:50 AM

This is easy as pie to understand......Since the little guy moves with the rifle and doesn't resist the recoil as much he doesn't get hurt. Moving with the weapon and not trying to stop it is the way it's done. Bracing yourself and hunching over into the gun will hurt you. All this is a moot point with the .300 Weatherby. It doesn't really kick. Big fellows will always suffer more. I've never seen it fail.

Using this same logic, a little guy will win a fist-fight with a big guy every time.

It really doesn't kick?? for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. so all else being equal, a 300 wby will kick harder than other 300 magnums.

FPH · « **Reply #104 on:** December 23, 2012, 03:40:48 AM »

Quote from: Swampman on July 30, 2012, 12:36:13 PM

I like Lloyd. I too would choose a lung/heart shot with this caliber. The hydrostatic shock will pole axe them......DRT.

This too is the my placement of long shots. I've never had an animal even take a step.

Empty Quiver · « **Reply #105 on:** December 23, 2012, 11:47:30 AM »

Quote from: BUGEYE on December 23, 2012, 02:22:30 AM

Quote from: Swampman on July 29, 2012, 09:47:50 AM
This is easy as pie to understand......Since the little guy moves with the rifle and doesn't resist the recoil as much he doesn't get hurt. Moving with the weapon and not trying to stop it is the way it's done. Bracing yourself and hunching over into the gun will hurt you. All this is a moot point with the .300 Weatherby. It doesn't really kick. Big fellows will always suffer more. I've never seen it fail.
Using this same logic, a little guy will win a fist-fight with a big guy every time.

It really doesn't kick?? for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. so all else being equal, a 300 wby will kick harder than other 300 magnums.

Bugeye I think you are failing to understand the difference between the recoil delivered and that absorbed.

Imagine hitting a whiffle ball with a softball bat, now imagine hitting a nice fat heavy slow pitch ball with the same power. There sir, is the felt difference. The energy is transfered to the softball much more readily, simply look how far you can hit a softball compared to a whiffle ball. That distance is an indication of the amount of energy transfered.

nomosendero · « **Reply #106 on:** December 23, 2012, 05:13:04 PM »

Quote from: nomosendero on July 29, 2012, 03:33:49 PM

Anyone that says a Nos. Partition won't expand with a 300Mag has never used one on Deer & Nosler themselves are not aware of that. I have loaded some up for my 300WM & alot for an '06 & they expanded at this lower velocity & have. Actually the front part of the bullet is designed to expand & they will even at moderate vel, though not as wide as some & in extreme cases to shear & the rear part continue to penetrate.

No, a 300 Wea. is not needed at all for Deer, but if you shoot it well it will do great & used wisely the meat destruction is not a biggie. I took a couple in the 2010 AR season with my 300 Sendero with the newer 180 Balistic Tip, the meat damage was minimal but then again it is a much tougher bullet now than in the past, a whole differnt game than when I used the 180BT in the early 90's, those were quite soft.

On the recoil discussion, Swampman is part right & the other side is part right. It is true that a light person is more likely to roll with the recoil & the heavier person offers more resistance to the recoil forces. An example of how the added resistance increases recoil is to shoot a rifle from a seated bench, especially leaning forward & then shoot the rifle from a standing table, where your body moves more with the recoil. However, it is not quite that simple. The bigger guy, especially if muscular instead of blubber will likely have more meat in his shoulder. This will translate to less pain when hit in the shoulder with equal force to a skinny or lesser developed shoulder which is rocked to the bone & the nerves feel it more. I go 260+ (not blubber) & I can generally handle a fist to the shoulder better than the guy with little meat on their shoulders, just the way it works. But a third component is your mind & discipline/mental toughness.
Some people can blot it out better than others. I have seen little guys & gals that handle recoil very well, some can't at all & I have seen big wimps & big guys who could absorb it. I would say the most likely overall to excell in this dept. is a well conditioned big guy, but it is subjective.

Like I said before, a little more to it than that!

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #107 on:** December 24, 2012, 12:12:08 AM »

theroy smeary! Ive been around for a while. Shot MANY hard kicking rifles and saw them shot by others. Been in my fair share of bar fights when i was younger too. What have i seen? Mostly that larger guys are the ones that tend to shoot harder kicking guns. Not allways but usually. In a bar fight my money goes on the big guy. All things equal a bigger stonger guy with more reach will eat alive a small guy. Thats why featherweigths dont box in the heavyweight class. Most wouldnt come out of a fight alive if they did. Luckily God put me right in the middle so i can shoot about anything and have my but kicked by both small and large.

Swampman · « **Reply #108 on:** December 24, 2012, 01:03:28 AM »

It's all in the head I guess. The .300 Weatherby and the .375H&H aren't bad at all IMO. Right now I'm at 160 lbs. Modern rifles have excellent recoil pads that prevent brusing. The .300 Weatherby is an excellent medium game cartridge if you have one.

nomosendero · « **Reply #109 on:** December 25, 2012, 04:20:45 PM »

Quote from: Swampman on December 24, 2012, 01:03:28 AM

It's all in the head I guess. The .300 Weatherby and the .375H&H aren't bad at all IMO. Right now I'm at 160 lbs. Modern rifles have excellent recoil pads that prevent brusing. The .300 Weatherby is an excellent medium game cartridge if you have one.

Yes, what's between the ears is likely the most important factor concerning recoil.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #110 on:** December 25, 2012, 11:40:00 PM »

No doubt true. We were at the buddys game ranch about 5 years ago to shoot a couple cow bufflalos for winters meat and one of the guys working there had his girlfreind there. She was a 100lb soaking wet 20year old girl. Only thing shed ever shot before was a 22. After we got done killing the bufflalo my buddy and I and my other friend that owns the place sat down on a hillside and started shooting rocks with our 500 linebaughs. She asked if she could try. That little girl never was told that the gun she was shooting would scare the daylights out of many seasoned handgun shooters. She shot probably close to 50 rounds out of my 500 and was gigiling all the time. Never once did she say ouch or even make a twisted face. She thought it was a ball. If we would have told her it kicked hard or if she read some of the bs on the internet she would have probably gone running. I can honestly say ive NEVER been physicaly hurt by shooting something like a 300 wby. Sure the buck a bit and make lots of noise but there sure nothing to fear.

Quote from: nomosendero on December 25, 2012, 04:20:45 PM

Quote from: Swampman on December 24, 2012, 01:03:28 AM
It's all in the head I guess. The .300 Weatherby and the .375H&H aren't bad at all IMO. Right now I'm at 160 lbs. Modern rifles have excellent recoil pads that prevent brusing. The .300 Weatherby is an excellent medium game cartridge if you have one.

Yes, what's between the ears is likely the most important factor concerning recoil.

Squib · « **Reply #111 on:** December 26, 2012, 05:08:18 PM »

she was probably on the other end of the spectrum in regards to carpal tunnel and nerve impingement, despite being a tiny girl... it happens.