Author Topic: why don't you own a winchester model 12? (Read 2310 times)

fatercat · « **on:** July 11, 2012, 07:52:49 AM »

i went and bought a 20ga. sweet and the best pump ever made, bar none.

spruce · « **Reply #1 on:** July 12, 2012, 10:28:56 AM »

I do own one - a 16 gauge I picked up a few months ago. Used to own a 12 gauge years ago.

I agree, they are fine guns, but so are Rem 870's, Ithaca mod 37's, Stevens 620's, Win 97's to name a few.

They all have features I like and some features I don't care so much for. I look forward to taking mine out in the grouse woods this fall. It's been a while since I hunted with a model 12 and I know I'll enjoy it. Hope you have some fun days with yours too!

bobg · « **Reply #2 on:** July 12, 2012, 08:52:59 PM »

I do own one. It belonged to my father. 50 some years ago when i spent all my spare time in the woods i sure killed a lot of rabbits and pheasants with that old gun. I don't hunt much anymore so it hasen't been shot in years. Great gun.

alleyyooper · « **Reply #3 on:** July 13, 2012, 04:49:54 AM »

Because I own a pair of Ithaca mod 37's feather lites with bottom eject that lends it self much better to the reloading world.

Al

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #4 on:** July 13, 2012, 04:53:35 AM »

I had both a 97 and 12 both were good guns both well made nither offered the hunter options the 870 does so both were sold.

George Foster · « **Reply #5 on:** July 13, 2012, 10:30:20 PM »

I own a Mdl12 in 12ga that was my Dads, I haven't shot it at all in at least 25yrs. I personally prefer Rem 870's for myself and have been shooting them excusively for 45yrs now.

Swampman · « **Reply #6 on:** July 13, 2012, 10:52:27 PM »

The 870 is much better and cheaper.

fatercat · « **Reply #7 on:** July 14, 2012, 02:44:28 AM »

its cheaper for a reason, but it ain't better. stamped out buy unskilled workers. stained pine for wood. modern day junk for the disposable generatation.

Swampman · « **Reply #8 on:** July 14, 2012, 02:53:33 PM »

They still come in walnut and they operate flawlessly. Much better gun than the Model 12.

fatercat · « **Reply #9 on:** July 14, 2012, 10:54:39 PM »

Ok, swampman. how and why is it better??

Swampman · « **Reply #10 on:** July 15, 2012, 12:04:47 AM »

They still make them. It's chambered for modern shotshells and shot. It's inexpensive, they make 10,000+ accessories for them, it's more attractive, it's more reliable.

fatercat · « **Reply #11 on:** July 15, 2012, 02:50:06 AM »

that ain't "how and why?" that excuses.

George Foster · « **Reply #12 on:** July 15, 2012, 07:36:09 AM »

Two things that are much better about the 870's, One is the 870's aren't prone to firing pin breakage, Two they are much verstatile with interchangable barrels or in some cases choke tubes. One other thing you don't have to worry about with a 870 is tightening up the barrel assembly to the receiver as they get shot quite a bit.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #13 on:** July 15, 2012, 11:28:57 PM »

If the mod 12 was better in all aspects it would be a top seller today. It is expensive to make it replacement 1200 and 1300 are not on par with a mod 12 and don't do as well as the 870. The mod 12 had one action arm and can bind.
I wish the 870 could be fitted with a winchester bbl though.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #14 on:** July 15, 2012, 11:31:04 PM »

I would add the SX 1 and SX2 auto loaders both follow the fit of a mod 12 and the SX 2 in particular are selling very well . I switched to one .

Old Syko · « **Reply #15 on:** July 16, 2012, 01:23:45 PM »

I have a 12 and an 870 both bought new in 1967. The 870 has been shot to death while the 12 has hardly been used. The dual action arms giving a more positive throw is important but the overall handling of the 870 has always been superior for me. Simple barrel exchanges allowed me to use the 870 for everything from birds of all types to deer, rabbits and even local turkey shoots while still using a familiar platform. BTW the 870 was $6 more than the 12 back then also. I still have the original receipts. It proved itself more than worth the extra money over the years.

popplecop · « **Reply #16 on:** July 22, 2012, 09:58:56 AM »

My slide action shotgun inventory consists of 2 Model 37s from the 50s, a Rem. 870 from 52 and 3 Rem. 31s from the 40s. All in 16 ga. except one 37 is a 12, never saw the need to have another Md. 12. Had one years back and wasn't particulary fond of the way it fit. But to each his own.

redleg155 · « **Reply #17 on:** July 23, 2012, 04:20:02 AM »

Everyone should own a model 12. Not knocking the 870, which is a wonderful, reliable and excellent design, but they are not really comparable. The model 12 went out of production because, at the time, the hand-fitting required to make them run was both too expensive and a dying breed of craftsmen. There were some very nice factory custom 870 guns made for trap shooting, but no pump gun will ever compare to the model 12's stronghold in American skeet and especially trap during the post-WWII years.

I have a few model 12's. A "riot" gun from before 1940, 12 ga. and a 1952, near new 16 ga. modified choke field gun was probably unfired when I purchased it 12 years ago. Found it under a good layer of dust at a tackle shop in northern Indiana.

Probably the prettiest among them is a factory custom model 12 trap. It has a somewhat rare factory modified choke 30" barrel and the wood has been freshened up a bit. All original except for the pad. Some may notice the gold plated trigger and safety button which, on the particular model were done at the factory by order of the exucutive who ordered this gun at the time. My paperwork is not with me at the moment, but apparently some pre-1964 receivers and barrels were fitted into trap configuration after 1964. Among these were a select few that were made into pigeon grade guns, at the factory, by order of the CEO for friends as gifts, etc. This is one of those and one clue is the pre-"Y" serial number (pre-'64) combined with the trap rib configuration beginning after 1964 (which I prefer for shooting anyway). I use it for 16 yard singles and pump-only sporting clays tournaments that occasionally pop up in the midwest.

Kind regards -

spruce · « **Reply #18 on:** July 23, 2012, 11:37:38 AM »

Wow, nice wood!

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #19 on:** July 24, 2012, 01:19:42 AM »

Some of the Remington mod 31's were very good guns and also had very nice lines and wood.
But the auto seemed to be taking off at the time .

rzwieg · « **Reply #20 on:** July 24, 2012, 04:04:31 AM »

I respect the old guns but would rather have something I don't mind scratching.

That's a real beaut redleg.

Wyo. Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #21 on:** July 24, 2012, 11:01:15 AM »

My model 12 is a heavy duck with a solid rib...while I like it, if I were cutting down my shotgun collection, I would keep my 870's, model 31, and maybe the 97 over the model 12...it has given me more minor problems than the other three put together...The 870's have been shot thousands of times at birds, trap, skeet etc. and have never had a major problem with them...

redleg155 · « **Reply #22 on:** July 25, 2012, 12:56:44 AM »

The 870 is no slouch, it deserves respect.

I would feel very undergunned with anything if I were ever afforded the opportunity to shoot against Rudy Etchen! He did amazing things with the 870! Including world records and championships - even trap doubles. He did use a model 12 for his one-handed skeet records though...

I say now, get at least one of each!

dukkillr · « **Reply #23 on:** August 03, 2012, 09:26:59 AM »

I own both 870s and M12s today. I grew up shooting both. For REAL upland hunting there has never been anything built that works better than a 2 3/4" (shorter, faster stroke than the 870) 28" (not too short for pheasants, not too long for quail) M12 with a simmons rib and a modified choke (unless you're still not an experienced shot, then perhaps you would rather the less common IC).

I say "real" because today when people internet-debate various guns for various reasons they are almost invariably arguing in the abstract. They may shoot 2 boxes a year, or only on pretty Sunday afternoons when the local team isn't playing, or only shoot planted birds. For those people it does not matter in the slightest what they use, and there is no sense in debating it.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #24 on:** August 03, 2012, 09:33:32 AM »

I have shot both Mod 12 and 870 in dove fields and will take the 870 anyday not that the 12 wasn't good. I offer this because some guns fit different people well different. I will take a SX2 over both anyday as far as repeters go . BTW I shoot a IM choke for most things except quail over dogs.

Victor3 · « **Reply #25 on:** August 03, 2012, 08:40:43 PM »

I keep my Dad's 1930's era Mod 12 for the same reason I keep my Great Grandfather's pocket watch; both have sentimental value and are precision manufacturing marvels.

My 870 and Casio wrist watch are much more practical.

One thing though... I can hold the trigger back on the Mod 12 and pump away and it will fire as the pump comes forward, just like in the gangster movies.

Can't do that with an 870.

inthebeech · « **Reply #26 on:** September 27, 2012, 10:00:34 AM »

I really wish that either the M12, the M37 (don't own either but have in the past) or my Fox fit me because I like some features of both over those same features of my 870. But the Wingmaster comes up right perfect every time I mount it so that's what gets to come with me through the brambles. I often wonder how Remington came up with their stock dimensions. Some day I may treat myself to a new set of wood for my Fox and if I do, the first question is going to be whether the exact dimensions of my 870 can be duplicated. Then, that would be my favorite.
It is about fit for me.

Iowa Fox · « **Reply #27 on:** October 23, 2012, 08:21:56 PM »

I have my Dad's which he purchased new and a new unfired one from the 50s. I carried a model 12 riot gun in 68-69. Much smoother than others when your life is on the line with it.

Savage .250 · « **Reply #28 on:** October 25, 2012, 02:36:20 AM »

Quote from: alleyyooper on July 13, 2012, 04:49:54 AM

Because I own a pair of Ithaca mod 37's feather lites with bottom eject that lends it self much better to the reloading world.
Al

I only have 1 model as listed above. Love it!
Have no interest in a model 21.