scope comparison

[fastnighthawk]

Hi guys I'm new here at graybeard forums and I was hoping you could help me with some opinions on some scopes. I was thinking of purchasing a new scope for my Remingtom BDL 270 DM . I will be considering the following scopes Leupold Vari - X III 4.5 - 14 X 40, Bushnell Elite 4200 4 - 16 X 40, Zeiss Conquest 3 - 9 X 40, Nikon Monarch 4 - 12 X 40 which I have Found for $300 - $500 which is the range I can afford. The most important things that I think will matter to me would be clarity and contrast, accurate tracking adjustment and how well the manufacturer stands behind these products as well, and the eye relief since with my eyes have a harder time lining up my target as compared to when I was younger. This scope will be used for hunting and some shooting at the range, my farest shots will be 250 yards and most of the shots will be 100 yards in wooded PA. but it isn't a real thick area where I hunt. Any info will be helpful thanks fastnighthawk

[TheOpticZone]

I personal like the Nikon Monarch's, their clarity is outstanding and quality vs price, they are a great buy.  One thing that is very important to you is the eye relief and Leupold has one the best eye reliefs in the business.  I also would not even consider a 4-12 or 4.5-14 if your only going to shoot a maximum of 250 yards, with most of your shots at 100 yards.  I would stick with a 3-9, 2.5-8 or even something small, like a 1.5-6 range.  I know that it is tough these days to choose a scope, but all the ones that you mention are of high quality and will suit your needs just fine.

[Zachary]

I agree with Jon.  :grin:

All of the scopes that you mentioned are great scopes - it just all boils down to what's the best value.  For the money, the Elite 4200s and Monarchs are tough the beat.  And yes, their clarity and internal mechanisms are excellent.

Personally, I would go with the Elite 4200s just a smidgen over the Monarchs because the Elites have rainguard (and the $99 free jacket promotion).  If you want a little extra eye relief, though, then go with the Monarch.

Zachary

[Greybeard]

Let me start out by suggesting you change your search group. There is no way under the sun that a 4-14 is the correct scope for use on a .270 Win. for 250 yard and less shots. In all honesty a fixed 4X is plenty of power to that range.

So with that in mind I'm gonna suggest you change your search to scopes in the 2-7, 2.5-8, 3-9 and 2.5-10 range. These are REAL big game hunting scopes. Those with more power are varmint scopes not big game hunting scopes.

What within the above range do I suggest? Well I have all four. Since you mention warranty as being real important both Bushnell and Leupold have the best there is in the industry and it reads the same for both. You buy any Leupold or any Bushnell Elite and it is covered for life no questions asked and it applies if you buy it new or used.

Tracking has never been a problem for me on any Bushnell Elite or Leupold scope I've owned and that's a bunch of them. Rest assured that's not a problem. But really why are you so concerned about that? Do you plan to be changing the adjustments regularly once you have the rifle sighted in? If so why? What you should be more concerned with than tracking accuracy is whether it stays put once adjusted. Both brands do.

Once again for the problem you mention with tired old eyes which I have also eye relief is NOT the thing to consider. But rather the exit pupil diameter and how bright the scope is which is mostly a factor of quality of glass and coatings. The Elite 4200 line is superior in this respect. Guess it is a toss up at that point but likely the Leupold Vari-X III line is slightly superior in that regard to the Elite 3200 line but not by a lot. Then follows the other Leupold lines somewhere behind the 3200.

So what do I use and recommend? Keeping in mind I really feel no need to ever go much above 6X in a real world big game hunting situation I prefer a 2-7, 2.5-8 or 3-9. The 2.5-10s are really bigger than I personally like on big game hunting rifles and generally have a bit less FOV. On rifles regularly used at this house you'll find Bushnell Elite 4200 1.5-6, Bushnell Elite 3200 2-7, Leupold Vari-X III 2.5-8 and Leupold Vari-X II 3-9. My favorite two among those are the Bushnell Elite 4200 1.5-6 and the Leupold 2.5-8.

So that's my best advice based on 40 years of in field use of scopes on rifles.

GB

[Dave in WV]

I agree with the lower magnification recommendations. You'll have a wider field of view and more light gathering capability. I considered the Bushnell Elite 1.5x6 scope but it only has 3.0" of eye relief. The Nikon Gold 1.5x6 wasn't available when I bought my Pentax 2x8 (I really like it) or I would have given it a close look. The Nikon Gold has 4" constant eye relief, a 30mm tube and 30mm sized internal optics, and only weighs 2 oz more than the Elite 1.5x6. The Nikon scope is $409 from The Optic Zone and they have free ground shipping on orders over $300.  I caught the Pentax on sale from SWFA and they still have the gloss finsh scope on sale for $316.95. It's a good scope with generous eye relief and you have 8x magnification on the top end.

[SeanD]

There is no way under the sun that a 4-14 is the correct scope for use on a .270 Win. for 250 yard and less shots. In all honesty a fixed 4X is plenty of power to that range.

Why?  A 4-14 has the same power when you crank it down as the fixed 4X.  If a guy doesnt care about the weight and physical size difference, then what is the disadvantage to going with the bigger variable?  You can hunt with them both on 4X, and the variable offers the advantage of migher magnification for seeing your bullet holes on paper at the range, and if he ever wants to use it for long varmint hunting or paper punching, hes already set up for it.

[Graybeard]

Check the FOV of the 4-14 when on 4X. You'll begin to see one of the whys. All 4-14s require AO feature and any scope with AO MUST use it in the field. Do you really want to be fiddling with it or do you want to be shooting at game? I refuse to use ANY scope with AO on a big game hunting rifle.

Why would a person NOT care about size and weight? Such a huge scope makes a hunting rifle cumbersome at best. If you like it go for it. But realize you're just falling for the magazine writer hype when you do. Most of them are now even coming around and admitting to giving out some bad advice on using such huge scopes on hunting rifles.

GB

[SeanD]

good point about the adjustable objective, i never considered that.  I agree that AO would be a pain on a hunting rifle.   :eek:

I have friends that like the bigger glass, and seem happy about it, now i wonder how they get around the AO problem.  Never experienced it myself, i too prefer little scopes

[bigdaddytacp]

Hi guys I'm new here at graybeard forums and I was hoping you could help me with some opinions on some scopes. I was thinking of purchasing a new scope for my Remingtom BDL 270 DM . I will be considering the following scopes Leupold Vari - X III 4.5 - 14 X 40, Bushnell Elite 4200 4 - 16 X 40, Zeiss Conquest 3 - 9 X 40, Nikon Monarch 4 - 12 X 40 which I have Found for $300 - $500 which is the range I can afford. The most important things that I think will matter to me would be clarity and contrast, accurate tracking adjustment and how well the manufacturer stands behind these products as well, and the eye relief since with my eyes have a harder time lining up my target as compared to when I was younger. This scope will be used for hunting and some shooting at the range, my farest shots will be 250 yards and most of the shots will be 100 yards in wooded PA. but it isn't a real thick area where I hunt. Any info will be helpful thanks fastnighthawk

...........I have been thru over 25 Leupold scopes and have had Zeiss,Weaver,Lightforce,Bushnell,Lyman and Unertls and the scopes you have listed are all good but I would prefer the VXIII Leupold and I know it will take abuse and give good service.....as to the AO feature....you can preset it at the most likely distance you will be shooting......75,100.150.200yds and it will be just like a fixed scope that is preset at that distance and will be clear enough 50yds either side of the longer distances to make good shots on big game targets.......I have several hunting AO scopes in the 3.5x10 and 4.5x14 range and it works well for me and some friends that use similar scopes.....with a little pratice you get used to moving the AO for unusal shots and if you premeasure the most likely paths you will be ready for almost any shot you feel comfortable trying.....either way enjoy the selection process and good luck and good shooting-hunting!!

[Dave-o]

I too hunt Penn's woods, and the advice offered by the other posters is good advice. I've hunted MD/WV/PA for 20 years and NEVER needed over 6-8X. I have 2 2.5-8 VXIII's and they are excellent. I also own or have owned most of the major brands, excluding the european brands. If I were buying a Leupold, I'd only get a VXIII, otherwise I'd buy a Nikon or Bushnell elite. I think you get more from your money with some of the other scope makers if you get their higher end models. Don't get AO if the rifle will only be used for big game. When that big opening day buck gets bumped past your stand, you'll appreciate less adjustments and more field of view offered by a lower powered fixed odjective scope.

[Zachary]

All 4-14s require AO feature and any scope with AO MUST use it in the field. Do you really want to be fiddling with it or do you want to be shooting at game?

GB

I was at the shooting range some time ago shooting my Tikka SS 25-06 with an Elite 4200 4x-16x-40mm AO.  I initially had the AO set at 50 yards to make sure it hit paper, but when I got it out to 100 yards and forgot to set the AO at 100 yards, the image was fuzzy. :?   When I set it at 100 yards, it was fine.

Now I'm not a fan of AOs.  And let me tell you, I don't think a 50 yard difference should really make a difference, but it did.  Could you imagine my, or your, frustration if that happened while hunting?

Problem is, if you want a scope over 12x, chances are that your scope WILL be an AO.

Zachary

[Dave in WV]

I know some hunters are capable of taking game with one shot at very long ranges. I'm not one of those. I am very happy with 8x or less magnification for a big game scope. Actually 6x is plenty for me and that's probably more than I need. If our military snipers can take out a target at 900 meters using a 10x scope, I'm sure I don't need very much magnification for a 200 yard shot max and usually less than 100 yards. Just my $.02. Dave

[Lone Wolf]

I have used a wide variety of scopes over the past many years I've been shooting and with that said the scope you use needs to fit the application.

When I first started shooting fixed powers were the way to go, if you used a scope at all, and I've used fixed power scopes for most of my life. In fact all but two of my rifles wear Leupold M8 6X38s, and I've never had a problem in most hunting situations.

I, like you, have eyes that are suffering age, but have never found that I needed more that a 6x on shots less that 300 in standard hunting situations. If I need to check out a rack, etc. I use my 10x binos.

As I said before, two of my rifles do wear variable power scopes. I live in the west and occasional hunt where I know the possibility of a shot over 200 - 250 yards is a given, such as when I go antelope hunting in Arizona, or desert mulie in certain portions of California. One of those rifles, a .308 Win 70 F/W, carries a Kahles AH 3X9.  It usually stays set @ 6x when I carry it, but if the shot is long I will crank it up for a more precise bullet placement.

The other rifle, a Browning 1885 Low Wall .243, wears a Nikon Monarch 3.3x10 AO, mil-dot scope. This is my special purpose rifle for long range. It's my antelope and occasional desert mulie rifle. It also does duty as a hunter silhouette rifle, even though I do get quite a few rings on the rams. The AO is not a hindrance in these applications as my shots are not snap shots and adjusting the AO after I range the target is second nature.

In your application, if all I hunted was wooded area with shots rarely, if ever, exceeding 200 yards I would opt for a good fixed 6x scope. If you must have a variable I would opt for at the most a 3x9, more preferably a 2x7. As to which scope, all the good scope makes have fixed power scopes. My personal preference is either a Leupold M8 6x38 or 6x42, or a Kales 6x42.
 :money:

[flopduster]

I hunt with a springfield 6x20x56 and would never consider going back to a 3x9 scope.  We hunt 16,000 acres and are under a management plan and look very closely before pulling the trigger.  even at 100 yds 20x is great for counting points, estimating spread and age.  It is also very valuable for well placed shots on bucks and for head shots on does. AIM SMALL MISS SMALL!!!  i have never had a problem with close shots or moving targets.I set in on 12x for fast evaluations and then if there is time crank it up to 20x for a closer look.

[7magWoodsman]

It is a bad habit to "judge" anything other than wind through your riflescope! Support your favorite optics manufacturer and dealer and buy some good binoculars.  :wink: