Author Topic: White House weighs broad gun-control agenda in wake of Newtown shootings  (Read 1162 times)

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Offline Dand

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This makes me feel really sick......


Washington Post:
By Philip Rucker, Saturday, January 5, 12:57 PM

The White House is weighing a far broader and more comprehensive approach to curbing the nation’s gun violence than simply reinstating an expired ban on assault weapons and high-capacity ammunition, according to multiple people involved in the administration’s discussions.
A working group led by Vice President Biden is seriously considering measures backed by key law enforcement leaders that would require universal background checks for firearm buyers, track the movement and sale of weapons through a national database, strengthen mental health checks, and stiffen penalties for carrying guns near schools or giving them to minors, the sources said.
To sell such changes, the White House is developing strategies to work around the National Rifle Association that one source said could include rallying support from Wal-Mart and other gun retailers for measures that would benefit their businesses. White House aides have also been in regular contact with advisers to New York Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg (I), an outspoken gun-control advocate who could emerge as a powerful surrogate for the Obama administration’s agenda.
The Biden group, formed last month after the massacre at a Newtown, Conn., elementary school that killed 20 children and six adults, plans to submit a package of recommendations to President Obama this month. Once Obama’s proposals are set, he plans to lead a public-relations offensive to generate popular support.
“They are very clearly committed to looking at this issue comprehensively,” said Dan Gross, president of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, who has been involved in the discussions. The proposals under consideration, he added, are “a deeper exploration than just the assault-weapons ban.”
The gun-control push is just one part of an ambitious political agenda that Obama has pledged to pursue after his decisive reelection victory in November, including comprehensive immigration reform, climate-change legislation and long-term deficit reduction. Obama also faces a reshuffling of his Cabinet, and a looming debate over thenation’s debt ceiling that will compete for his time and attention in the coming months.
Seeking expansive mandate
In addition to potential legislative proposals, Biden’s group has expanded its focus to include measures that would not need congressional approval and could be quickly implemented by executive action, according to interest-group leaders who have discussed options with Biden and key Cabinet secretaries. Possibilities include changes to federal mental-health programs and modernization of gun-tracking efforts by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.
“Simply coming up with one or two aspects of it really falls short of the magnitude of the gun issue in the country,” said Chuck Wexler, executive director of the Police Executive Research Forum.
Wexler was among a dozen law enforcement leaders who met with Biden and other administration leaders in the aftermath of the Dec. 14 massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown. The Dec. 20 summit, which stretched an hour beyond an allotted one hour, included Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr., Education Secretary Arne Duncan, Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano and Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius.
Biden “wanted to talk to us about the assault-weapons ban, automatic weapons, high-capacity magazines,” said Hennepin County (Minn.) Sheriff Richard Stanek, president of the Major County Sheriffs’ Association.
The vice president said the White House group would consider a variety of proposals — from requiring background checks for all gun buyers to creating a new database that would allow the ATF to track all gun sales, according to participants.
Stanek said the meeting also included significant discussion of mental-health issues, violence in video games and movies, and the poor quality of information contained in databases used to conduct criminal background checks before issuing gun permits.
Some of the options the administration is considering may not ultimately be included in Obama’s package. A White House spokesman said Biden’s group was in the midst of its review and has made no decisions on its final recommendations.
The White House is also developing strategies to navigate the rocky and emotionally fraught terrain of gun politics once final policy decisions are made. The administration is quietly talking with a diverse array of interest groups, including religious leaders, mental-health professionals and hunters, to build as broad a coalition as possible, those involved in the discussions said.
The president is expected to face fierce opposition from the NRA and its allies in Congress, including most Republicans and some Democrats.
But Biden signaled to those involved in the policy discussions that the White House is not afraid of taking on the NRA, the nation’s largest gun rights group. At the Dec. 20 meeting, according to Stanek, when one law enforcement leader suggested focusing on only the most popular proposals, Biden responded: “Look, what I’m asking you for is your candid opinion and ideas about extreme gun violence. Leave the politics to the president. That’s our job with Congress.”
NRA officials declined a request for comment. In response to the shooting in Newtown, Wayne LaPierre, the group’s executive vice president, called for installing armed police officers in every school.
“The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun,” LaPierre said at a news conference Dec. 21.
One potential strategy would be to win support for specific measures from interest groups that are normally aligned with the NRA, according to one person who works closely with the administration on gun-related issues and who spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the issue’s sensitivity.
For instance, this person suggested, Wal-Mart and other major gun retailers may have an incentive to support closing a loophole that allows people to bypass background checks if they purchase firearms at gun shows or through other types of private sales. That could result in more people buying guns in retail stores.
Timing is imperative
Obama’s advisers have calculated that the longer they wait, the more distance there is from the Newtown massacre and the greater the risk that the bipartisan political will to tackle gun violence will dissipate.
“This is not something that I will be putting off,” Obama said on NBC’s “Meet the Press” in an interview broadcast last Sunday.
At the White House meeting, Stanek said, “the vice president indicated that there was a very short timeline for him to get back to the president with his recommendations because the American public has a short memory.”
Already, three weeks after the Newtown shooting, gun-control advocates are growing impatient with a legislative process that is just beginning.
“As we get involved in these ad nauseam debates over the Second Amendment, our children are still at risk,” said Jon Adler, national president of the Federal Law Enforcement Officers Association. “Debating is not the action verb we need to protect our children.”
With the start of the 113th Congress last week, several lawmakers filed bills to address gun violence. Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.), who co-wrote a 1994 assault-weapons ban that expired in 2004, plans to introduce legislation this month that would ban the sale or manufacture of about 120 firearms, including semiautomatic rifles and military-style handguns, as well as ammunition magazines that can hold more than 10 rounds.
The expired federal assault-weapons ban prohibited the manufacturing of 19 models of semiautomatic guns classified as assault weapons, including certain rifles and shot guns. The law also banned ammunition magazines capable of holding more than 10 rounds. But it did not ban the sale of previously manufactured assault weapons or high-capacity magazines.
Since the law’s sunset, efforts in Congress over the past decade to reinstate the ban have faced stiff opposition from the NRA and the firearms industry and have never passed.
Adler, who has submitted recommendations to Biden’s group, said he has told administration officials that they need to pursue multiple measures to increase their chances of success.
“We can’t put all our protection-effort eggs in one basket with one piece of legislation,” he said. “We’ve got to do more than that.”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/white-house-weighs-broad-gun-control-agenda-in-wake-of-newtown-shootings/2013/01/05/d281efe0-5682-11e2-bf3e-76c0a789346f_print.html


NRA Life

liberal Justice Hugo Black said, and I quote: "There are 'absolutes' in our Bill of Rights, and they were put there on purpose by men who knew what words meant and meant their prohibitions to be 'absolutes.'" End quote. From a recent article by Wayne LaPierre NRA

Offline Graybeard

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The time is drawing very near that folks are gonna hafta decide how serious they were when they said "when they pry it from my cold dead hands". One way or another they will be coming for them in the not so distant future. It's gonna be ugly.


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Offline Dand

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If you are right GB, it could be really tough on rural folks where everybody knows each other and the likely authorities know who the shooters are and what they have.  I hope LE personnel are doing some soul searching too - what side are THEY going to stand up on?

NRA Life

liberal Justice Hugo Black said, and I quote: "There are 'absolutes' in our Bill of Rights, and they were put there on purpose by men who knew what words meant and meant their prohibitions to be 'absolutes.'" End quote. From a recent article by Wayne LaPierre NRA

Offline BUGEYE

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The time is drawing very near that folks are gonna hafta decide how serious they were when they said "when they pry it from my cold dead hands". One way or another they will be coming for them in the not so distant future. It's gonna be ugly.
I've been talking about this for four years.  I'm too decrepit to fight, but I'll give guns and ammo and make coffee for the folks who are able.

I'll get involved someway.
Give me liberty, or give me death
                                     Patrick Henry

Give me liberty, or give me death
                                     bugeye

Offline yellowtail3

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If you are right GB, it could be really tough on rural folks where everybody knows each other and the likely authorities know who the shooters are and what they have.  I hope LE personnel are doing some soul searching too - what side are THEY going to stand up on?

Sadly, this is an easy prediction - most of them will be on the side of their paychecks and hoped-for pensions, and 'US' side of their US vs THEM worldview.
Jesus said we should treat other as we'd want to be treated... and he didn't qualify that by their party affiliation, race, or even if they're of diff religion.

Offline tom548

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I only hope we can stand up to them this time and win. I also hope the NRA is a strong as they keep telling me they are, I don't  see this strength  but may be they just avoid NY state unless they need money.  The bigest problem we have is that most of the people that should be writing Senators and Legislators don't thinking someone else will do it, then complain about the raw deal we got. Write these people often  even when it fall on deaf ears as 2 of my 3 rep are anti's ( 1 strong anti, 1- 1/2 anti  and 1 pro gun.) Maybe I can keep the one on our side and sway the one still making up her mind.  So in closing WRITE,WRITE,WRITE and then WRITE again till they get to know you.  I think this next 4 yeras will be as bad as it can get

Offline Two Bears

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I read that they are looking at going around the congressional path on this and are just going to do an executive order to instate these new gun mandates.

This bad folks


Fienstien also stated that they are looking at putting guns under a different umbrella that would allow for more sweeping changes easily without a voting process. But arent our gun rights under the highest umbrella "the constitution" fienstien?



HAVING A LIBERAL ALONG IS LIKE LOSING 2 GOOD MEN

Offline briarpatch

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This has been in the works for years, they know what to do and how to do it. They have the forces in place. They will back it up with draconian laws that will still the most ardent opposer. They have now got what they want and no going back. People have allowed this by not trying to get out the vote for good people.
Chalk up where we are now to the OLE SITTING ON THE ASS POLITICS, now it is to late.
Resistance is futile.

Offline Big Blue

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No matter how many citizens or politicians decide that America needs to disarm, we are in the right and covered by the 2nd amendment. This is not a democracy where the majority rules, this is a representative republic and as such the rights of the few are protected from the desires of the many. To deny us these rights, they would be violating the constitution and therefore their oath of office. Any Congressman, Senator and even the President is obligated by oath to faithfully uphold the constitution or face loss of office, imprisonment and or fines. The constitution is on our side in this fight and that's one pretty strong argument in our favor.   

Offline Swampman

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I don't think it's going to amount to much.  Too much time has passed already.  Americans are too self absorbed to remember anything more than 15 minutes.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

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Offline SharonAnne

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as much as the Senate has never had the guts to do anything about it, Executive Orders have no legal basis. No where in the Constitution is the President granted such power. No polititians have had the nerve to tell the President NO, YOU DO NOT HAVE THAT POWER.

EXECUTIVE ORDERS ARE ILLEGAL

Placing firearms in some illegal loophole to avoid the voting process is illegal as hell. It violates THE CONSTITUTION  in 5 different articles of the Bill of Rights. No congressional finagling can skirt the Bill of Rights, as much as they might like to think so.
SharonAnne
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Really, it only hurts when I breath - SharonAnne

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Offline Dand

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Just this morning I listened to this program by On The Media, a private? media scrutiny reporting site.  It was aired on our local public radio station, not an ultraconservative news outlet - that alone catches my attention quite a bit.  Also, I'm NOT into conspiracy theories etc. 


But this stuff really alarms me.  It also makes me realize that with all the new anti terror measures, we have lost a LOT of privacy and any new gun control measures and enforcement has the potential to be on a much much different plane than ANYTHING ever tried before.  In fact we shouldn't even be on these forums or doing emails, etc etc.  Its ALARMING. I'm sure some will chime in to say "I told you so....." but this really woke me up.  There are several segments, I didn't list all but I encourage  you to check them out:


http://www.onthemedia.org/2013/jan/04/


A special hour on privacy - license plate readers, national security letters, surveilling yourself so the government doesn't have to, and OTM producer Sarah Abdurrahman on just how much we misunderstand our privacy online.
[/size][/color]
[/size]OUR PRIVACY DELUSIONS[/font][/color][/font]
[/size]We all claim to want privacy online, but that desire is rarely reflected in our online behavior. OTM producer Sarah Abdurrahman looks into the futile attempts we make to protect our digital identities.[/color]
[/size][/color]
[/size]THE NCTC: OBAMA'S "PRE-CRIME SQUAD"?[/font][/color]
[/size]Last March, the National Counterterrorism Center (NCTC) was granted unprecedented power to collect data on ordinary U.S. citizens, data like flight records or lists of casino employees. Critics have likened the NCTC to the "Pre-Crime Squad" in the movie "Minority Report." Wall Street Journal reporter Julia Angwin talks with Bob about this dramatic shift in the intelligence community's power over US citizens.[/size]
[/size][/color]
[/size]"IF YOU’VE GOT NOTHING TO HIDE, YOU’VE GOT NOTHING TO FEAR"[/font][/color]
[/size]Here's a common refrain in privacy discussions: “If you’ve got nothing to hide, you’ve got nothing to fear.” There's also Google’s then-CEO Eric Schmidt famously saying:  "If you have something that you don't want anyone to know, maybe you shouldn't be doing it in the first place." Brooke speaks with George Washington University law professor Daniel Solove who says those types of arguments misunderstand privacy entirely. [/size]
[/size][/color]
[/size]NATIONAL SECURITY LETTERS AND GAG ORDERS[/font][/color]
[/size]The most serious kind of subpoena - called a 'National Security Letter[/size][/color][/size]' - used to have a lifetime gag-order automatically attached.[/b] That is until [/color]Nicholas Merrill appealed his and won the right to talk about it. Despite 50,000 national security letters a year, there are only three organizations that have ever won the right to say they got one. In a segment that originally aired in January of 2011, Nick Merrill tells Bob why he's the exception and the rule.
[/color]
LICENSE PLATE READERS AND YOUR PRIVACY[/url]

Police car mounted license plate readers collect date, time and location information and are used by law enforcement around the country to help catch criminals. But when Minneapolis Star Tribune reporter Eric Roper filed a Freedom of Information request for information on his own car, he got a lot more than he bargained for. In a segment that originally aired in August of 2012, Bob talks to Roper about how Minneapolis police and agencies across the country deal with this potentially sensitive location information.[/color][/font][/color]
NRA Life

liberal Justice Hugo Black said, and I quote: "There are 'absolutes' in our Bill of Rights, and they were put there on purpose by men who knew what words meant and meant their prohibitions to be 'absolutes.'" End quote. From a recent article by Wayne LaPierre NRA

Offline Dixie Dude

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Congress gave the president executive order privilage in the 1930's under FDR to help get the economy back.  I think they can overrule an executive order, don't know if it is a simple majority or 2/3rds.  Hopefully the Fiscal Clift, and the upcoming Debt Ceiling, and massive cuts to the Military without congress doing something will take all their time.  Also, Chavez is about to die.  China has had the one of their worst winters on record, this might cause prices to go up on their products.  More people are entering the job market than jobs created.  Things are not all rosey, they could get worse economically. 

Offline Dand

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Several speak of an organized effort to counter the current call for gun control.  The folks that introduced me to shooting and the concepts of the 2nd amendment were WW2 vets who had lived in an era when world domination by a malevolent force was a very real threat.  They had fought to stop that evil force and some had even seen the concentration camps and victims.  The potential of evil in men and government had been revealed to them, they lived it, they fought it. 


I never got drafted and have never served. The draft ended a month before I turned 19.  But so many voters these days are another generation or two from those huge conflicts and the very real sense of national peril.  Not to diminish the patriots who are currently or recently involved in our military service and have seen war, I think the greater majority of our population is unaware and badly complacent about threats to our freedoms. 


I fear they won't be ready to protect the freedoms we have today and aren't too likely to support those who are willing to stand up.


 
NRA Life

liberal Justice Hugo Black said, and I quote: "There are 'absolutes' in our Bill of Rights, and they were put there on purpose by men who knew what words meant and meant their prohibitions to be 'absolutes.'" End quote. From a recent article by Wayne LaPierre NRA

Offline Swift One

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Quote
I hope LE personnel are doing some soul searching too

Highly unlikely.  LE for the most part gets their high off eing power hungry and all authorative. 
It's all a hot mess...........

Offline mauser98us

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Ok, gonna take some heat for this. I think some sort of ban and it's assorted items will be passed by congress. I looked at the paper this morning and there have been many more women voted into congress in the last election,mostly democrat. Women tend to react to things more emotionally then men do. More likely to instigate gun bans I would think. Ok you can take me to the woodshed now. ;)

Offline 1marty

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Obama is going to push for a national registration of all firearms. The Repubics have been so beaten up they will cave just as they caved on the tax bill. The UK started with national registration which ended in the seizure of all firearms. Just one interesting note both Feinstein and Schumer have concealed carry permits. A concealed carry permit is almost impossible to get  in NYC but Schumer has it. See, they don't trust the "peasants" to have firearms.

Offline mauser98us

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Also I think a scheme to put excessive taxes on firearms might be an end around on some of the legal issues.

Offline Dand

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Would be nice to find out what Feinstein and Schumer carry or how often. Also if, when, where they practice with their carry arms.  Would love to get a photo of them shooting - might go a long way to blunting some of their BS. Both are so busy I'd guess they rarely fire their arms and I wonder at their ability to use an arm.


Mauser you very well may be right.


World Magazine in the early Jan issue has a listing of all the mass shootings starting at Columbine -its quite a list. Haven't read what they have to say about it. I do fear we may see some unwelcome stuff imposed, my fear is how extensive. 


It still frustrates me that so much will come down on the legal owner user.


One thing I saw attributed to Rahm Emmanuel [sp?] was to create a national registry of gun violators - I'd be curious to find out what that means. Said something like similar to sex offenders.  Well on the surface that would at least appear to target the abusers more than legal folks.  Of course its how it would be implemented.  If a person was charged w a hunting violation - if that was included it could get out of hand really fast.
NRA Life

liberal Justice Hugo Black said, and I quote: "There are 'absolutes' in our Bill of Rights, and they were put there on purpose by men who knew what words meant and meant their prohibitions to be 'absolutes.'" End quote. From a recent article by Wayne LaPierre NRA

Offline lgm270

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There is tremendous opposition to this stuff.   People are buying guns and ammo with both hands.   There is a tremendous divide between the rulers and the ruled.

Also, whites got a real shock  after the last election with blacks and Mexicans crowing about how white people no longer have any power.  I think whites have finally figured out that the non-whtes hate us and want us dead and all this "colorblind" stuff was a scam cooked up by the rulers to persuade whites to surrender.

Look at  who is buying all the guns...it's white people. 


There is a civil war coming and it's going to come down on racial lines.  Your skin color will be your uniform....just like in 1992 in Los Angeles. 
     

Offline Dand

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lgm270 I hope you are really really wrong.  I hope folks don't rush to racist conclusions.  And I hope you and others don't promote this concept just cause it might be more convenient than really working on other solutions.



NRA Life

liberal Justice Hugo Black said, and I quote: "There are 'absolutes' in our Bill of Rights, and they were put there on purpose by men who knew what words meant and meant their prohibitions to be 'absolutes.'" End quote. From a recent article by Wayne LaPierre NRA

Offline Swift One

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lgm270 I hope you are really really wrong.  I hope folks don't rush to racist conclusions.  And I hope you and others don't promote this concept just cause it might be more convenient than really working on other solutions.

I sure dont promote it and while LGM270 is a little out there with some of his stuff- he is right on this one.  At the end of the day, it will come down to what color your skin is in the major cities.
It's all a hot mess...........

Offline powderman

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In my area it's almost impossible to find any 22,  9mm, or 223 ammo except at greatly inflated prices. $9 per 20 rds 7.62x39 seems a bit pricey. POWDERMAN.  >:( >:(
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

Only half the people leave an abortion clinic alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
I learned everything about islam I need to know on 9-11-01.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDqmy1cSqgo
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Offline SharonAnne

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every unilateral action from the White House will be ILLEGAL.   Executive orders are ILLEGAL. remember that
SharonAnne
Luke 22:36-38

Honor the American Soldier and Sailor, the source of Our Freedom

Really, it only hurts when I breath - SharonAnne

An armed society is a polite society - Robert Heinlein

THE TREE OF LIBERTY MUST BE REFRESHED FROM TIME TO TIME WITH THE BLOOD OF PATRIOTS AND TYRANTS - Thomas Jefferson

Offline lgm270

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every unilateral action from the White House will be ILLEGAL.   Executive orders are ILLEGAL. remember that

Those who feel that we have wronged them should be happy they are still alive.

Offline lgm270

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lgm270 I hope you are really really wrong.  I hope folks don't rush to racist conclusions.  And I hope you and others don't promote this concept just cause it might be more convenient than really working on other solutions.

I sure dont promote it and while LGM270 is a little out there with some of his stuff- he is right on this one.  At the end of the day, it will come down to what color your skin is in the major cities.

The answer to people who play the white guilt card:

Those who feel that we have wronged them should be happy they are still alive.