Author Topic: GLOCKS, RELOADS, & HOPEFULLY, COMMON SENSE!  (Read 1285 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Arc Angel

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 48
GLOCKS, RELOADS, & HOPEFULLY, COMMON SENSE!
« on: September 21, 2003, 06:30:29 PM »
Oh, am I in trouble!  My wife has confiscated my new Glocks.  Someone told her that Glocks have a tendency to go kaBoom!; and she is refusing to let me, either, reload the way I usually do, or else give up my new Glock Model 21's.  (Yeah, Slim chance!) 

Here's what I've come back at her with:  First, after six reloads I have promised to throw away the brass, and buy all new cases. 

Second, I always wash and polish my brass before reloading; so I have ample opportunity to inspect the cases - certainly much more so than these companies that run progressive presses all day long, and actually check very little. 

Third, I will use my 45 acp case gauge to check my cases out, even further, if this will make her happy; and, yes, I use a small right angle pick to rub the inside of any cases that arouse my suspicion.  (Is this, really, necessary for six time reloads?) 

I, almost never, load at the top of the chart; and I, certainly, wouldn't do this with reloads intended for use in my Glocks. 

I keep meticulous specifications and records for ALL of my reloads; therefore, it is, extremely, unlikely that I will use any of this brass more than I have promised or intend to do.  (To be perfectly frank, I ALMOST, never pick up range brass; but I have, sometimes, grabbed new cases from novice shooters who didn't want them after they'd been fired one time.)   

Lastly, if it will calm her down, (She doesn't want to be a widow.) I will, even buy two aftermarket, button-swaged, conventionally chambered barrels for my new Glocks.  Honestly I was thinking about doing this, anyway. 

By the way, I always wear hearing muffs, and expensive industrial quality, machinist's, safety glasses whenever I shoot - have for many years! 

Could I be anymore careful?  I'm going to let my wife read anything you guys decide to reply; so, please, give me a couple of good arguments or testimonials, here, will you!  I don't want to give up these, perhaps, not really perfect but very smooth shooting, truly feature loading, and easily owner modified and serviced combat pistols. 

(My scores have, actually, gone up since I became used to the excellent Glock trigger!) 

Thanks very much,  'A' 
Illegitimati Non Carborundum!

Offline Savage

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4397
GLOCKS, RELOADS, & HOPEFULLY, COMMON SE
« Reply #1 on: September 22, 2003, 12:45:05 PM »
AA,
I have owned a Glock 21 for a little over three years now. The only factory ammo I have fired was to cycle out duty ammo twice a year. My 21 fires thousands of reloads a year. I shoot it for fun, pratice, and IDPA. All manufactures add a disclamer to their product to discourage the use of reloaded ammo. In today's society, who can blame them? I bought an aftermarket barrel for my 21, as my primary IDPA load is lead. The case head in a 21 is no less supported than some of my 1911s. When you consider that the operating pressures of the 45ACP are about half that of the 9mm and .40, I wouldn't be overly concerned with a case head seperation. In over thirty years of reloading I have never had a case head seperation in a straight walled pistol case. I think all this crap started when the .40 was introduced. By adapting the 9mm size guns to take the larger .40 cartridge (and equally high pressure), some of the safety margin was compromised that had been built into the 9mm envelope. The .45 ACP is probably one of the safest cartridges to reload.
No worries mate!
Stay Safe,
Savage
An appeaser is one who feeds the crocodile hoping it will eat him last,

Offline Alice Cooper

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 142
GLOCKS, RELOADS, & HOPEFULLY, COMMON SE
« Reply #2 on: September 22, 2003, 07:03:43 PM »
this past suday, i was burning up some 45 acp in my g21. some homecast 185 grainers that didn't work out , feeding wise, and i wanted my cases back.i was loading the mags and my buddy was shooting. after two boxes, three cases ejected onto the bench with severe bulges at the feed ramp.never saw this before in my shooting.the previous rounds showed no excess pressure signs whatsoever.these same rounds were fired in a kimber custom with no bulging. i can only surmise that the pressures were rising in the glock  for what ever reason, lead build up, etc.but upon cleaning, i saw no more build up than normal. so i'll shoot lead reloads, but i'll be checking and cleaning the glock barrel more often. by the way, this 21 will shoot right there with the kimber, maybe better!
don't fry bacon naked!

Offline Savage

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4397
GLOCKS, RELOADS, & HOPEFULLY, COMMON SE
« Reply #3 on: September 23, 2003, 02:05:35 AM »
AC,
Because of the poligonal bore of the 21 it takes very little leading to elevate pressures. Your bulged cases are a wittness to that. For about $60 you can get a rifiled barrel for you 21 and eliminate the problem. Those bulged cases are trying to tell you something!
Stay Safe,
Savage
An appeaser is one who feeds the crocodile hoping it will eat him last,

Offline Alice Cooper

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 142
GLOCKS, RELOADS, & HOPEFULLY, COMMON SE
« Reply #4 on: September 23, 2003, 04:51:58 AM »
yep, i knew all that, i was just very surprised to see pressure signs come so fast! and with so little apparent leading.i had never before ran that many rounds of lead thru it without brushing.the cases went from no pressure signs to severe bulges in just a matter of a few rounds, couldn't find any progressive bulging , just bam! i got a feeling the bullet had a lot to do with it, as lee tumble lube swc's have never showed signs of leading, but this was a lyman 185 gr. mold, and never did look "right" to me...
don't fry bacon naked!

Offline Arc Angel

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 48
GLOCKS, Reloads, & (Hopefully) Common Sense
« Reply #5 on: September 24, 2003, 03:28:13 PM »
:D  Hey, Guys, Thanks for your replies.  Here's what I've learned so far: 

Barrels on all Glocks are cold-rolled, and mandrel formed.  The rifling on Models 20 and 21 is OCTAGONAL; all other Glocks are hexagonal. 

There have been reports that some Glocks have been made with sub-standard steel; and this is considered to be one of the factors in several kaBoom! explosions - particularly in regard to the Models 20 and 21. 

Reloading kaBoom!'s seem to occur with much greater frequency with two particular pistol powders:  Accurate Arms #5, and Vihta Vuori #N350; OR their bulk powder equivalents in other commercial ammunition. 

I'll take my best guess, here, and say that it looks like the ignited powder's, 'pressure curve' may spike excessively; consequently, these two powders aren't going to show up on my Glock reloading bench any time soon. 

Lead bullets are a definite, 'No-No!' in any Glock factory barrel.  The combination of a pronounced chamber leade, (the sharp shoulder at the front of the chamber) polygonal rifling, and lead bullet sizes that tend to increase by as much as .002" ALL contribute to rapid, excessive chamber pressures in the Glock pistol. 

Something, else, seems to be happening, too:  Watch your reloads and repeatedly chambered factory rounds for, 'Bullet Set-back.'  There are reports that as little as 1/10th " can more than double standard chamber pressures. 

Finally, 'A CLEAN GLOCK IS A SAFE GLOCK!'  In spite of those silly ads about:  mud, gravel, snow, and auto abuse torture tests, the fact is that too many Glocks have a demonstrable tendency to fire out-of-battery; AND dirt exacerbates this problem.  (Sounds like something in the, 'Safe Trigger' setup needs to be redesigned.) 

Does this mean that we should, ALL, rush out and sell our Glocks?  No, not at all.  This evening I talked with a fellow NRA instructor who has many more years' experience at firearm training than I do.  He has assured me that the ONLY pistols that stood up to daily abuse at his public range are the Glocks.  He, also, mentioned the bad luck he's had with several other brands of pistols!  In his words; 'The Smith & Wesson  autos will be the first to go!'  (THIS from an S&W fan!) 

He is, just, one more in a growing number of people I trust who have, now, told me that they have shot thousands and thousands of rounds through their Glock pistols without a problem!  The important point seems to be, 'YOU NEED TO KNOW WHAT YOU'RE DOING; AND THE USUAL RULES OF CAUTION CONTINUE TO APPLY!' 

Every Glock pistol is a tool and should be treated with the care, caution, and necessary prior knowledge necessary to use any mechanical device safely. 

In my humble opinion, if Gaston Glock wants to be remembered among future generations of gunmen with the same fondness as John Browning, Sam Colt, and Dan Wesson, then, he would do well to stop procrastinating and improve the present Glock trigger mechanism into a truly, 'Safe-Action' design without any tendency, at all, to fire out-of-battery, and lose that partially supported firing chamber thing! 

These, 'plastic gun' quirks have been around long enough, now, to be known as historically, well-recognized, design flaws.  Americans use firearms and reload ammunition more than any other society on the face of the Earth.  It's about time for Glock design and manufacturing to catch up with the rest of us!   

Oh, by the way, I'm keeping my Glock 21's; I shoot them very well; and I like how they look and feel.  It intrigues me to be able to fix, just about, anything on a Glock without spending a small fortune at the gunsmith's the way I used to.  I was able to talk my wife into marrying me, in the first place; so I should be able to fool her, some more, and get to keep my Glocks! 

Thanks again, guys, your comments have given me the confidence I was looking for; and, trust me, I will be extra careful at the range.    ;)   

Regards, 'AA' 
Illegitimati Non Carborundum!

Offline 1GLOCK

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 134
GLOCKS, RELOADS, & HOPEFULLY, COMMON SE
« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2003, 08:52:15 AM »
I think the key to reloading for your Glocks is to #1 choose a powder thats a little lower pressure #2 stay away from lead bullets #3 pay attention to what youre doing. Ive been reloading for my G22 for a while now without any problems. I use rainier 155gr FP TCJ bullets over 5.7 grains of WST seated just under max OAL and ditch the cases after 3 or 4 reloads.

Offline Arc Angel

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 48
Where I'm at now!
« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2003, 01:28:57 PM »
:D  Been through, something like, a thousand rounds since the last post.  I'm presently using 7.6 grns of Unique, stoking a 185 grain Remington JHP bullet.  I've switched cases from standard design to Remington +P cases; (heavier in the web area, and available from Midway) and so far so good!  

Quite honestly I am, slowly, learning to trust the Model 21, 'platform.'  The other thing I've done is to upgrade to Wolff Gunsprings.  I've replaced the factory striker spring with a Wolff, 'extra-power,' 6#, striker spring.  (This has, really, worked well for me - much better ignition on the reloads with only an infinitesimal perceived increase in trigger pull!)  

I, also, switched over to the Wolff, 'non-captured' steel guide rod and a standard 17# recoil spring.  (Very nice and completely indestructible!)  As a matter of fact, when I laid the stock factory springs out next to the new Wolff gunsprings I was very impressed with how much better made these Wolff Gunsprings appear to be:  better metal, tighter coils, and shorter (less spongy) springs!  

I, really, appreciate everyone getting back to me.  Thanks for, all, your help!   8)

Regards, 'AA'
Illegitimati Non Carborundum!

Offline m60a3

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 5
GLOCKS, RELOADS, & HOPEFULLY, COMMON SE
« Reply #8 on: February 21, 2004, 05:35:44 PM »
I've been shooting a 20 for about as long as they've been around. Never had any problem with it or my 17 or my 19. I think I would try some Bluedot instead of the Unique for full power loads. The unique has a tendency to build pressure fast as you approach max loads. Bluedot is somewhat like H110, a little more forgiving. I use alot of unique for lead bullet loads at mid range velocities but I never use it with jacketed bullets. If I'm going to spend the money for jacketed slugs I expect to get max performance out of them. In the autoloaders with less capacity I use Bluedot and with the revolvers I use H110. You should expect to get about 100 fps better velocities with bluedot at the same pressure level as unique. Even more with heavy bullets.
Have your musket clean as a whistle, hatchet scoured, sixty rounds powder and ball, and be ready to march at moments notice.
Standing Orders
Roger's Rangers-1759