25-06 for Bear

[Lloyd Smale]

speaking of pappys my grandfather hunted for over 50 years and i dont know how many deer and black bear he killed here in michigan but its a bunch. Only gun he ever owned was a 92 winchester in 3220. I dont ever remember even having to track game he shot at. I can remember him at camp laughing at my dad for having a 3030. Said they mess up way to much meat. I wonder what hed say today at me out shooting deer in the farm fields with a 300 ultra or 7stw

[pastorp]

I owned a 32/20 for a while but all I shot with it was jackrabbits. It was a nice gun though. A browning copy of the Winchester 53.

Your grandpaw probably didn't shoot at deer 500 yards away Lloyd.  wonder what he would say about the distances you shoot?

[D Fischer]

speaking of pappys my grandfather hunted for over 50 years and i dont know how many deer and black bear he killed here in michigan but its a bunch. Only gun he ever owned was a 92 winchester in 3220. I dont ever remember even having to track game he shot at. I can remember him at camp laughing at my dad for having a 3030. Said they mess up way to much meat. I wonder what hed say today at me out shooting deer in the farm fields with a 300 ultra or 7stw

There's hunter's and then there is shooter's.

[fatercat]

i may be wrong about this, but think about it.  people years ago lived by throwing pointed sticks . killed enough to live on, thats why we are here. then ball and powder and flint. then smokeless powder and the 30-30 killed most if not every animal on earth. then ww11 and came the 30-06 was here, plenty of gun for all game.  then gun sales went down so they had to come up with new ways to get your money. and did they ever. all the new short and long magnums. and the shotgun boys worked your ass over as well. 2 3/4"  then the 3" and now the 3 1/2". in the next few years they will come up with new ways to get your money. and some of you will be at the gun shop with your gun in hand and money. and they will get it.  so whats new?

[FPH]

I do think hunting pressure was less and I know hunting regulations were less limiting......Yes?

[Lloyd Smale]

grandpa hunted at our camp where shots never get over a 100 yards unless you set it up on purpose so he never had to consider shooting across a field at a deer 500 yards out. He was proud of his marksmanship though and would probably be a bit proud that his grandson can pull it off reliably. I know hes sure shake his head though if i showed up at camp with a mag rifle! 

I owned a 32/20 for a while but all I shot with it was jackrabbits. It was a nice gun though. A browning copy of the Winchester 53.

Your grandpaw probably didn't shoot at deer 500 yards away Lloyd.  wonder what he would say about the distances you shoot?

[Lloyd Smale]

Not nessisarily up here. Bag limits are much more liberal then theyve ever been. when my dad was young it was one buck a year and about every 5 years they allowed doe permits. Now its two bucks a year and in our area doe permits are only limited by the fact you can only buy one a day for about 3 months. Hunting pressure is probably less too. Used to be there were no deer in lower michigan so most hunters came up here. Used to see 10 mile long lines of hunters crossing the bridge to the UP. Now theres as many if not more deer down there and along with the price of gas it keeps most of them below the bridge. Used to be the 10 mile ride down the county road to camp looked like a West Virginia trailer park. Now you might see one or two campers.

I do think hunting pressure was less and I know hunting regulations were less limiting......Yes?

[FPH]

Sorry for the confusion Lloyd.  I meant 1800's with long stick rifles.

[D Fischer]

grandpa hunted at our camp where shots never get over a 100 yards unless you set it up on purpose so he never had to consider shooting across a field at a deer 500 yards out. He was proud of his marksmanship though and would probably be a bit proud that his grandson can pull it off reliably. I know hes sure shake his head though if i showed up at camp with a mag rifle! 

I owned a 32/20 for a while but all I shot with it was jackrabbits. It was a nice gun though. A browning copy of the Winchester 53.

Your grandpaw probably didn't shoot at deer 500 yards away Lloyd.  wonder what he would say about the distances you shoot?

It's not necessary to shoot over 100 yds today, unless you set it up on purpose! There is never a requirement to shoot unless your being charged by a dangerious animal, that would be well under 100 yds!

[nomosendero]

grandpa hunted at our camp where shots never get over a 100 yards unless you set it up on purpose so he never had to consider shooting across a field at a deer 500 yards out. He was proud of his marksmanship though and would probably be a bit proud that his grandson can pull it off reliably. I know hes sure shake his head though if i showed up at camp with a mag rifle! 

I owned a 32/20 for a while but all I shot with it was jackrabbits. It was a nice gun though. A browning copy of the Winchester 53.

Your grandpaw probably didn't shoot at deer 500 yards away Lloyd.  wonder what he would say about the distances you shoot?

It's not necessary to shoot over 100 yds today, unless you set it up on purpose! There is never a requirement to shoot unless your being charged by a dangerious animal, that would be well under 100 yds!

We are not going to do the silly stuff on this thread.

Of course Lloyd's Grandpa did not shoot 500 yards with a 32/20 & iron sights, being a good hunter he shot within his capabilities & his weapon's, in his case his ability was likely beyond his rifle's, but it doesn't matter.

Like Lloyd said, his Grandpa would likely be proud of his shots & why not if Lloyd does exactly the same thing as his Grandpa did, not going beyond what he or his weapon can do within the weather conditions, etc.

I employ those principles, whether I am carrying my bow, hand gun, muzzleloader or Long Range rifle, the same rules apply with each.

Stating that there is no necessity or reason to shoot beyond any given yardage someone arbitrarily concocts is a bit retarded, as stated before in other threads over & over & has no place here.

[pastorp]

Don't understand who your directing your comments to nomosendero, but my comments were not intended to be critical. 

[FPH]

grandpa hunted at our camp where shots never get over a 100 yards unless you set it up on purpose so he never had to consider shooting across a field at a deer 500 yards out. He was proud of his marksmanship though and would probably be a bit proud that his grandson can pull it off reliably. I know hes sure shake his head though if i showed up at camp with a mag rifle! 

I owned a 32/20 for a while but all I shot with it was jackrabbits. It was a nice gun though. A browning copy of the Winchester 53.

Your grandpaw probably didn't shoot at deer 500 yards away Lloyd.  wonder what he would say about the distances you shoot?

It's not necessary to shoot over 100 yds today, unless you set it up on purpose! There is never a requirement to shoot unless your being charged by a dangerious animal, that would be well under 100 yds!

We are not going to do the silly stuff on this thread.

Of course Lloyd's Grandpa did not shoot 500 yards with a 32/20 & iron sights, being a good hunter he shot within his capabilities & his weapon's, in his case his ability was likely beyond his rifle's, but it doesn't matter.

Like Lloyd said, his Grandpa would likely be proud of his shots & why not if Lloyd does exactly the same thing as his Grandpa did, not going beyond what he or his weapon can do within the weather conditions, etc.

I employ those principles, whether I am carrying my bow, hand gun, muzzleloader or Long Range rifle, the same rules apply with each.

Stating that there is no necessity or reason to shoot beyond any given yardage someone arbitrarily concocts is a bit retarded, as stated before in other threads over & over & has no place here.

I have to object to your use of the word "retarded".  People with this challenge have not ( in most cases) done anything to cause this challenge.  Your use of the word is degrading.  There but for the grace of God go you.  Please refrain from such references in the future.  Thanks for reading my rant.....pet peeve.

[nomosendero]

Don't understand who your directing your comments to nomosendero, but my comments were not intended to be critical. 

It was toward the 100 yard comment, this will not be a shooting VS hunting thread, not toward you at all.
 
FPH, you are correct about my comment, it was not the best choice of words, for that I aplogize.
 
But again, we are not going the so called "ethics" path or what is "needed", most people don't "need" to hunt or shoot at any range but "want' to. If we start talking about what range we "need" to shoot, I will have to shut it down.
Thanks for the kind objections.
 

[FPH]

Thanks

[Lloyd Smale]

Most of my long range shooting is crop damage deer killing not hunting and wed sure be limiting ourselves if we refused to shoot a deer over a 100 yards. Even a 300 yard limit would probably cut our numbers in half. Like nomosendero infered. Skill levels and equiptment are what determines your max range. Some shoot as well at 400 yards as others do a 100. Your own limit should be based on your own ability and not pushed onto someone else thats capable of more then you. Its also why you usually see me preaching the pro side of the mag rifle arguements. Yes lesser guns kill at long range but i like deer to die quickly not run off 300yards.  But go back to the original question and look at typical bear hunting ranges, typical under 50 yards and youd surely get my nod for a smaller gun then id use a 400 on a deer.  Yes i dont need to kill deer at any range. I can afford beef that someone else killed. But i want to put my own meat in the freezer and for  me anyway that means i need to learn to shoot. I hope this post isnt taken as an arguement with anyone. Hunt is a funny subject that tends to raise hackles on many guys. Some think there way or the highway. My opinion is that as long as what you do is legal its none of my bussiness. nomosendero if you feel this post is out of line in the least little bit feel free to delete it.

[nomosendero]

Most of my long range shooting is crop damage deer killing not hunting and wed sure be limiting ourselves if we refused to shoot a deer over a 100 yards. Even a 300 yard limit would probably cut our numbers in half. Like nomosendero infered. Skill levels and equiptment are what determines your max range. Some shoot as well at 400 yards as others do a 100. Your own limit should be based on your own ability and not pushed onto someone else thats capable of more then you. Its also why you usually see me preaching the pro side of the mag rifle arguements. Yes lesser guns kill at long range but i like deer to die quickly not run off 300yards.  But go back to the original question and look at typical bear hunting ranges, typical under 50 yards and youd surely get my nod for a smaller gun then id use a 400 on a deer.  Yes i dont need to kill deer at any range. I can afford beef that someone else killed. But i want to put my own meat in the freezer and for  me anyway that means i need to learn to shoot. I hope this post isnt taken as an arguement with anyone. Hunt is a funny subject that tends to raise hackles on many guys. Some think there way or the highway. My opinion is that as long as what you do is legal its none of my bussiness. nomosendero if you feel this post is out of line in the least little bit feel free to delete it.

Spot on as far as I'm concerned.