Making a Bomb

[Sourdough]

The news media keep making such a big deal about one of the bombers bragging "He knew how to make a bomb".  While that might help show intent, it does not mean anything about having special knowledge.  Almost any college student has that knowledge.  Smart High School students have that knowledge.  Firemen, and anyone that works with flamables  has that knowledge.  Reloaders have that knowledge.  Many of our men and women who have recently returned from the big sand box have that knowledge.  That knowledge and some common sense, and almost anyone on the street can make a bomb.  Look at McVay.  The difference is, True Americans would not do that.  True Americans don't want to blow up fellow Americans.  We want to live in peace, and it's just not right.

That said maybe it will let True Americans know we are very vulnerable.  Now that the seed of an idea has been planted, how long will it take for the other dissatisfied groups to jump on the band wagon and start making bombs to make their statement.  The Mexicans that want to take Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, and California back under Mexican Rule.  The drug Cartels, to warn us to get out of their way.  And any other radical group (Sucking up out welfare) that wants to make a statement.  What I'm trying to say is, "Look out, there is more to come".  The list of banned substances is going to go out of sight.  When I lived in California, during the VN War, some whack job made a bomb using a common gas Plumbers used.  Suddenly I had to sign to get those gas bottles and keep a record of where I used them.   Last time I was in California they still had that requirement, but that was years ago.  Here in Alaska I can go down and buy all I want, no questions asked.

We live with the threat of bombs every day here where I live.  The Pipeline (that runs righ5 behind my house) has been bombed twice.  Those bombers had little knowledge and no common sense.  It took a drunk to damage the pipeline.

And look at the movies.  How many remember the old Charles Bronson movie, "The Mechanic"?

[Shu]

Yes, bombs are very easy to make. You don't need gun powder or an advanced chemistry degree. I wonder when congress will want to out law bombs for the ordinary citizen.
 
When a gun is used the libs want gun control when a bomb is used they want terrorists hunted, when a car is used it's just something that was tragic. Maybe we should start looking at the person behind the tool used and make informed decisions.

[magooch]

There must be something about bombs that sparks the imagination of muslim terrorists, because if they just wanted to kill and maim a bunch of people there are any number of ways that don't require a bomb, or guns, or any special knowledge. 


Let's not go into specifics, because we don't know who is reading this and we sure don't want to give anyone ideas.

[Brett]

Come on SHU, that makes too much sence. 

[Sourdough]

Magooch:  You are right, we don't need to go into specifics.  That's why I stayed away from them in my original post. 

I got into trouble in high school chemistry for making a very volitile mixture.  I took a formula for this and a formula for that, put 2&2 together and cooked it up.  School was evacuated till I took it out side and got rid of it.  I was 14 at the time.  I flunked chemistry, wonder why?

All I am saying is folks be on the lookout.  Especially if you live in or frequent a highly populated area.  Or go somewhere of historical significance.

[Conan The Librarian]

I hope its not that easy to do. For one thing it seems like they used some kind of remote trigger. I hope those are hard to do. I wouldnt know where to start and i dont want to know. We dont need more crazy people with crazy ideas. I pray we dont have a rash of copycat bombings and i pray that the loonies stay with guns because they are harder to use effectively.

[JonnyReb]

[quote author=Conan The Librarian link=topic=279874.msg1099706701#msg1099706701.                                           i pray that the loonies stay with guns because they are harder to use effectively.
[/quote]

 Lets pray for peace instead 

[Conan The Librarian]

Yeah, you're right.

[Ranger99]

unfortunately in this well informed age of
instant computer information, anything desired,
no matter how kooky or off the wall is available
at one's fingertips. also unfortunate is the
numbers of parents who let their children
roam the internet unfettered and unsupervised
to be exposed to the world's garbage. i recently
saw where teen girls chug colored milk, then
vomit it up to make patterns on the ground.
what's so neat and interesting about that???

[kennyd]

the boss used to buy firecracker "kits" through the mail.  In Colorado we had to go to Wyo. for M-80's.  As I remember, they and cherry bombs were about $20 per gross.  About 20 years ago I asked at a stand and the guy about had an attack.   I didn't know the laws had changed.  I would still like to take the kids out and let them see and hear one go off.  I don't know if you can even find them in Mexico now.  And it would be foolish to try to bring any through, or make your own with all the laws now.  I value my (such as it is) freedom to own and shoot guns.


Google bomb making and see what you come up wth.  There is no way to keep the know how supressed.  And I am sure these threads get attention from automatic readers the gov. has.  HI guys, 

[Shu]

Making a bomb is just releasing stored energy. Some chemicals have a tremendous amount in them. It is how it is released that makes them dangerous. There are lots of things that store energy in the house, you just have to know how to release it. With the age of the internet education is at your finger tips. How you use that information is up to you.

[Sourdough]

Ever seen "Myth Busters" drop Mentos into a 2 liter bottle of diet coke.  That's stored energy releasing.

[Shu]

Sourdough,
Exactly the point!! Have you seen the episodes about gas pressures from large cylinders? You don't need high explosives.

[BBF]

They are  offering 50K's as a reward?? A whole lot of "cheap" there considering what might be at stake.

[Sourdough]

Shu:  Just the point.  My neighbor and I were sitting and discussing this problem.  Then we started brainstorming about how to make explosive devices.  Both of us having spent a life time working around certain equipment, and materials, could come up with lots of ways.  We both have seen accidental explosions that killed fellow workers.  We knew what happened because we worked with that equipment or material ourselves.  Then my son came in who has never worked with any of these, but has had chemistry in College, along with some engineering courses.  Also minor experience with guns and reloading.  He came up with things and modifications on our ideas that would double or triple the pressures.  It's down right scary the things that can be used and how easy it is.  Even triggers or timers are so easy.

Many people think Black Powder is hard to get.  A friend I met while in the AF came from Eastern Tennessee.  His family makes Black Powder.  They run a small powder mill and sell the powder they make to a larger supplier.  Jerry invited me to come and visit, and I am thinking about taking him up on that invite.  The ingredients are fairly common, and the formula is not hard to find.  I took a stab at making some once just for the heck of it.  While it was not as good as the stuff I buy, it did work.  Sent my .50 cal round ball out to the target.  A little low, but it got there.  I had used a poor quality of charcoal, and my formula was a bit off, but it can be done.  I used the rest of that batch in my classes to demonstrate the difference between gun powder and Black Powder.

[Shu]

Sourdough,
That is exactly how easy it is. Ever see the old pump up fire extinguishers explode ( over pressure would be the correct term)There is enough in those little bottles to do some damage to the person pumping them. The old split rim wheels when airing up would send that ring flying and the pressure is still pretty low.
 
I worked with a lot of the real good explosives in my career. I have seen first hand how devastating it can be. It doesn't take a genius or a rocket science. Hydraulic pressure on heavy construction equipment, a hot water heater with malfunction pressure relief and the list could go on.
 
 

[BBF]

Ooops, I gave them more credit and I need to read slower.

[Sourdough]

Read back through history about the hundreds of people who died when boilers exploded in the old River Boats on the Mississippi.  I've investigated Hot Water Heater explosions where I found the heater tank a block away, after going through the roof then no telling how high.  The Oxygen bottle I knocked over when I was 12 in Dad's welding shop.  The valve hit the corner of a grader blade.  We found the bottle 1/2 mile away.  Out in a field, after going through the roof of the shop.  (Got a whupin over that one).  Then we see all kinds of things in the movies.  Some are hookey, others work.  Then look at the "How to show on TV"  Myth busters, yes a lot of the things they do are a bust.  But some work, and work good.

Every year people leave partial bottles of propane at the cabin.  We have no use for it out there, since we use Coleman Fuel for the lantern, and wood to cook and heat.  So when Sky was small, he and Eric would take the bottles and set them up about 50 yards away.  Then they would shoot them with the .22s.  Most would just fall over.  Some would have enough pressure to go spinning off in not telling what direction.  But they would fizzle after 15 to 20 yards.  Maybe one in 30 would blow up.  Flames 15-20 feet in the air.  Fireball 15 to 20 feet in diameter, then gone.  That's what the boys was looking for.  Yet in the movies they always go BOOM.

And for the people that are going to say I let my kid do something dangerous, I don't think so.  You raise your kid your way, and I'll raise mine my way.  Hockey did a lot more damage to the boy than any thing else. 

[SHOOTALL]

Yes water in a vessel and fire can make a big boom. But so can a pressure tank and a submersible water pump. One commercial job I worked on had the system installed by others . They neglected to install a pressure relief valve. The expansion tank was in the basement of a Country Club building. Well the pressure switch failed to cut the pump off. When the tank ruptured it went thru the first and  second floors then the attic floor then the slate roof. It was found out on the golf course quit a ways away. G. Gordon LIDDY on his talk show would mention the old agent bomb made with a propane torch kit from a hardware store and a candle. Claimed it very effective.
 Bottom line those of us not well versed in bombs may need to learn to recognize what they are made of and what they look like so as to know what to avoid and when to call police.

[Sourdough]

I can think of many things far more dangerous than a pressure cooker.  It's just in the middle east they are every where, in everyones homes.  Very inconspicious, so a good choice for over there.  They work, but if the bombers had taken them out of the back packs they would have looked out of place.  By conceiling them in a back pack they looked normal.

[dakotashooter2]

Heck most of us could makea  toxic gas with just the chemicals under our sink.......................

[blind ear]

A bad pressure relief valve on a hot water heater can explode much of a house. A pay for use cell phone from WM  can be a remote trigger anywhere that you can get signal. ear

[SHOOTALL]

Heck most of us could makea  toxic gas with just the chemicals under our sink.......................

 or good bean soup ! 

[SHOOTALL]

A bad pressure relief valve on a hot water heater can explode much of a house. A pay for use cell phone from WM  can be a remote trigger anywhere that you can get signal. ear

 I have seen several homes destroyed from such , one a fireman put a pipe plug in the thread-o-let the RV was supposed to screw into. took out one house and damaged two more . 1000 to 1100 sq ft homes.

[Sourdough]

Sky came in looking over my shoulder reading this.  "DAD, your going to have the ATF&E paying us a visit'.  Guess I better cool it.  He saw several of the web sites I had gone to just out of curiosity.