cast mix question

[WildcatTC]

Guy,

Waht would be the correct mixter  ratio  of Linotype and Wheel weights for bullets in the 1900 to 2200 FPS range?

Thanks

[Lloyd Smale]

for up to 2000 I use a 5050 mix any faster and I use pure linotype.

[WildcatTC]

Thanks for the reply.I know what to do now

[wener]

velocity required for expansion at various hardness's  (pure lead 5-6 bhn.= 1150 to 1200 fps) (air cooled, aged ww. 12 to 13 bhn.=1350 to1400 fps) (no.2 alloy 16bhn. = 1600 to 1700 fps. ( lino and ww. water dropped 20,22 bhn. = 1900 to 2200 fps.) ( heat treated ww. 30-35 bhn. = 2300 to 2500 fps.

[Louis Farrugia]

HI LlOYD SMALE

IT SEEMS YOU HAVE A LOT OF LOADING EXPERINS SO YOU MITE HELP ME , I JUST BOUGHT A MAGMA  CASTER < AND 600 KILOS OF FIRST CLASS LINOTYPE I INTEND  TO CAST FOR OTHERS .WHICH IS THE RIGHT  MIX FOR TARGET SHOOTING  PISTOLS//  AND RIFLES .
THANKS IN ADVANCE
LOUIS
KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK .

for up to 2000 I use a 5050 mix any faster and I use pure linotype.

[Lloyd Smale]

what ive come to use for .38 specials and low velocity .44 and .45s is 5050wheelwieght and pure or ww and range lead. If im going into 900fps or more i use ww or ww + 2%tin. In the 1100 to 1300fps I use ww and #%tin and a little antimony or just use #2lyman alloy. For high velocity handgun most of my handgun hunting and midrange rifle i use 5050 ww and lynotype. This is alot more info then you really need i just like to play. Honestly you could get by with just ww for anything up to 1200fps and 5050ww lyno for everthing else. I only will use straight lyno for high velocity rifle loads and really havent found a use for alot of that. Save your lyno for alloying For most handgun bullets its actually to hard. It makes pretty bullets but they take high pressure loading to slug up at all in a barrel and you will find accuracty could suffer at light loading data and leading can actually increase. Problem is most people who buy bullets have had it drummed into there heads that harder is better but thats not actually the case. If your buying alloy for everything id suggest something equivelent to lyman #2 it works in most applications. My best advise to someone who wants to cast commerial is take the time to stack your bullets well in a box so you can use a soft lube for shipping most of the problems with commercial bullets is that crap hard lube they put on them. I feel for them though as ive sent bullets in the mail and they take a beating. Good luck

[Leftoverdj]

Lloyd is pretty much on the money as always.

I simplify things a bit. My stock alloy is five parts WW to one part lino. That works well for me with a couple of limitations. I don't shoot really hot plain base magnum pistol loads and I waterquench for GC rifle loads.

Were I casting commercially, I'd offer a basic line and "magnum bullets" at a somewhat higher price. For the great range of loading, a moderately soft alloy is better. I would also suggest that you make sure your bullets are big enough. Undersized bullets cause a lot more problems than alloy.

I've had good results shipping with the "box inside a box" method. The outer container gets a good beating, but if the bullets are packed too tightly to rattle in an inner container, they travel well.

[Louis Farrugia]

HI Lloyd smale

THANKS FOR THE INFORMATION AND YOUR TIME.

KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK

LOUIS

what ive come to use for .38 specials and low velocity .44 and .45s is 5050wheelwieght and pure or ww and range lead. If im going into 900fps or more i use ww or ww + 2%tin. In the 1100 to 1300fps I use ww and #%tin and a little antimony or just use #2lyman alloy. For high velocity handgun most of my handgun hunting and midrange rifle i use 5050 ww and lynotype. This is alot more info then you really need i just like to play. Honestly you could get by with just ww for anything up to 1200fps and 5050ww lyno for everthing else. I only will use straight lyno for high velocity rifle loads and really havent found a use for alot of that. Save your lyno for alloying For most handgun bullets its actually to hard. It makes pretty bullets but they take high pressure loading to slug up at all in a barrel and you will find accuracty could suffer at light loading data and leading can actually increase. Problem is most people who buy bullets have had it drummed into there heads that harder is better but thats not actually the case. If your buying alloy for everything id suggest something equivelent to lyman #2 it works in most applications. My best advise to someone who wants to cast commerial is take the time to stack your bullets well in a box so you can use a soft lube for shipping most of the problems with commercial bullets is that crap hard lube they put on them. I feel for them though as ive sent bullets in the mail and they take a beating. Good luck

[wener]

i can't stand this any more! not to step on any toes but 5050 lino and wheel weight is just a waste of lino, in an rcbs 20# bottom pour pot, to no more than 1#and a half of lino will jump from 10 to at least 19 on the brinnel for pressures around 2000 plus!!! i have proven this extensively over the 25 year period of casting bullets!!! i do have a few secrets in consistency, so feel free!!

[Lloyd Smale]

Im allways open to education. I have a cabintree and a lbt tester and my mix of 5050 ww lyno test out between 18 and 19 I dont see how your getting such hardness with that mix unless your water dropping. We have done extensive penetration tests with just about every alloy would could think up using the .45 colt .475 lin 500 lin 50 alaskan and 4570s and nothing weve tried so far has the combination of lack of deforming and breaking and allowing the bullets to get max penetration as the 5050 alloy. The only bullets that have done better are Kelye Slepps brass solids. Granted we torchure these bullets more then most game will. As far as leading goes i agree totaly you dont need anything more then ww with any handgun ammo and even most rifle ammo if you have a good barrel I dont heat treat or water drop. Water dropping is to inconsistant and weve had cases of bullets breaking with heat treating. Simular to what weve experinenced with staight lynotype.  I much prefer to get my hardness with proper alloying . I use lynotype that is not virgin but i cant believe that theres enough atimony loss to make that big of a difference in hardness. As you know pal i respect your oppinion and knowlege your one of the few on here that really knows what there talking about. Please if you have any secrets that will help or inlighten me pass them on if not here email me at lws43@hotmail.com.

[wener]

sorry if i came across to strong, the only bullets i have water droped have been bullets that they have wanted to shoot over 2200fps. The only i thing i can suggest is for someone or anyone to try putting lino in a fresh pot of wheelweights and see what they get, could be a slight variation in metals or even heat transfer. best of luck

[Lloyd Smale]

please dont think you angered me by not agreeing im the first to admit i dont have all the answers and like i said and you probably know theres a very small amount of the people on these boards that actually know what there talking about. Lots of armchair experts out there. I know in your case theres no way you could run so many alloys for bullets for sale and i know that youd have to charge a arm and a leg for bullets with high ammounts of lyno. in them. Have you played much with adding antimony to ww. I have a bunch that Billy Marr the old moderator of this fourm sold me and i get alot of varitation in hardness batch to batch using it. About all i can do is mix a real big batch and Make alot of one bullet with it. Ive tried every suggestion for fluxing it in including flux from the antimony man himself. I just never have found a good way to fluxl it in.  Tin i have in quantity as a matter of fact ive been playing with alot of differnt alloys using tin and ww and antimony to try to save on the lynotype stash. Im down to about #300 lbs and as you know it goes fast and I have the area i live in all cleaned up of anymore. So any help you can give me with the antimony would be greatly appreciated.

[wener]

its to expensive for someone to go out and buy three rcbs 20# pots so i can keep each allow seperate without contaminating each, but do me a favor and make sure a 20# pot is wheelweight and put in 1# of lino and see what you get! IT seems like it mixes good at high end temp. but i go through it so quickly it doesn't matter! I,ve been saving my tin for the cowboys shooters that like the pure lead and tin mix and besides i found a small supply of lin here and the guy also has a couple hundred pounds of mono also but i haven't bought it yet!