Author Topic: 25-06 Ultra #2 follow up.  (Read 783 times)

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Offline Fred M

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25-06 Ultra #2 follow up.
« on: June 02, 2004, 08:03:50 PM »
Big improvement in group size with all four test loads. 85gr Fowler Match bullets showed the greatest promise with a 3 shot group into a 1/4". Best performance came with 3 thou head-space. The trigger need a little more polish. A 24oz trigger is not like an 1-1/2oz match trigger but it is a lot better than the 60 oz that the rifle came with. The latch spring can stand a bit more beef yet.

The custom spring people want 40 bucks to make a custom spring for me. Have to think about that one. The trouble is that the spring is in minimum compression when the latch is engaged. If you make it too strong you wont be able to push the lever down to disengage the barrel. It would be better to redesign the latch block with a less sloping bottom and a less sloping barrel notch. That is not a big deal either. Can even be done by hand.

Heck, when I get that dandie Handi working and shooting good I am going to give it away as a present to a friend, with a supply of tweaked hand loads. But I also need to try some factory loads. Fred M.
Fred M.
From Alberta Canada.

Offline RipOne

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25-06 Ultra #2 follow up.
« Reply #1 on: June 03, 2004, 01:04:48 AM »
Interesting ..................
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Offline quickdtoo

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25-06 Ultra #2 follow up.
« Reply #2 on: June 03, 2004, 05:18:19 AM »
Thanks for all the info! I'm real interested in the factory load performance you find, I'm waiting on a 25-06 barrel for my Ultra. I sent the frame in 2 weeks ago, learned a couple days ago the barrel was out of stock. I sent em an email yesterday and they responded today with:

 "the 25-06 should be somewhere between 3 to 5 weeks   barrel fits usually take up to 6-8 weeks"

Now the long wait begins..... :(
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Offline handirifle

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25-06 Ultra #2 follow up.
« Reply #3 on: June 03, 2004, 06:24:02 AM »
Fred
Since you're in the re-design mode anyway, maybe consider this.   I have never taken the innards out of a handi but had wondered (when I had my BC) about converting the thumb release lever to a triggerguard/lever that opens the action.  One that works like the Mossberg SSI one.  It would be a bit more akward to open, in my opinion, but would give the leverage needed for the stronger spring you talk about.  My thoughts were purely for asthetic reasons on the BC, kinda a poor mans Sharps.

Something to think about anyway, may not be possible, depending on how the innards are put together.
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Offline Fred M

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25-06 Ultra #2 follow up.
« Reply #4 on: June 03, 2004, 08:15:25 AM »
quickdtoo.
Can't remember when I ever shot a factory load. But this is not for me.
My choice would be.
1. Federal 100gr Balistic tip.
2. Rem 100gr psp a good standard load.
3. Hornady 117gr SST
4. Winchester Supreme 115 SBST. This is a very fine bullet but I pefer the 100 gr.

If you can't make any of them shoot you need to scratch your head like I did. These factory loads are as good as you can get.

In my 25Hunter I use 100gr Hornady Interlock, 100gr Nosler Partition and 75gr Hornady V-max. In the BR rifle I use only 85gr Fowler's.

Handirifle
Since the trigger sear is part of the trigger guard I cant see how you could modify to an under lever. The trigger would have to be seperated from the guard. The front pin size increased to 3/16 and a toggle arm connected to the latch block. If a guy had a Handi action production drawing, this would help. The rear of the trigger guard would need a tail with a snap hook to make sure the latch stays in place.
You would need a milling mashine to make the parts, it is possible.

All in all the expenditure would not be worthwhile on a handy. I think the thumb lever is pretty good. The little change in the block geometry is really very simple and would solve a lot of accuracy and latch retaining problems. Fred M.
Fred M.
From Alberta Canada.

Offline handirifle

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25-06 Ultra #2 follow up.
« Reply #5 on: June 03, 2004, 09:28:27 AM »
Fred,
I like the idea of what you've done to the latch, curious to see how it holds up and if it helps accuracy.  Had you tested the accuracy before to campare?

Also, since the trigger is a factor as you say, I wonder if a second lever could be built over the trigger guard.  Just a thought.
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Offline Fred M

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25-06 Ultra #2 follow up.
« Reply #6 on: June 03, 2004, 12:08:44 PM »
Handirifle.

 
Quote
like the idea of what you've done to the latch, curious to see how it holds up
Yah, it supposed to hold down :)

You could not speak of accuracy at the initional load testing. Shots were all over the place and not just up and down. Groups if you can call it that were generated by excessive clearances in several places. Now from what I can tell the lateral dispersion is in the range of very good for a barrel with poor chamber, throat and bore dimensions.  Still the vertical dispersion up to 4.5" was something else.

Consider that each one thou movement or slide of the latch will produce a vertical eror of 1.3" at 100 yrds and .0035 slide or movement in the latch will give you  4.5" vertical or more depending on where the peak presure coincides. A fast powder will perhaps give you less movement. So the most obvious place to look is the latch.

The minimum head space of 3 thou is also important, nothing can stick out past the face of the breech not even a primer. Uniform primer pocket depth is imortant to a Handi rifle. If it sticks out it will prevent the latch from 100% engagement. There goes a one or two inch flyer.

The latch must engage 100% and stay put,no question about that. Of course the less fuzz the rifle makes the better it will shoot. The 25-06, 270, 280 and the 30-06 make a lot fuzz. These rifles should be put together with a lot more care and limited clearances by the factory.

My hand loads were fashioned to approximate factory loads, but I think I will reduce the loads to about the 257 Roberts, Velocity meens nothing without accuracy and 3" more drop at 300 yards is equally banal.

As I reported before, as new the latch engaged only less than 1/16". This would have opened the rifle about every shot. Crappy quality control!  dangerous if the empty case flys into your eye. I said all that in my two previous posts. The latch is the bad boy.

I really like the thumb release it is very convienient, right by the hammer extension. It works well left and right handed.  No complaints here. Fred M.
Fred M.
From Alberta Canada.