subsonic & VLD loads

[MoustacheMike]

All of the Whispering going on around lately has me intrigued with trying some quiet VLD loads, but I don't want to invest in yet another .30 cal bbl & dies...I just want to get my "feet wet".

Has anyone had sucess in loading a psuedo-whisper in any other cases?  

My current bbls are 1-10 & 1-12 twists, so I know I can't go too heavy (maybe 200gr).  I also know that there are dangers in loading "small" charges in "big" cases, but I don't think that should be too hard to work around with a 30 Carbine or 30-30 case (I think it wise to avoid the 30-06 for this experiment).

Whats the case capacity of a .30-221, anyway?  Since its based on the .221-.223 brass I assume that it maxes out at around 50000-52000 cup...but has anyone seen acurate pressure specs for subsonic rounds?

Any info will be appreciated.

TIA,

Mike

[redial]

Mike

I can't tell if you want to run reduced loads as is or with a can on it, but I'll tell ya that some can manufacturers will not warranty their product if you run subsonic rifle ammo thru them. There's a real problem with bullet strikes from understabilized projos in rifle applications.

The one good part of living in Gawd-forsaken Merlin is that Class III paperwork usually goes thru without a problem. That's the ONLY good thing I have to say, so I'll stop.

Cheers!

Redial

[Robert]

Try a 200 gr. .308 bullet in your SKS with 4.0 grs of Red Dot.  I own a Whisper and guess what?  The SKS works better.

[Nobade]

I've had the best results using flatbase, relatively blunt cast bullets in subsonic loads. The danger of sticking a bullet in the bore is just too great with jacketed bullets, and if you've ever stuck one you'll know you don't want to do it again. Also, a VLD boattail gains you nothing in a subsonic load at normally used ranges (<300yd.) but does cost quite a bit more to buy. One of the best cases I have found yet for dedicated subsonics is a 32 H&R mag, chambered in a .308 dia. barrel. It'll shoot the 220gr. Lyman at 1050 fps with a case full of 1680 and SDs in the low single digits, using a 1:10 twist barrel. To do this with jacketed of similar weight you'll need a 1:8 barrel, not a real common thing to run across.

[Mikey]

MM:  In the AK/SKS, try the Sierra 180 grain .311 diameter bullet over 10 grains of WW 296 powder.  Works the action in the AK and is quiet.  Mikey.

[John Traveler]

Mikey,

My friends in the US Navy SEALS report that the base armorers have played with loading subsonic loads in the SKS rifle and found them too erratic for serious use.

The gas system of the SKS (like the AK) is a goosey-loosey arrangement with lots of sloppy tollerances.  It's intended for positive functioning and extraction with service weight ammunition.

That load you described (180 grain .308 bullet with 10 grains WW296) may not reliably function the action.  For serious applications, any load used still has to work with sand, grit, etc in a dirty rifle.

Have you had any bullet-in-bore obstructions?

Just curious...

[Robert]

And as far as bullet obstruction....LET ME SAY THIS AGAIN.....308 bullets in a .311 bore......NO HANGUPS IN THE BARREL!  .308 in a .308 bore...likely hangups with real light loads.  I have used .308 200 gr hard cast bullets in a .311 bore with Red Dot all the way down to 0.2 grains just to see how low it could go.  These loads are pretty much useless, but it was just an experiment.  0.6 grs is a more realistic load.  0.4 grs is likely to stick in the bore with .308 bullets in a .308 bore.  I WOULDNT EVEN USE .311 BULLETS IN ANY .308 BORE!!!!!!!  Now on to cycling the action....shooting subsonic...why would we be doing that?  Stealth maybe?
If you were intending to shoot a 'Stealth' firearm,  would YOU want to be crawling around in the bushes looking for your brass?  NO!  You eject the spent brass manually into your hand and put it in your pocket!  I have never had any need for such practices, but theoretically speaking....a covert action would not leave brass laying all over the place.

[Mikey]

Interestingly enough, that load did not cycle my SKS action but worked my AK just fine.  Admittedly, my accuracy testing was done at 50 yds and the .311 bullets performed well at that distance.  I'll have to load up another boxfull and see what they do at 100yds.  Thanks for the info.  Mikey.