Author Topic: Shooting off a bench...questions (Read 993 times)

BowhunterNJ · « **on:** August 15, 2004, 03:28:09 PM »

Hey all, I had a question regarding sighting in off a bench with sandbags. The only factor I am considering in this discussion is gun positioning and bracing on sandbags. Assume all other factors (wind, weather, humidity, etc) are not involved.

Do you often "brace" the gun while shooting or do you just let it rest on the bags naturally and recoil however it does on the shot?

I tend to place my left hand on top of the scope to firm it against the bag, and squeeze off a given shot. I am wondering if this downward pressure is good to brace it or bad due to the potential for inconsist pressure.

I have just begun to shoot high powered rifles over longer distances than I am accustomed to and am wondering what the most effective and accurate bench style shooting technique is.

I see some guys at the range shoot with their left hand back on the stock by their shoulder and just let the gun rest on the bag naturally. Others hold the stock with their left hand and brace it against their should, and yet others don't use their left hand at all and just shoot with their right hand while the gun sits on the bag...so what is the "right" approach that promotes the best accuracy?

I don't think I have any problems squeezing off a shot, as I liken it to archery shooting with back tension. My shots feel very clean, and consistently a controlled but "surprising" shot.

This particular issue has never been of concern, as most of my shooting has been 100-125 yards and under. But as I reach out beyond 200-300...I think this may be something worth addressing/considering.

Anyone have any thoughts? Or should I not be worried about how I hold on the bags at ranges from 200-400 yards? Non-issue?

BowhunterNJ · « **Reply #1 on:** August 15, 2004, 03:42:11 PM »

Addendum:

Another thing that I found to help with my shooting, altho...this may sound a bit weird...is shooting with both eyes open. I do this in archery as well, and it allows more light into my eyes for low light shooting, but more importantly relaxes my aim.

The strain from forcing my eye closed to shoot the scope seems to be intense after 20-30 rounds...to the point where I can't see clearly out of my eye when its open and it takes quite a while to get back to normal. :eek:

Granted, I am as strange as the come, but that seems pretty damn strange!

Anyone else shoot with both eyes open? Ever try it?

7magWoodsman · « **Reply #2 on:** August 15, 2004, 04:36:32 PM »

I shoot with both eyes open most all the time, as for the bench, I only use it for sighting in and testing different loads. I never put ANY pressure on my scope, I just let it rest and make sure your sling stud is not up against the bags....my opinion is forget about the bench, when I was younger and first learned how to shoot at long ranges, I never had one.

jhalcott · « **Reply #3 on:** August 15, 2004, 05:17:04 PM »

I shoot from the bag to prove how good a load is. I put my left hand around the rear bag .When I have a load I'm going to hunt with, I put my left hand on the front bag and hold the gun as when hunting. I try to shoot a few dozen rounds from field positions.This helps me realize MY abilities! Shooting at clay pigeons on the berm at 200 yards tells me real quick if a deer is a safe target or meat.!

longwinters · « **Reply #4 on:** August 16, 2004, 12:54:07 PM »

Good question. I have asked it in the past and got the same answers . . . that being lots of different opinions

I too shoot with my left hand resting on top of the scope. Mostly to help control vertical muzzlejump. I tried shooting both eyes open, did it for 20 years with bow. But now, even though I am right eye dominant, my left eye is better/clearer. So I shoot with only one eye open. Yep, I have asked this question on different forums and even different websites. . . Not too many guys answer on this topic for some reason, and the responses usually do not agree with each other. :?

BowhunterNJ · « **Reply #5 on:** August 16, 2004, 02:08:48 PM »

Interesting, I'd imagine some guys don't give it much thought? Either that or, like archery, the better shooters may consider their bench form to be something like a trade secret.

Usually forums are quite helpful, and this one has been no different, great group of guys/gals here. So I'm guessing most just may not consider it to be a huge factor in accuracy as long as you are consistent in your shooting form.

I just tend to be one of those highly analytical types that picks apart everything in shooting (gun and bow). This is just one of those things that came to mind the other day as I watched other guys shooting. I've always held on top of the scope to do exactly what you are saying, keep the muzzle jump to a minimum and control the vertical recoil. At ranges 100 yards and under with my muzzleloader (actually a scoped percussion side hammer), shooting off a bench, I can group very tight...putting them nearly in the same hole. So the "top of the scope" method always worked quite well, but at these short ranges it may be entirely moot.

On a different tangent of accuracy, I can definitely see the benefit to loading your own cartridges though, similar to muzzleloading. You can control the powder, bullets, etc...shooting off the shelf ammo is like...a strange unknown. Granted they are acceptably consistent (floater here and there), I'd imagine you could achieve superior accuracy by loading your own. Sometime in the near future, I can see myself loading my own...seems like the way to go.

JPSaxMan · « **Reply #6 on:** August 30, 2004, 11:34:46 AM »

Bowhunter, the only advice I can give you is to NOT let your rifle rest on a hardened surface (I don't think sandbags should be a problem). If that's the case....your shots will be all over the place. And another rule of thumb to remember with any sight in situation is to NOT shoot with the barrel resting on something. This will cause your groups to shoot about an inch high. And finally, try to rest your gun in the same spot every single time. Some guns are finnicky (oh, we know, we know)....it won't help you any by being inconsistent. Hope this helps. Good luck and good hunting!

cam69conv · « **Reply #7 on:** August 30, 2004, 03:52:11 PM »

I see some holding the at the top of the scope and I see some holdin in front of the scope...I have been told, and do believe this, that BOTH are bad...The reason is called harmonics...If you hold the top of the breech or the barrel in ANY way you change the harmonics of the barrel..That is why the better rifles are free floated so nothing is contacting them..It is best from what I have been told that you should only touch the weapon on the "wood".. the only metel that should be touched is tha trigger. If the harmonics are changed then at long distances (250+ yards) that could end up as much as 3 inches off.. Thats all I can tell ya bout that so good luck and shoot often

JPSaxMan · « **Reply #8 on:** August 30, 2004, 03:56:51 PM »

Wow. That's some pretty cool info. I'll have to remember that. I used to touch the barrel of my .22 when I shot...but that was never at the bench.

Doc.2/47 · « **Reply #9 on:** August 30, 2004, 08:50:49 PM »

I bend my left elbow and put my left hand eather beside the rear sandbag(if I can get the rifle laid perfectly useing just the sandbags-rare),or underneath the buttstock to use with-or in place of-the rear sandbag.I adjust the forward sandbags for the perfect hold right/left.Useing the web of the left hand to cradle the bottom of the buttstock I slide the hand eather forward or to the rear along the slant or curve of the stock for perfect elevation.If this gets real close but is not perfect,form the left hand into a loose fist.Tiny amounts of tightening/loosening of mussel tension will move the crosshairs tiny amounts.

High Brass · « **Reply #10 on:** September 02, 2004, 06:27:52 AM »

I apply front end pressure when zeroing/load testing off the bench unless I use a bull bag which grips the rifle in the front. I've notice a different poi by not gripping it and then gripping it. It isn't a heckuva lot at 100 yards but I'm sure it gets interesting past that. I do this so that poi won't change when I shoot in field positions. Like another fellow said, I too shoot at clay pidgeons at 200 yards in field positions when I can. Lots of fun and if you can consistantly hit clay birds at 200 yards, you can darn sure hit the vitals of a deer at 200. Oh, I shoot both eyes open.

Rmouleart · « **Reply #11 on:** September 02, 2004, 07:13:23 AM »

I shoot with both eye's open, this method works very well for me when having to shoot a moving object. I always bench when working up a load, once the load is developed, I shoot standing position, as I would in the field, sometimes on one knee using a shooting stick, when benching I never touch the scope or barrel, let the whole gun flex on its own, I either put my left hand on my front rest or fold my arm across my body and wedge my hand around and under my right elbow, keeps my elbow from getting scrapes from the wood table;) and also keep me still, for those long shots. Aim small hit small. RAMbo.

7mm MAGNUM · « **Reply #12 on:** October 06, 2004, 11:55:46 AM »

When I'm bench rest shooting I try to always hold my rifle as I would in the field.

The more you duplicate the actual way you normally hold your rifle is the BEST way to become the most proficient with it. This way you become accustomed to your own personal quirks and can make all the compensations needed for them. (IE: scope adjustments, grip on the rifle, etc.)

If you shoot and sight your rifle in using a vise type grip, or any other artificial means,... you may be able to pound them in there every time (good for those competition shooters) but if you are sighting in to "hunt" you should do everything as you would once your out in the field. I don't see many people toting their sandbags with them to go hunting. :roll:

I took a 4x4 and put some foam padding down on one side and then stapled a bath towel down around it for protection, & use it as a rest. Normally when I'm out in the field the only thing out there to use for a rifle rest is a ol' tree.

(Just my 2 cents worth)

JPSaxMan · « **Reply #13 on:** October 06, 2004, 12:54:52 PM »

You do have a very viable point, 7 Magnum. The only thing I disagree with that on is if you do shoot it from a vise, then you know it is accurate...and then you can move on to off-hand and see how it is. If you know it's accurate...then you can do anything you want with it. Just my :money:.

7mm MAGNUM · « **Reply #14 on:** October 06, 2004, 02:14:13 PM »

yea Fishman029,... I do agree that point with you however,... once you have found out that it IS accurate using that method you should still compensate for your own personal misgivings.

If it is dead on in a vise and something about the way you hold it,.. or squeeze the shot off makes it go haywire on the paper off-hand shooting,.. you'd be better off re-adjusting for whatever your problem might be.

:yeah:

TScottO · « **Reply #15 on:** October 06, 2004, 03:26:17 PM »

Everyone is built differently and their body reacts differently to recoil. Sometimes this makes a difference in how someone shoots of a bench vs offhand shooting. This is more pronounced when shooting handguns and how the shooter controls the gun during dwell time or the time period the bullet is in the barrel. Some people pull the trigger differently when shooting offhand as compared to bench shooting as well.

What ever each persons individual glitch is, before I would adjust my gun for offhand shooting, I would ensure my glitch was consistent. If your glitch isnt consistent you will drive yourself nuts adjusting for something that isnt repeatable. If my glitch wasnt consistent I would just leave it as sighted in off the bench.

The majority of deer hunters I know and see at the range dont shoot offhanded enough to warrant adjusting for offhand shooting.

Be Safe,
Scott