45-70 and IMR 4227

[Nick F.]

Hello, I'm looking for a starting charge weight for 300gr lazer cast bullets and IMR 4227 in my 45-70 16" contender carbine. I figure 25gr is a good place to start. Sound about right? I want to use 4227 because it's what I have here. Would I get better results with reduced loads with something else?

TIA

Nick F.

[joeb33050]

The most accurate loads I've found in 45/70 are with Remington 2 1/2 primers and SR4759. Almost as accurate is Unique with the same primers. From 14 to 15 grains of Unique with a Dacron or TP wad-minimum wad material, just to hold the powder back-is almost as accurate as the SR4759, which goes through the measure so crunchy that I weigh every charge. I used the Lyman 457191 I think, the 300 grain bullet-for offhand at 200 yards for years. It would shoot 10 off the bench into 3.X inches all day, sometimes x = 1, sometimes x = 9. With a good fitting bullet, Unique will shoot into less thn 1 1/2" at 100 yards for five shots, sometimes around one inch. Carefully loaded with SR4759 it will shoot around 1.2 inch averages with frequent groups under an inch. Breech seating the Ohaus 450-405 bullet with SR4759 will on a good day average one inch.
Good Luck;
joe b.

[Nobade]

That should work fine. Somewhere between 25 and 35 grains should do the trick, depending on the speed you want. You may find those Laser Cast bullets like to lead the bore since they're so hard and use hard lube. If so, back way down on the powder and fill the remaining space with cream 'o' wheat. That will cut down on the leading, then you can work back up to the speed you want. Just make sure it's compressed, don't leave any air space.

[Nick F.]

Thanks for the advice gentlemen!

Nick F.

[haroldclark]

Hello Nick,

I have used 4227 in reduced loads with great success.  I have not used it in the 45-70 Cartridge, though.  I did run your proposed loading though the QuickLoad Software for results.  The software is extremely close to reality.

25 grains of IMR 4227 and a 300 grain cast bullet will produce from a 16" barrel the following:

The case will be filled at 53.8% - I have tried fillers , but I no longer use them.

Pressure: Max allowed is 20,000 PSI for a government model and 31,908 psi for stronger guns.

Your load will produce 9,995 PSI for a muzzle velocity of 1182 fps from your 16" barrel.

The anticipated recoil woult be about 12.2 foot pounds, which is not bad.  A full house load in an Encore 308 15" and a 180 grain bullet will produce 21 foot pounds of recoil.


Harold Clark

[Nick F.]

Thanks Harold,

Thats some very useful information. Where might I find this quickload software?

Regards,
Nick F.

[haroldclark]

Be warned that this software is like a drug.  Once you start playing in it, you will be hooked.

http://www.neconos.com/

Check out their website above.  I am using Version 3.0 now.  It is a bit expensive, but you will not care after you have had it for a few days, months and years.

They are located in Benicia, California.  Their full address and contact numbers are on the website.

The recoil calculations are calculated in my own Excel Spreadsheet.  However, Quickload does calculate recoil.  I'll have to go check on that for any certainty.

A lot of old timers, of which I am, will scoff at software and computers.  During the past 5 years, I have loaded and shot 45,198 rounds of ammo and most of the loads were developed in Quickload.  It saves you time and money for testing and range trips.

I always look for a load that will burn all the powder in the given barrel length and obtain efficiency.  It saves muzzle blast and saves powder.

You will like it.

Harold

[Nick F.]

Thanks for the info Harold,

I downloaded the demo and checked it out. Looks really nice but the $150 is shooting me down. Maybe someday when I'm feeling flush.

Regards,
Nick F.