Author Topic: Buffalo/target questions (Read 1257 times)

cheatermk3 · « **on:** December 03, 2004, 07:14:45 PM »

I was downloading the info on the lightweight rifles for a friend who's looking for a starter rifle for his kid yesterday when I ran across the Buffalo and target model info too. I'm wondering if anyone could share their experiences and comments on these rifles. They look like they'd be fun and I know the NEF's and H&R's will shoot.

Also wondering how much they cost.

I had an H&R topper that started out as a Hornet that I got a smith I know to rechamber to 218BEE for me; it shot good enough for PDs but my brass didn't last as long as the brass I shot only in my Marlin 1894 and my Ruger #1. It was ancient when I had it rechambered so it might've been a bit loose but...I can't help wondering if the actions aren't inherently flexible enough to allow the cases to be deformed out-of-plumb at the head when firing. Or maybe I worry too much.

Comments?

PS thanks in advance and I'm glad I found this site!! (Thanks QD).

elblerinnv · « **Reply #1 on:** December 04, 2004, 07:20:17 AM »

Welcome to the forum, Cheater. I have two of the Target Models, one of the early ones marked Wesson and Harrington, and a newer one marked Harrington and Richardson. Great rifle. The W&H cost me $335 new a few years ago, one of those cost plus $10 and 10% paid in advance deals, and the H&R cost $200 used. H&R is in like new condition.

I shoot only cast bullets, and have a Lyman Postell mold and Mountain Molds 275 grain flat point. Both shoot very well with either bullet, though the accuracy of the W&R has deteriorated. The possible cause of this is the use of gas checked bullets from a friends RCBS mold that may be causing copper fouling in the bore. I will clean with Butch's Bore Shine to remove the copper, and see if accuracy returns to the 1 1/4-1 1/2" ten shot groups it was giving before.

If you should decide to buy one of these, you can not go wrong by ordering the Williams Foolproof rear sight, and the steel fitment for the forend. Both of mine are so equipped and I am quite happy with both rigs. Luck to you.

Ernie

handirifle · « **Reply #2 on:** December 04, 2004, 08:40:22 AM »

I had a BC for about 2 years and after getting H&R to replace the barrel, it shot very well indeed. It really loved the 400gr speer bullet.

The BC can handle any and all loads of any other NEF 45-70 as well. They are a bit heavy/long for hunting, but it doesn't stop some.

They are neither one legal for any of the NRA matches that are for singleshot rifles, like the Sharps. That was why I bought mine and why I got rid of it. That was my hope to shoot in those, but oh well.

Mine cost about $350 about 5 years ago, with the sights installed.

cheatermk3 · « **Reply #3 on:** December 04, 2004, 12:46:49 PM »

Thanks for the replies guys. I'm hoping to be able to handle one of the Target model since I'm interested in trying out the 38-55. There's a big gunshow in Portland in 2 weeks maybe I'll see one there.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #4 on:** December 04, 2004, 03:19:12 PM »

I'm surprised Montanan hasn't checked in on this thread, maybe he's still got the flu.... :cry:

MSP Ret · « **Reply #5 on:** December 04, 2004, 04:23:25 PM »

Hey Quick, I think Montanan might be out on a cow Elk hiunt for a few days....<><.... :grin:

quickdtoo · « **Reply #6 on:** December 04, 2004, 04:31:11 PM »

Well, he was here this morning after this thread was started....I invited cheatermk3 over here from RFC and specifically so Jon could address his questions. :? Hmmm?? Best laid plans.....
http://www.graybeardoutdoors.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?p=280314&highlight=#280314

jgalar · « **Reply #7 on:** December 04, 2004, 04:37:42 PM »

Here is the Wally-World price on the gun...

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.gsp?product_id=3138392&cat=170092&type=1&dept=4125&path=0%3A4125%3A4155%3A170080%3A170091%3A170092

quickdtoo · « **Reply #8 on:** December 04, 2004, 04:38:55 PM »

He responded to my post at the NEF board at the Marlin Owners Forum just a couple hours ago, he musta just missed this thread, probably thought it was one of the older threads. :?

MSP Ret · « **Reply #9 on:** December 04, 2004, 04:41:50 PM »

I have been known to be a day late and a dollar short. now that I think about it that was a 2-3 day hunt that may have been a couple of days ago....<><.... :?

Cottonwood · « **Reply #10 on:** December 04, 2004, 04:43:32 PM »

Quote from: cheatermk3

I was downloading the info on the lightweight rifles for a friend who's looking for a starter rifle for his kid yesterday when I ran across the Buffalo and target model info too. I'm wondering if anyone could share their experiences and comments on these rifles. They look like they'd be fun and I know the NEF's and H&R's will shoot.

Also wondering how much they cost.
(Thanks QD).

cheatermk3

Hello and welcome to the forum, it is a great place to be even when your down with the flu. I got sicker than a dog on my elk hunting trip and it was no fun place to be, even though we got into some elk. No, I didn't bring one home, maybe next week if I go out again.

The 45-70 Buffalo Classic and the 38-55 Target Model are great rifles. There are many ways to set these up, either as a short range rifle or really get into it and set them up with proper sights for long range fun. The Sporting Goods Store here will price the Buffalo Classic out on the shelf at $380.00 My last one was no slacker for good accuracy and I had alot of fun with it.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #11 on:** December 04, 2004, 04:44:38 PM »

Quote from: jgalar

Here is the Wally-World price on the gun...

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.gsp?product_id=3138392&cat=170092&type=1&dept=4125&path=0%3A4125%3A4155%3A170080%3A170091%3A170092

Too bad they only have the .38-55 in stock, no .45-70s in sports south's inventory.

knight0334 · « **Reply #12 on:** December 04, 2004, 04:52:46 PM »

nor the north-eastern inventory. I ordered one on Nov 1st. nodda nothing.. cancelled my order a couple days ago.

cheatermk3 · « **Reply #13 on:** December 04, 2004, 05:16:18 PM »

Jgalar, Thanks for the link; that price is mighty tempting;
Montanan the price you quoted is more what I thought they might be going for.

I'm almost done waffling but I started a conversation with a guy that posted here about a cherry topper in 30-30 that I'd like to have too. He's in another state so I can't see it before I send the bucks but he sounded ok and my son's inlaws-to-be live in the same city so I'm pretty comfortable with making the deal. I wanted to try the 30-30 and see if/how much the brass distorted on firing because for me the 38-55 would be strictly a homebrew and I don't want to get into something that's gonna ruin cases.

Then again, I don't know enuff about the availability/cost of 3855 cases; can they be made from 30-30 brass? Maybe it's a non-issue since the 38-55 is pretty straight-walled.

I guess if you guys are not having issues shooting 45-70 I shouldn't stress about the 38-55. It's just that I've had similar issues with a 218Bee and a 244Ackley so I'm just a little shy.

Anyway, thanks for the info and the welcome. I like this place alot already!

quickdtoo · « **Reply #14 on:** December 04, 2004, 05:43:34 PM »

Raynor's has them listed for $326! He apparently doesn't have any right now but check it out, he has instructions for getting them through a local dealer. Click "Allocated" after you do the search. He just sold one here in the NEF/H&R Classifieds for $289.... :cry:

http://www.davidsonsinc.com/consumers/subsites/dealer_home.asp?dealer_id=917538

quickdtoo · « **Reply #15 on:** December 04, 2004, 05:50:41 PM »

I found a couple places that say they have 38-55 brass if the 45-70 BC is hard to locate.

http://www.gamaliel.com/cart/catalog/product_2824_Winchester_3855_Winchester_Brass.html

http://www.shootnhunt.com/catalog/JM/reloading/unprimed_brass/0813285.html

Nixter · « **Reply #16 on:** December 04, 2004, 05:53:41 PM »

Hey guys, just put a Buff Classic on lay-away at Sportsmans Warehouse. Sticker price was $299. They had a Target Rifle on the rack as well.

This was at the new store in New Berlin, Wi.

Hope to use BP only in this as a trainer for a Shiloh.

Between this section and the one on BPCR also here at GBO, I hope to learn a bunch of great stuff.

Time for more reading...

Nixter

Cottonwood · « **Reply #17 on:** December 04, 2004, 11:28:26 PM »

For those looking for 38-55 brass Buffalo Arms or other Blackpowder cartridge stuff related to books etc. Don't know why Starline Brass doesn't carry 38-55 but they do for others such as even the 50 Alaskan :grin:

Good find there Nixter and for a good price too.

87-19 · « **Reply #18 on:** December 05, 2004, 12:59:07 AM »

I bought that Buffalo Classic from raynor. :grin: I got it on Friday and she is a beauty. I ordered the Williams Rear Sight FP series from H&R but it hasn't arrived yet. :cry: I have a couple hundred of my BPCR loads left over from this past season, 70 gr. of Goex Cartridge with the 535 gr. postell bullet. I'm going to give them a try. I also had a box of Remington 405 gr. and Winchester 300 gr factory loads given to me, by my Brother, that I will try out. Will keep you posted on the performance.

jim

jgalar · « **Reply #19 on:** December 05, 2004, 02:51:50 AM »

grafs has winchester 38-55 brass for $15.59 / 50
$140.31 / 500

cheatermk3 · « **Reply #20 on:** December 05, 2004, 05:24:45 AM »

Locally Bi-Mart offers NEF Rifles and there's a guy working there I like to BS with so I'm going down there after I take the trash to the dump. I was reading up on the 38-55 in my manuals last night (or trying to), not much in the way info as only my Hogdons and Hornady even have it listed and there's not much depth. It does seem like 375 Win brass would work; I haven't compared the drawings for 30-30 but I think I remember a place called shooter's warehouse that stocks lots of brass. I'll check Midway too. 375 brass is probably as scarce as 38-55 anyway

This may become a full-blown Quest.

jgalar · « **Reply #21 on:** December 05, 2004, 05:20:46 PM »

Not a whole lot of searching to be done just go here and order some winchester 38-55 brass
http://www.grafs.com/

handirifle · « **Reply #22 on:** December 05, 2004, 05:45:04 PM »

Nixter
That is a good price. I paid $350 for mine. If you want some real BPCR experience go here. Not cutting down anyone on this forum, but these guys know BPCR likewe know Handi's.

http://shilohrifle.com/ Look at their forums.

cheatermk3 · « **Reply #23 on:** December 06, 2004, 06:31:06 PM »

was $319.75 plus 8% sales tax, IF they can find one. Tom said that it took them 4 months to find a BC for the last guy that wanted one. I'm gonna check with Sportsman's warehouse tomorrow--Thanks for the hint Nixter. Hope they have them in stock.

If I get a line on one there I'll order some brass from Graf's per your advice, jgalar(my favorites has grown a bit thanks to you guys!). If all goes well I could be shooting my new Target next weekend!

Nixter · « **Reply #24 on:** December 07, 2004, 04:41:16 AM »

cmk3, maybe the Sportsmans Warehouse near you can just transfer the one from New Berlin Wi. That's if they don't have their own to sell you...

handirifle, been lurking at the Shiloh forums for awhile now. Most of the times the discussion is a bit over my head but all the pieces are falling together. The Montanan gave me a real helpful link and I've accumulated a few books on reloading black in metallic cartridges.

The trick now is to get a few more things together and put some loads together and start experimenting.

I'll be here asking questions as I go.

Nixter

cheatermk3 · « **Reply #25 on:** December 09, 2004, 03:21:30 PM »

Tom at the Bi-Mart called and he's got a line on a Target. Goin' down there after work tomorrow to get the paperwork moving. Not the best price out there, especially with the 8% sales tax but what the heck someone's gotta pay for paving the roads etc. So I should have the rifle by the middle of next week. When I know it's on the way I'll order some brass. I'll need some dies and bullets too. Should be able to find all that and more at the 1500 table show in Portland Dec 17-19.

I've got lots of powder, 30 lbs or so of Data 200 and plenty of IMR 4227.

I can hardly wait.