Improvements At Remington

[Lawdog]

I see that Remington dropped the ADL from their line this year.  A giant step in the right direction.  Also noticed that Remington brought back the .375 H&H as well as chambering rifle for the WSM line.  Another great move.  Now if Remington will just dump the .338, .375 RUM’s, the complete RSAUM line and start chambering for the .338 WM(it outsold their .338 RUM) again then maybe they will get back to what the average hunter/shooter is looking for.  Things are starting to look up at the “Green Machine”.  Lawdog
 

[jvs]

I like the whole line of Remingtons, including the ADL which had its own market.  The ADL was the 'beginner' in some cases and led to future purchases.  

Buying your first complete new rifle shouldn't be a $1,000 deal, which in many instances it is today.  The ADL had its cost advantages.  The SPS looks to be taking the ADL's place, with more features.

Maybe if Remington does like Coca-Cola did, they could claim customer disatisfaction with the replacement model and come out with a no frills "ADL Classic" in another year or so.

[jvs]

I see that Remington dropped the ADL from their line this year.  A giant step in the right direction.  Also noticed that Remington brought back the .375 H&H as well as chambering rifle for the WSM line.  Another great move.  Now if Remington will just dump the .338, .375 RUM’s, the complete RSAUM line and start chambering for the .338 WM(it outsold their .338 RUM) again then maybe they will get back to what the average hunter/shooter is looking for.  Things are starting to look up at the “Green Machine”.  Lawdog

Lawdog,

I visited the Remington website and they have just one model available in .338WM which you desire.  The XCR is chambered in that load.  While it may not be a full line-up, it's a start for those who want it.

[Lawdog]

half_inch_group,

Thanks for catching that.  I didn't notice the .338WM squeezed in there like that.  So now they have the .338 WM competing against the .338 RUM just like they have with the .375 H&H and the .375 RUM.  Funny Remington dropped both the .338 WM and the .375 H&H to boost the sales of their RUM’s.  Guess enough shooters complained.  Now the only thing is I wonder how long the RUM’s will last?   :roll:   Lawdog
 

[JPSaxMan]

I'm just thinking out loud. You know what I really wish Remington would bring back? The XP-100. Never had the oppritunity to see one let alone hold one or own one. That'd be nice

[jvs]

half_inch_group,

Thanks for catching that.  I didn't notice the .338WM squeezed in there like that.  So now they have the .338 WM competing against the .338 RUM just like they have with the .375 H&H and the .375 RUM.  Funny Remington dropped both the .338 WM and the .375 H&H to boost the sales of their RUM’s.  Guess enough shooters complained.  Now the only thing is I wonder how long the RUM’s will last?   :roll:   Lawdog

It seems like the mass producers create their own markets for oddballs every so often.  The RUM's will last until everyone who wants one has one.  Then they will all but disappear like the Carbines did, only to resurface in about 15 or 20 years.   A vicious cycle.   I suppose that maybe the lighter calibers will make a comeback soon.  From one extreme to the other.  The introduction of the .204 and .17 rimfire proves there is a market for the lighter stuff now, just like Ruger did when they resurrected the .22 Hornet from the dead a few years ago.  Since the mass producers are in business to sell new rifles, it would be pretty dull if there wasn't any excitment every so often.  It's the way the game is played.  



There's one guy, at the range that I go to, who buys at least one brand new rifle every fall and sells them in the spring.  I am almost positive he has owned every possible Carbine and RUM.  He has the "gotta have it" bug real bad.  

I fell into the marketing game once, back in the mid 80's when Winchester re-introduced the M-70 Featherweight.  Never again.  I'm glad I have it and it kept it's value, but the fever is hard to take every year.  I guess I don't see a need for another 150 fps.

There's alot of calibers I don't have but at least I have my sanity.  I think.

[RaySendero]

I see that Remington dropped the ADL from their line this year.  A giant step in the right direction.  Also noticed that Remington brought back the .375 H&H as well as chambering rifle for the WSM line.  Another great move.  Now if Remington will just dump the .338, .375 RUM’s, the complete RSAUM line and start chambering for the .338 WM(it outsold their .338 RUM) again then maybe they will get back to what the average hunter/shooter is looking for.  Things are starting to look up at the “Green Machine”.  Lawdog
 

Agreed on all points!  Like the SPS, CDL moves personally.

[Ramrod]

I'm just thinking out loud. You know what I really wish Remington would bring back? The XP-100. Never had the oppritunity to see one let alone hold one or own one. That'd be nice

They turn up at gun shows now and again. Unless you are a lefty, as soon as you handle it you will see the bolt is on the wrong side for a pistol.

[HogFan]

Fishman,

What about this http://www.remington.com/firearms/centerfire/xr100.htm

[JPSaxMan]

Nice gun indeed, but take note; XR100 and XP100. R stands for Rifle and P for Pistol. I wanted to get my hands on the pistol version of the 100.

[Graybeard]

I have one of the new XR-100s in .223 Rem. on order now. From what Remington says I should be able to get it next month. They've not yet shipped any. At my dealer's it will be $700 out the door. Will be setting it up for the NEF/H&R prairie dog shoot in June. Nope it ain't an NEF or an H&R but those guys know I don't shoot their guns cuz I'm a Remington fan. But they're letting me shoot with them anyway.  :eek:

[JPSaxMan]

What are ya toppin it off with?

[Greybeard]

One of the newly introduced Bushnell Elite 3200 7-21 AO scopes. So new they are not even on the Bushnell website yet. I spoke with Laura today and she said they should have product in hand and ready to ship to distributors in February on this one and all the other new stuff coming out for 2005. Will likely mount it using Burris Double Dovetail base/ Signature rings.

[JPSaxMan]

*Drools all over keyboard, and causes shortage in electrical circuits *. Nice GB, nice.    

[msorenso]

jUST MY OPINION BUT I LOVE THE RUMS.  AND I DO UNDERSTAND WHY PEOPLE WOULD BE LEARY TO PURCHASE ONE. I DO HAVE A QUESTION I FEEL THE SAME WAY ABOUT THE WSMS AS YOU GUYS DO ABOUT THE RUM'S.  WHAT ARE THE ADVANTAGES OF THE WSM BESIDES BEING SHORTER. AT LEAST THE RUM ADDED A BUNCH OF POWER.  NOT THAT I MIND THE WSM BUT IT MAKES ME MAD THAT I NOT CANNOT GET A 300 WIN MAG IN THE FEATHER WEIGHT, I HAVE TO GO TO THE WSM.  AND ADVISE ON THE WSMS IS WELCOMED.  MAYBE IF I KNEW MORE I WOULD THINK DIFFERENTLY.

[JPSaxMan]

jUST MY OPINION BUT I LOVE THE RUMS.  AND I DO UNDERSTAND WHY PEOPLE WOULD BE LEARY TO PURCHASE ONE. I DO HAVE A QUESTION I FEEL THE SAME WAY ABOUT THE WSMS AS YOU GUYS DO ABOUT THE RUM'S.  WHAT ARE THE ADVANTAGES OF THE WSM BESIDES BEING SHORTER. AT LEAST THE RUM ADDED A BUNCH OF POWER.  NOT THAT I MIND THE WSM BUT IT MAKES ME MAD THAT I NOT CANNOT GET A 300 WIN MAG IN THE FEATHER WEIGHT, I HAVE TO GO TO THE WSM.  AND ADVISE ON THE WSMS IS WELCOMED.  MAYBE IF I KNEW MORE I WOULD THINK DIFFERENTLY.

Well if ya want a true answer, you could also ask this in the Winchester forum. They'd give ya the answer to the WSM (or at least their side to it) better than we would.

Now, I thought the Ultra Mag and the WSM were almost the same concept, just two different companies in the making? I've heard the theory is if you take a cartridge (like a .25-06 for instance) and neck down the case, and make it fatter, and name it a .25 WSSM, you get a heck of more power. But downside to that is recoil. Because the powder is crammed into that short of a space, recoil will be greater. But from what I've read, accuracy and velocity will be somewhat better because of it. Just my :money:.

[Graybeard]

Boy have you heard some bad rumors JP.  :eek:

[msorenso]

Feel free to comment greybeard.  What is your opinion on wsm's.

[Graybeard]

Feel free to comment greybeard. What is your opinion on wsm's.

My opinion? Ho hum, boring. They bring nothing new to the table. They do not quite measure up to the .300 WM and it really does nothing of importance that the .30-06 doesn't do. For me the only reason for their existence would be to push 200s to the velocity the '06 pushes 180s. And yet folks want to use them to push 150s. I fail to see the need. This applies to magnums in general from my personal perspective.

Now, I thought the Ultra Mag and the WSM were almost the same concept, just two different companies in the making?

Hardly. The UM is a long action fat round. The WSM are short fat rounds. Two different nitches. The RSAUM tried to copy the WSM but were too late in coming out. They missed the rush and got left behind.

I've heard the theory is if you take a cartridge (like a .25-06 for instance) and neck down the case, and make it fatter, and name it a .25 WSSM, you get a heck of more power. But downside to that is recoil. Because the powder is crammed into that short of a space, recoil will be greater.

No clue where you heard that one but no part of it is correct. Fatter and short is supposed to mean more efficient. More velocity with less powder. Not sure I believe it but that's the theory. Less powder and equal velocity means less not more recoil. But lighter rifles means more recoil so it cancels out.

 

But from what I've read, accuracy and velocity will be somewhat better because of it.

Yeah they claim better accuracy but actually base it on the PPC rounds not the short fat magnums. I've seen no reviews to back it up on them. Velocity seems to always fall short of the longer magnum it tries to duplicate.

[JPSaxMan]

Must be reading the wrong magazine :roll:   .

I believe that's where I got my info from. Guns and Ammo and Field and Stream. Might be the wrong place (I guess it IS the wrong place).  

[Graybeard]

Both of those were once fine and respected magazines. No more. Today I don't think they are worth the paper they are printed on. Sad. Truly sad.

[JPSaxMan]

I might making good use of those magazines; ripping the pages out and using them for doggy paper when our new dog (in spring) needs to be housebroken :-D .  

[Lawdog]

The WSM line IS proving to be more accurate due to the short-fat cartridge design.  Wasn't it just this last year sometime that two different long range matches were won by a guy shooting a 7mm WSM in a lowly Savage and while doing so set a World Record?  The short-fat design works whether it's the WSM or the WSSM.  As for comparing the .300 WM to it’s shorter brother then lets check factory load data..

Right out of Winchester’s site;

.300 Winchester Magnum 150 gr. - 3,260 fps
.300 WSM 150 gr. - 3,300 fps.

Right out of Federal’s site;

.300 Winchester Magnum 150 gr. - 3,280 fps
.300 WSM 150 gr. - 3,200 fps.

Even going by Federal’s data there isn’t that much difference between(80 fps.) the two.  With the accuracy edge going to the WSM then if a person is in the market for a new magnum then one would be foolish not to consider the new offerings from Winchester.  Lawdog
 

[msorenso]

Does anyone think Winchester will caliber in regular magnum in thier feather weights again?