OxyClean

[Virginia Yank]

Used a solution of OxyClean and hot water vice dishwasher soap to clean my TC Hawkin 50 and Patriot Pistol this weekend.  Each had over 50 rounds fired from them.  The OxyClean worked better than anything I've tried before.  It worked so well that I'm sure there must be a reason I shouldn't use it to clean my muzzleloaders.  Anyone else tried it?

[fredj]

You shouldn't use any agressive detergents as they are often quite alkaline, you really shouldn't use hot water either, this type of cleaning gets rust started almost immediately, the rust starts in the steels pores where it isn't visable, but it's there nonetheless, use non ammoniated glass cleaner, cider vinegar, windshield washer solution, or plain old cold water use any one of these on patches, once the patches start coming out reletively clean dry patch the a saturated alcohol patch to remove any residual moisture then dry patch and oil the bore.
fredj

[Stuffy25thIA]

I've used the Oxy-clean trick to clean my muzzleloader's and I see nothing wrong with any of my firearms.  Lube with Ballistol after I'm done, have had no rust in any of my guns.

[fredj]

I've used the Oxy-clean trick to clean my muzzleloader's and I see nothing wrong with any of my firearms.  Lube with Ballistol after I'm done, have had no rust in any of my guns.

  Stuffy- I really don't think you're doing your barrels any favors using Oxyclean or any other highly aggressive cleaner, virtually none of the
commercial BP solvents are anywhere near as powerful, T/C#13 is 90% water 10% silicone (the silicone is so it can be also used as a patch lube)
Rusty Duck is mostly antifreeze and water, Moose milk is a water soluable oil and water, etc. most of the veteran BP BR shooters use plain water or
other innocuous solvents like watered down winshield washer solution
etc. and those guys have a big investment in their rifles and decades of experience. The guys who have been using the seasoned barrel thing often have a nice shiney bore when they've done an actual cleaning and you shine a light down there, but if you look in there with a bore scope it's a different story, as you'll usually see flake rust and pitting going on in the pores. The Ballistol is really good stuff. I believe it is a good solvent
as well as a protectant just pretty expensive to use as a solvent.
Regards fredj

[Naphtali]

Please explain why alkali cleaner is not good. I thought black powder residues were salts, acids, and solids like carbon. I also thought baking soda was good to use in the water used to clean.

I am not bone picking. I just do not know.

[fredj]

Naphtali- Actually BP residue salts are alkaline, I went for years thinking they were acidic, but ti turns out they're alkaline. The corrosivity of BP is
due to the salts being hygroscopic they're not corrosive in themselves, if the relative humidity is below 30% your barrel isn't going to corrode
even if you don't clean it, fortunately those salts are readily broken down
and neutralized by plain cold water. I've been using diluted non ammoniated glass cleaner, but am switching to Cider vinegar as my friend Bill Knight (The Mad Monk) who is likely the most knowledgeable
single BP expert alive, has been using it and says it's the best thing he's used so far, I believe the mild acidity inherent in vinegar cuts the alkaline salts faster than water.
fredj

[Naphtali]

fredj:

Thanks for the explanation. I have follow-up questions.

Among the ways of metal finishing black powder firearms are "browning" and rust bluing. In both cases the metal finisher is causing controlled rusting -- oxidation -- to the steel/iron.

Why put a protective layer/barrier of corrosion to prevent further corrosion?

Is there an acidic protective layer/barrier available now? Available circa 1770?

Products such as, Wonder Lube -- they are acidic?

[fredj]

Naphtali- I believe the purpose of Browning was at least partly aesthetic
as well as to prevent structural damage from continuing pitting.

   I really have no idea what the PH has to do with protective oils, I believe they are just designed to prevent oxygen and atmosheric moisture from contact with the exposed steel thereby precluding oxidation
(rust)) none of this is rocket science most of these techniques and principals are at the very least 200-300 years old, the water dilutes, neutralises the BP residual salts the patches remove the crud, and subsequent oiling of the bore and exterior parts keeps it safe by not allowing the air to contact the steel.
   My actual detailed knowledge of the specific chemistry of these processes is pretty darn basic, I just know from  experience and
that of knowledgeable folks past and present, I think most people over rate the corrosivity of BP particularly high quality BP, and I know all the schemes to produce bore coatings (seasoning) to allow no cleaning have been dismal failures, and I also believe the various stainless alloys used in barrel making will definately corrode, some of them are considerably
more vulnerable to certain solvents than normal ordinance steel.
Fortunately our planet has no shortage of water which is all we really need
beyond oil or grease for between shooting storage. I have a friend who
is in the ML business he is also is an avid collector and I've had the pleasure to shoot a number of his originals some of which are 150 yr's or better some of which have been used throughout thier life and the ones that were cleaned and oiled properly are still fine shooters and have very nice bores.
Regards fredj