Help needed w/ .223

[DGrig]

I need your input.  Last fall I purchased a stainless .223.  I needed a handy rife for farm varmit control and plinking.  Well, I put a Bushnell Banner 4-12 scope on it w/ Buris Signiture rings.  I broke in the barrel and have been shooting a variety of loads including hand loads.  Problem: at 70 yard it is very inconsistent.  I will get 3/4 inch groups or 4 inch groups from a bench on sand bags.  I have done nothing to accurize it.  I have checked the obvious (loose scope, etc.) and con't get the group to tighten up.  Any suggestions on a next step?  Don

[MSP Ret]

DGrig, you can check these couple of things first, look at the crown of the muzzle for any burrs or deformities, if you can see a carbon "star" or discoloration in that stainless muzzle it should ideally be even all around. Check the forearm and see if it is binding or pressing on the barrel on one side more than the other, try the gun with an o-ring over the barrel/forearm attachment stud to assist in "free floating" the barrel or use a piece of business card between the bottom of the barrel channel in the forearm and the barrel to prevent the barrel from contacting the forearm. ALSO, very important, be consistant in your trigger pull, pull the trigger fully to the rear each time without jerking, just don't "trip" the trigger. Be sure you settle on a particular load and don't keep jumping around from load to load, especially on one target string. Different loads will shoot to different points of impact. Try some of the Winchester Value Pack 40 or 50 round HP 45 grain "Varmint" ammo. Wal Mart has it for about $14 for a 40 round box. It has become the "Gold Standard" for shooting out of these H&R .223's...Good Luck and let us know how things work out....<><.... :grin:

There are other things to try which might also help but these are the easiest and therefore the first to try and should help. If all else fails, sell me the gun!!!! (seriously!!!) :grin:

[handirifle]

Dgrig
All of what MSP said, plus one other thing to remember.  Some, mine isn't, Handi's are sensitive to WHERE you rest them on the sandbag.  Those that are, like to be rested closer to the receiver.  Somewhere between the forend screw and the receiver usually works best.

Really recommend the white box ammo.  The Handi's as a group seem to love it.  Float the forend to relieve possible pressure on the barrel.

To re-emphasize what MSP said, consistant trigger pull is important on ANY rifle.

You didn't mention if it was synthetic or not but some of the synthetic forends are bad enough to cause real issues with free floating.

Hope we helped some, good luck,

Welcome to GB's.  Lots of good help and people here.

[DGrig]

Thanks for the tips.  Couple of followup Qs:

What size o-ring?

It is a synthetic stock.  So sould anything different be done?

Good reminder on the trigger pull.  I have a couple of other rifles w/ very light triggers and have gotten used to them.  The Handi is obviously a bit stiffer and I need to work at the skill of pulling it.

Don

[MSP Ret]

Nothing different with the synthetic stock, just be sure there is no uneven or extra firm pressure on the barrel from the forearm. You could try shooting the gun with no forearm and rest it on the receiver just in front of the trigger guard.
I am not sure of the exact size of o-ring, just do a search of the centerfire section and search for "o ring" or "o-ring", you will find the info you need. It just has to be thick enough to keep the forearm from touching the barrel and be a slightly snug fit over the forearm stud.
The trigger is not only heavier than your others but because of the built in safety issues you have to FULLY AND COMPLETELY pull the trigger to the most rearward position each and every time you pull the trigger, not as bad as it sounds and quite natural, just don't lightly "trip" the trigger as you would do with a finely adjusted light target trigger.
Let us know how things progress....<><.... :grin:

[quickdtoo]

The "O"ring info is in the FAQ sticky near the top of this list as is a link to Perklo's trigger work page. There's also a trigger hone sticky by Raynor in the Misc H&R Talk forum....All of these will help you with the issues you are dealing with along with the tips given so far. The trigger hones are relatively easy to do once you know the R&R procedure and will result in a light ~2½lb trigger that is creep free and smooth that breaks cleanly, with minimal honing. Due to the transfer bar safety, it's imparative that you follow thru with your trigger pull, otherwise the impact to the firing pin is inconsistent and can lead to inconsistent accuracy as has been mentioned.

Good shootin' to you,

Tim

[safetysheriff]

take both sling studs off the rifle to shoot at the bench, shoot with the forearm resting on a 'slippery' surface such as a cotton towel rolled up - but not off of leather or suede with the friction that they induce.   this really helped my shooting.

you can use a good-sized roll of towel to shoot off and then rest the barrel on it ahead of the forearm a good ways......but usually if you rest a barrel on something hard/solid it will cause the barrel vibration to impact the point of aim - in case you didn't know.   Do Not rest the rifle on the frame behind the forearm because that will cause the forearm to impact the rifle rest and throw off your groups.

hope this helps,

ss'

[MSP Ret]

"Do Not rest the rifle on the frame behind the forearm because that will
cause the forearm to impact the rifle rest and throw off your groups. "

 :?: , I have never heard this before SS, most here, if not 99+% reccommend resting the rifle on the action just ahead of the trigger guard and right behind the forearm for the most accurate shooting off a bench. This method has been spoken of here many times to reduce the effect of the forearm causing undue pressure on the barrel. Is yours a new method of bench resting a Handi? Where do you rest the gun while shooting from a bench and how does it work for you? Thanks, always willing to learn something new....<><.... :grin:

[handirifle]

Dgrig
You can even try some hard cardboard (not couregated) cut to fit in the recess in the forarm where the lug goes.  Just remember to cut out a hole for the lug.  If this helps you can experiment with diff materials.

I tried an o ring and it never helped.  I ended up using flat hard rubber that press fits into the forend recess and cut a hole for the lug.

I get dime sized groups with this.  In my opinion, you just need it to be a spacer to keep the forend off the barrel.

[safetysheriff]

MSP'

it seems to work well for me in somewhat reducing vertical stringing off the bench to rest the rifle on the smoother surface of the rear of the forearm than the area on the frame just behind it.   it eliminates the minor transition (vertical displacement) that occurs when the forearm then comes in contact with the rifle rest.    this may be less of a problem off a sandbag, i suppose, but is problematic to me shooting off an adjustable rest i was given.

one more reason for this is to move the pivot point/resting point further up/ahead on the rifle to reduce the impact of my movements upon the aim of it.    i would rest the rifle further up on the forearm except that its irregular shape bumping the riflerest causes vertical movement.    

that's why i rest the barrel (not the forearm) in my hand when shooting off sticks in the field -- to move the pivot point forward which has helped with my accuracy in shooting groundhogs.   i don't see the scope reticle wandering as much that way.

take care,

SS'