Author Topic: Lyman #2 Alloy @ High Speed (Read 1489 times)

warf73 · « **on:** October 27, 2005, 01:52:00 AM »

From my research the alloy mix Lyman #2 has a hardness of about 16.

I’ll be using a RCBS 2-Cavity Bullet Mold 44-300-SWC 44 Caliber (430 Diameter) 300 Grain Semi-Wadcutter Gas Check using Lyman #2 mix. With this bullet properly sized to my bore using good bullet lube.
Do you guys think I can safely run this bullet/alloy combination at 2000 fps in a rifle and not get leading?

This bullet will be loaded on top of a 445 Super Magnum,
I’m getting 1975fps with a 300gr. XTP bullet now.
I would rather shoot my own bullet than factor made stuff. But if I can’t get what I'm achieving now with a jacketed bullet then I’ll just drop the project of shooting lead threw this rifle.

What are your thoughts on this guys?

Thanks Warf

HL · « **Reply #1 on:** October 27, 2005, 01:57:33 AM »

That hardness should be OK for 1600-1800fps. If you are going to push those at 2000+, I would at least harden them to a 22BHN

Just my opinion.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #2 on:** October 27, 2005, 08:41:21 AM »

if you bullet is sized properly for your gun and you have a good smooth barrel you might get away with it.

warf73 · « **Reply #3 on:** October 27, 2005, 09:32:33 PM »

Well I guess I'll just scrap the idea, I'm not going to dump $160 into a maybe.

Thanks everyone for your input you just saved me some $$$.

I've already got the tin on the way and gas checks but thats small expense compared to the mold, handle and bullet sizer.

Warf

Haywire Haywood · « **Reply #4 on:** October 27, 2005, 10:51:29 PM »

I don't think you'll have a problem provided that your bullet fits the bore correctly. I shoot a gas checked 358 bullet made from straight air cooled wheel weights to 1850, and my buddy to 2050 with no leading and decent hunting accuracy. ACWW is supposed to be a 13 BHN. I water dropped a batch to see if accuracy improves. WDWW is supposed to be 18 BHN. Here's a page full of good information on alloys, hardness, melting temps, etc. http://www.lasc.us/CastBulletNotes.htm

good luck,
Ian

HL · « **Reply #5 on:** October 28, 2005, 11:25:48 AM »

Good info.

Slamfire · « **Reply #6 on:** October 28, 2005, 12:50:38 PM »

I have driven them at that speed in my Contender. No fouling to speak of, but I did drop them onto a sponge floating in a bucket of water. :wink:

warf73 · « **Reply #7 on:** October 29, 2005, 01:02:26 AM »

Was that Lyman #2 or WW that you were water quenching?

Warf

kjg · « **Reply #8 on:** October 29, 2005, 05:30:06 AM »

Warf I do the same as Haywire but I use a ags check and drop my ww's in a bucket of water, been doing so in my "06 and 45-70 using lee's 405 grainer, and rcbs 165 grain 358 , you should be ok using gas checks, andgood lube I havent as of yet gotton any leading waht so ever I've dropped from using factry stuff too and ahvent swayed yet. bb75

Haywire Haywood · « **Reply #9 on:** October 29, 2005, 07:59:34 AM »

As an added note, I shot the water dropped bullets today and accuracy improved dramatically. I'm pleased.

Ian

Slamfire · « **Reply #10 on:** October 29, 2005, 12:34:50 PM »

Actually it was a home made alloy, with a 25 lb. bag of 2% antimony shot, a coffee can of wheel weights and a half bar of 50/50 bar solder. I added the solder as I was havin' a hard dime gettin' the mold to fill. Now that I think of it, it was probably pretty hard stuff. :-D I shot a few 'yotes with it, but never found a spent bullet. The bullets were from a 130 grain Lee mould.

Leftoverdj · « **Reply #11 on:** October 30, 2005, 04:59:25 PM »

Add about a half cup of shot to 10 pounds of #2 and waterquench and it should be easily hard enough. You can cut expenses in half by using a Lee pushthrough die to crimp the GC and size. Pan lube until you decide you really need a lubrisizer.

Used moulds and handles are readily salable at about 2/3 of Midway or MidSouth prices, so your bet on this project is a lot closer to $30 than $160.

warf73 · « **Reply #12 on:** October 30, 2005, 11:59:29 PM »

RCBS 2-Cavity Bullet Mold 44-300-SWC 44 Caliber (430 Diameter) 300 Grain Semi-Wadcutter Gas Check $56.99*
RCBS Mold Handles for All RCBS Bullet Molds $24.99 (on Sale)*
Hornady Gas Checks 44 Caliber Box of 1000 $20.99 (on Sale)*
Lee Lube and Size Kit 430 Diameter $11.79*
Shipping for above products $7.99*
50/50 BAR SOLDER 1 LB. EXT (X5) $26.39**
* Pricing from MidwayUSA.com
** Ebay purchase
Total $149.14

That’s the shopping list with the total, no matter how you color it I still have to spend the money to get the project running.

Something I didn’t say and I’m sorry, is this set-up will be for hunting use (Hog/Deer). So I can’t get to nuts with the hardness on this bullet.

I was in hopes of making a cast bullet that I can run at jacketed bullet velocities without the leading that’s why I was planning on the #2 Alloy and gas check. My normal bullets I cast are straight WW plain based bullets.

If everyone thinks I can get 2000fps and no leading in a 22” rifle barrel I’ll go for it.

This is my first step into the realm of super fast cast bullets.
My normal velocities are 1000fps and under.
This is why I came to the boards for pointers.

Thanks all for your info.

Warf

Haywire Haywood · « **Reply #13 on:** October 31, 2005, 03:05:52 AM »

Quote from: warf73

RCBS 2-Cavity Bullet Mold 44-300-SWC 44 Caliber (430 Diameter) 300 Grain Semi-Wadcutter Gas Check $56.99*
RCBS Mold Handles for All RCBS Bullet Molds $24.99 (on Sale)*

Lee 2-Cavity Bullet Mold C430-310-RF 430 Diameter 310 Grain Round Nose Flat Tip Gas Check Handles included $16.89

RCBS total cost = $81.98
Lee Total Cost = $16.89
Savings = $65.09

We at Roman Meal bread thought you'd like to know....
Ian

warf73 · « **Reply #14 on:** October 31, 2005, 07:57:17 PM »

I looked at that bullet, I really don't care for the looks of it.
Looks has nothing to do with performance but…..

I'm not sure I might go with it that one Haywire, savings is savings :grin:

<<Lee

<<RCBS

Warf

Mikey · « **Reply #15 on:** November 01, 2005, 11:49:54 AM »

Warf73 - I have never shot cast bullets at the velocities you intend, but you are asking about a gas-checked bullet and I have never had leading problems with gas-checked bullets, including those shown in the picture. That's what the gas check is for, to keep cast bullets from leading the bore and costing the shooter accuracy. I have always found the gas checked bullets to shoot as clean as jacketed. I have used Beartooth bullets in the same configuration as the Lee casting, with gascheck, to 2300'/sec and they are phenomenal.

I would hazard a guess to say that you should be alright with a proper #2 alloy and a gas-check in your 445. Whenever I needed to harden my slugs I just used Linotype - you can get it from a printer or print shop - some places still use it but need to become more modern and let the stuff go for peanuts. You will not need to add much Lino to a #2 alloy mixture to get a slug hard enough to shoot through both shoulders of a big hog without breaking up. With whitetail or other soft bodied critters the bullet is not recovered. HTH. Mikey.

kjg · « **Reply #16 on:** November 02, 2005, 04:00:55 AM »

can't you just drop your #2 alloy in water to harden it, I have done so in both 357 mag 45-70, and 30-06 have no leading problems and I run those 357 mags 162 grainers with gas checks using H-110 they are hot but seriously accurate, and have good luck, why would I want to add antimony? is it better? I drove one of my 405 cast hp's from a lee mould that cruched straght trough a 300lb. bores shoulders, and droped him in his tracks at 70 pases, I'd like to know if adding antimony would improve my results?. kjg

Slamfire · « **Reply #17 on:** November 02, 2005, 04:03:13 PM »

Adding antimony won't improve the performance of the bullets unless you are getting leading in the bore. That said, straight wheel weights are hard and still expand, while holding together. It is a case of cheap being good, despite itself. :wink:

kjg · « **Reply #18 on:** November 03, 2005, 09:20:10 AM »

I appologize if I was sounding foolish, I was thinking you were suggesting that you had to add antimony to the wheel weights to get them harder,my bad, I still havn't had any leading problems, and I also use he cheapest lube possible, alox . kjg