Author Topic: Springfield GI - a couple issues  (Read 1214 times)

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Offline ZANARDI

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Springfield GI - a couple issues
« on: November 20, 2005, 11:40:44 AM »
I shot my Springfield GI today. Since I bought it new a few months ago, I've shot maybe 200 rounds through it. All factory "hard ball". Both Fiochi (spelling?) and CCI Blazer Brass.

Two problems:

1) Almost without exception, the last round in the magazine failed to feed. It would "hang up" between the barrel and slide. Always the last round. The other rounds all fired fine with no failures at all. It didn't matter which brand of ammo. I'm using the factory magazine that came with the gun. The ramp and chamber areas all appear smooth and bright. I doubt they're at issue because again it's only the last round in the mag that creates a problem. Does this sound like a magazine problem? If so would this be a warranty issue where SA would replace the Mag?

2) The gun shoots consistently about 4" left. This is both off-hand and from the bench. Can I simply take a punch and "drift" the rear sight to the right? Is a special tool needed for this?

Please share your thoughts. Other than the above issues the gun seems to be put together well and is a pleasure to shoot.

Offline Mikey

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Springfield GI - a couple issues
« Reply #1 on: November 20, 2005, 02:48:13 PM »
ZANARDI - (1) Yep!, You're right.  Sounds like a magazine problem.  I would get a handful of Chip McCormick 8 rounders and let 'r' rip.  Think that will do the job for you.  And by all means see if there is a warranty on the factory mag.  Get another new one.  (2).  Yep, drift the rear sight over until she hits where you want her to and that should do it. HTH.  

As to the loads you were using, either is fine.  Personaly, I would lay in a case, smoke her up with the first 500 and practice regularly with the rest until you need more.  Just a thought here.  Mikey.

Offline 1911crazy

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Springfield GI - a couple issues
« Reply #2 on: November 20, 2005, 03:13:53 PM »
Mikey;  Your right on again but something odd too,  I have been reading on other sites about other new 1911a1's also having mag problems lately too.  It seems we have a mag "flu" thats spreading.

ZANARDI;  Now i wonder what the last round is doing in your mag?  Is it standing straight up and stove piping causing the jam.  I wonder if its just popping out or flying out of the mag as the slide hits it. You may want to check the pusher to see if its parallel with the feeder lips on the mag.  It sounds like just a little tweeking would fix it.  A weak spring in the mag could also cause the round to pop or spring out too. You could stretch the spring just a little so it puts some more drag on the last round too. Or just replace the mag spring with a new spring.  

Sorry but i like fixing mags /feeding problems its fun and i enjoy making them right. But anyway get some new extra mags too. I have been hunting for some new SA 8 rd mags too.  My SA series 90 came with an 8rd mag.

Offline Mikey

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Springfield GI - a couple issues
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2005, 01:48:55 AM »
D MAN - go for some Chip McCormick mags.  I have never had a problem with any of mine.  HTH.  Mikey.

Offline ZANARDI

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Springfield GI - a couple issues
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2005, 07:12:25 AM »
Thanks for the suggestions guys.

D Man - the last round is not stovepiping. It remains overall horizontal as one would expect. It is coming up at a sharp enough angle however that the front tip of the bullet is hitting and sticking against the chamber rather than going into battery. The slide then catches only the top portion of the rear of the cartridge. The whole works jams up. It jams hard enough that it takes more than simply pushing the slide to battery. I generally have to clear the cartridge completely.

With the cartridge jamming at a bullet up base down angle, I'm wondering if maybe the rear of the cartridge is coming up slower than the front on the last round. This might cause the slide to ride over the rear and jam it up rather than push it into the chamber? The first several rounds probably don't do it because they always have a round on top. Maybe that helps hold things level until the last round comes out?

Offline 44 Man

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Springfield GI - a couple issues
« Reply #5 on: November 23, 2005, 01:41:11 AM »
I don't want to advertise other forum's on here but, if you want great information on what it going on with your feeding problems, go to www.m1911.org.  Click on forums, and near the bottom of the page is 'magazines'.  1911 Tuner has one of the most informative articles there about exactally what happens during feeding and what causes most types of failures.  I'm sure that will difine your problem and what you need to do to correct it.  You can also read the stickys under troubleshooting.  Good luck with your problem.  First thing I would do is buy a couple of quality mags (I've always depended on Wilson) and see what that did.  If you don't want to buy any just yet, see if you can borrow a couple from a friend.  44 Man
You are never too old to have a happy childhood!

Offline unclenick

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Springfield GI - a couple issues
« Reply #6 on: November 23, 2005, 02:35:54 PM »
44 man has pointed you to the right place.  Not to steal 1911 Tuner's thunder, I thought I might synopsize his analysis here, and add a couple of observations.

1911 Tuner points out that as the gun recoils, the rounds in the magazine don't want to move back with it.  Instead, inertia makes them try to stay put.  All but the top round get pushed back on the nose by the front of the recoiling magazine housing.  What pushes the top round back is mainly like-metal friction with the round below it, augmented by tension from the magazine spring.

The last round is treated differently from the other children.  The follower isn't like-metal, and the spring is at its weakest for the end of the stack.  So, during recoil the last rounds inertia may succeed in keeping it in place well enough to pop it out from under the magazine lips.  This leaves it cocked up at an angle where the bottom of the breechface in the returning slide can't pick up its rim and push it into the chamber.  

To make up for this tendency, Browning put a dimple on the magazine follower to catch the extraction groove of the last round and prevent it from popping fully forward without help from the slide and recoil spring.  If the magazine spring is weak, or the dimple isn't tall enough or is too rounded, the cartridge gets loose and pops up in the way of the slide anyhow.

This problem has been so frequently reported with the SA 1911A1's, that one must suspect either their follower dimples are improperly shaped, incorrectly located, or their magazine springs are too weak.  I have a number of magazines with no dimple in the follower.  These mostly have rounded followers that try to mimic the shape of a non-existent 8th round.  I have no trouble with them shooting reduced target loads in my Goldcup, but they aren't always last-round reliable in my ball gun.

The usual solutions are: new springs or a better shaped follower.  I used to buy Mag-pack 8 round conversion kits.  These came with a spring and a concave plastic follower with a ball bearing inserted to replace the dimple.  I don't know if they are still around?  I haven't needed a new one for a decade.

My own experience with the SA magazines, both in the 1911 and the M1A is their Parkerized finish is rough and I can feel the followers drag in the magazine housings.  This doesn't help the spring chase the last round to the top.  I disassemble them, clean them, polish the sides of the follower, then soak them, and the spring and the housing in Sprinco Plate+ for three days to get some permanent lubrication.  More recently I have been experimenting with Shooters Solutions MolyFusion oil for the permanent lube, and it works well.  It lets you treat the sides of the follower without lubricating the top or the dimple.  I have yet to try the boric acid oils as permenant lubes in this application.

Nick

Offline SGTUSMC

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Springfield GI - a couple issues
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2006, 06:15:08 PM »
A buddy of mine was having the same problem with his SA 1911 "Loaded" model, time and again, mag after mag. He wanted badly to get rid of the pistol and knew I was looking for a 1911. We did a trade and I cleaned it from end to end. I also very lightly polished the feed ramp with Remington Bore Cleaner which if you're unfamilliar with it, it's a mild abrasive. I've since shot more than 200 rounds thru it and have yet to have any type of feeding problems. I do however think there is a link between weak spring tension on the last round and poor grip (too loose) that shouldn't be over looked. Keep a firm grip. I like to slightly push with my firing hand and pull with the other.