Trap Shooting powder: Red Dot, 700x, or Clays

[Big Al 29]

Hey guys,

Red Dot, 700x, or Clays for 16 yd. trap shooting??

AA, Priemier, or Gun Club Hulls
Fed. 209A primers
WAA12 or CB0118-12 wads

18.5 grains of Red Dot  (3 dram equiv.)
MEC reloader "O" charge bar with Red Dot powder

17.5 grains of 700x (2 3/4 dram equiv.)
MEC reloader "OH" charge bar with 700x powder

I usually shoot 700x (grew up shooting it, pop reloads it, so why change?)
I was given 4 lbs of Red Dot which I have been using for the past 2 months though.

I plan on shooting up the rest of the Red Dot but then I have a dilema:
Buy more Red Dot, go back to 700x, or try the "Clays"?

I have read about "Clays" and its great results and I got thinking about what to buy next.

I think the Red Dot leaves the gun extremely dirty as compared to 700x.
I was told Red Dot develops huge amounts of breech pressure and over long periods of time can damage the gun.  But I have been getting excellent results averaging 94 for the past 2 months. But the gun is left extremely dirty when all is said and done.

I was looking for some others' opinions on these powders and their stories on why they choose the powder blend they did and some advice on:

"If you had to choose one of the three powders for Trap shooting what would it be and why?"

It just seems like powder choices are "gun club" choices.  If one guy breaks 97 - 100 everyone wants to know what components he is using.  One gun club is partial to Red Dot, one is partial to Green Dot, one is partial to 700x etc...

Thanks

Trap Shooter from SE Pennsylvania (Delaware County Field and Stream Assoc.)

[.45 COLT]

You're using an old press, you got those charge bars. :grin: I still use a "0" in one of my presses and a "8G" in another, so I got some old presses too.

When I was heavy into trap, I tended to Green Dot, but most I knew used Red Dot. I used Red Dot on occasion for trap, still use it for light field loads, I like the powder. Maybe a little dirty - OK, a lot dirty, but the gun needs cleaning anyway. Never saw any major gun failures that could be attributed to the powder.

DC

[dave375hh]

Red & Green dot do leave more residue than 700X or Clays. Reddot, Clays and 700X will all generate similar pressures when loaded to the same velocity. Green Dot is a slower burning powder that, while it requires larger powder charges, produces less pressures at the same vel. level Green Dot is also known to pattern tighter than the others in most cases.

I would recomend switching primers as the Fed is better in hunting type loads and is hotter than needed in target loads with fast powders. It has been reported that the primer (Fed) tends to open the crimp prematurly, with a resulting loss of velocity. Standard force primers such as Win 209, Rem209, CCI 109-209, Fiochi 615-616 work better with target loads than the Federals.

My preference is the 700X.
Rem "STS"
18.2 grs 700X
Rem Fig.8 wad
1 1/8 oz shot
Fiochi 615
This cromographed 1245fps and works for all my target shooting from Skeet(a little heavy) to Sporting Clays(just right)

[Graybeard]

I prefer 700X over the other two personally. Red Dot was the older way to go and is still not a bad choice. I've shot more 700X than any other 12 ga. powder I suspect but Green Dot is close behind. If I count the Green Dot fired in 20 and 28 gauges I've fired more of it. I tried an 8 pound can of Clays and just couldn't find any reason to stay with it over 700X so the next can was a 12 pound one of 700X.

[shaner]

thats a tough choice for sure, not to much difin anyof them . 700x is top id say and in most loads the green dot patterns very well usually if u pattern any the green dot will give u denser patterns in a t rap load
now adays , u factor in one other thing , cost  if u can get a deal on one of them then take it , buit always use a set of scales to set up yur relaoder ,,,, bushing sizes  or numbers mean nothing  really , just a number to start from , iam wondering how , 700x and all IMR dupont powders will change since they were bought out , Hodgon bought out IMR /dupont powders ???wait an see

[Bob_K]

I have to clean the shotgun anyway, so price is usually my driver.  That's why I use PROMO, a Red Dot equivilent.  I use a MultiScale charge bar in my MEC, so density variations between lots of PROMO is not a concern.

[ruger4570]

I have used Clays and Clays International, Red and Green dot and 700X.
The Clays are cleaner powders, but unless you are using a gas gun, why worry about clean? I also like the 700X the best as it performs right in there like all the others mentioned, but, It tends to be considerably cheaper as a bonus.

[Buckskin]

I've used Hodgdon clays, universal clays, international clays, and longshot (which is a fun,wild, fast, loud powder that really gets attention when shooting an Anne Oakley).  I really like clays for 16 yds, and I used to use univeral for my handicap round.  I have since replaced my handicap round with green-dot, I seem to have much better groups at the 25-28 yd station with green dot.

[mountainview]

Al, why not do some patterning and see which load/powder combo works for you? That would be a more objective criterion for you to decide what powder to get next.

Like a number of the above I like Green Dot, the nice, dense pattern I get leaves no doubt when I break a bird as it frequently turns them into a dust cloud. Dirtier gun than when using other powders, maybe, but since I use a pump or O/U (which are easy to clean inside and out) it never occurred to me that this was a big deal.

[Sx2]

WST