Need help with Antelope load!

[Norm1057]

Hello all!

I purchased a Huntsman a while ago at a gun show. I did not have a clue about it but really liked the price and the wood stock is gorgeous. This was back a bit before the dead line for our draw hunts in NM. I was mostly wanting something for an elk hunt that I could shoot up to a "magnum" load with modern sabots and a scope on top. However, as thing turn out, I lucked out and drew an antelope hunt and have not had the time to work a hunt load for this gun. Now, time is running short.

My experience with muzzleloaders has always been with a traditional .54 Jim Daly Hawkins shooting 110 grn RS Pyrodex behind a 500 + grn Maxiball and open sights. The Huntsman is my first "modern muzzleloader." From the posts on this sight, I've learned that I have a 24" barrel rated for a max of 100 grains of powder. If I had the time, I would consdier ordering the 26" barrel. I spent yesterday playing with different combinations of powder and bullets.

So far, I've tried up to 100 grn of American Pioneer pushing a 295 gr Power Belt Aero Tip and Hollow Point. At  50 yards, I got excited when the holes were touching with both bullet types. At 100 yards, the better group was with the Aero Tip with about a 6" spread. I am not confident with this combination to shoot at any animal. Since I am expecting a 100-200 yard shot, I moved the target out to 150 just to see how it would hit. One hole was just right of the point of aim while the next two fell 2' short hitting the very bottom of my target board.

I would greatly appreciate some advise on what I can try differently to be able to achieve my goal of a reasonable group out to 200 yards with this rifle. I was shooting three shot groups and then removing the breach and running a brush and dry patch through the barrel. I have read some posts where folks are not getting acceptable performance with the American Pioneer. I am considering trying 777 and maybe a lighter bullet since an antelope is quite a bit thinner skinned than an elk. Am I being unreasonable or is there something I can do. Thank you for any and all comments.

[coop2564]

Try a 285 gr spitfire by barnes with 100gr of T7..   This load will kill anything in north america.  The 285gr bullet has better downrange ballistics than any 250gr. bullet that I have seen. They have a new TMZ version but its ballistics are not as good as the reg spitfire 285gr. My huntsman is by far more accurate with loose powder vs pellets.  I have 3 ML's and all like the 285gr bullet the best. 
http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=0003545154

[mangulator]

norm1057, sounds if you already have a good load. I have used 250 grain Shock-waves on Antelope and have been successful with 100 grains of Pyrodex. But, any of the loads listed here on this web-site that are used for deer can be used on Antelope.

[nomosendero]

Try a 285 gr spitfire by barnes with 100gr of T7..   This load will kill anything in north america.  The 285gr bullet has better downrange ballistics than any 250gr. bullet that I have seen. They have a new TMZ version but its ballistics are not as good as the reg spitfire 285gr. My huntsman is by far more accurate with loose powder vs pellets.  I have 3 ML's and all like the 285gr bullet the best. 
http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=0003545154

Thanks for the link. Looks like a good deal to me!

[Norm1057]

Thank you for the guidance and the link. I did search through most all the other threads but failed to find any tales close to my situation. It seems, most folks are getting fantastic results and killing deer in the 50-100 yrd range. I just want to reiterate that I'm looking at up to a 200 yrd shot. I'll see what I can get rounded up and head for the range. I'll let you know how it worked. I found on another post that the 777 might be the way to go with the shorter barrel that I've got due to a faster burn rate. Thanks again.

[coop2564]

The T7 in 3F will give you the most bang out of your huntsman but it does seem to have more recoil.  It does burn faster which is needed for the shorter barrels the 3f is finer and give you slightly less air gaps and seems to burn all the powder better. I haven't tested it but from the ones that have 3f gives slightly better volocitys than 2f. So if your going for 200yds every few fps will help. The 285gr bullet will leave the barrel at slightly less volocity than a 250gr with same powder but at 200yds will have slightly less drop than a 250gr due to better aerodynamics. The picture shown in the link is actually the 250gr spitfire the 285gr is longer and has a look much more like a rifle bullet which gives it better ballistics. There's a ballistic table that comes with the bullets and compares the 285gr vs a lot of the 250gr including there own and the 285gr spitfire at longer ranges drops less.  The sharper slope at the shoulder of the 250gr bullets is the reason. Goodluck on the antelope. 

[Busta]

Here is a test done on several bullets, the PR Bullets (all lead) have some very good trajectories with 100 grains 777 FFFG, as well as others. Just wish he would have thrown the 200 grain .400"/.50 caliber Shockwave in the mix. If you are looking for MAGNUM 150 grain pellet loads, the Shockwave/SST or Barnes Bullets would be the way to go. For flattest trajectory, the Duplex 195 grain .357" PR Dead Center is going to be the one to beat. If it will shoot out of your gun, I'm sure it will kill any goat out there. Here is some info on the test. Remember this is out of a longer barrel and with 100 grains 777 FFFG powder, your mileage may vary.

http://www.hpmuzzleloading.com/Technical.html

http://www.prbullet.com/drop.htm

[Norm1057]

Thanks for the great info. I went to my local gun shop and he had a box of the 245gr and 285gr spitfire. Based on Coop's suggestion I went with the 285. I did get the 777 FFF and found that 90gr loose worked great. Except for the punch to my arm, there was not much difference between 90gr and 100gr on paper. I believe this will be a good all around combination for this rifle.

Thanks for the link Busta. I do believe that you are right about the .357". My gun shoots the 285gr a bit better than theirs. With a 50 yrd zero I got a 200 yrd zero with 7" high at 100 yrd. If I get the time I would like to compare the .357".

With the .25 acp conversion, is there going to be much difference in accuarcy compared to the 209 holder? Three of my holders appear to be ruined from the side of the primer blowing out. I don't much care for this set up.

[Busta]

If your 7" high at 100 your going to be a LOT higher between 125 and 175 where the apex of your trajectory is. You will need to figure this out before you go, because if you get a shot in that 125-175 yard range, you could shoot right over your goat. You could be 10"-12" high in that area, and there is only one way to know for sure.

I have had some Winchester W209's blow out my carriers with Black Mag'3 powder and 460 grain conicals, never had a problem with 777. I do have the .25 ACP conversion and like it much better than the carriers. As far as accuracy, mine shoots well with both. I didn't buy the .25 ACP for accuracy, I bought it for the cleaner ignition and easier handling. I can load up 100-200 primers at a time, saves lots of time at the range.

Shoot that load at 150 yards, I'll bet you will be surprised how high you will be. Make sure you have a lot of paper above your aiming point.

[Norm1057]

I did shoot at 150 yrd and printed at the top of my 6" plate. At 100 yrd, the bullet printed an inch higher (but I could have pulled it a bit one way or the other). I was real impressed at the trajectory and consistency with the 285gr at 50, 100, 150, and 200 yrd marks. I'm stuck at work today and am going to order a box of the .357" PR Dead Center for comparison. I am intrigued with the results on the web site.

My first trip out, some of the primers had gotten stuck in the holder. The only "tool" I had to pop them out with also had a slight bur on the side. I believe this bur may have damaged the ring on the breach side just enough to cause them to blow out at that spot. All three holders were the same.

Another problem I discovered is the locking mechanism appeared  to have losened or not be engaging properly. My vary last shot of the day resulted in the barrel opening which caught me off gaurd. With tyhe barrel closed, the release tab had a little play. I could hit the bottom of the reciever with the palm of my hand and it would open. Upon closer inspection at the house, the tab the locks the barrel closed was slighted rounded. I polished the surface more square with

[Busta]

Just be aware that somewhere between 100 and 150 you will be a little higher than 6 or 7 inches high. You will want to know where it hits at the apex which should be somewhere around 125 yards. Once you get the trajectory figured out with the bullet you want to use, make a small chart and tape it to your stock. If you use a range finder along with your chart, you will know exactly where to hold.

Keep oil off that latch and also wipe any blowback/carbon build up off there to keep it locking up tight. A little cleaner on a patch works wonders.

[Norm1057]

Thanks for the great info and help. I hunted with the 285 spitfires and connected just before dark on the first day. I shot over the back of one at 190 yrds earlier in the day. He was standing with his vitals just showing over the top of a hill. My rifle had a 200 yrd zero but with the limited shot I mistakenly aimed a bit high which was where the bullet hit. The buck I got, was at 146 yrds. I had to wait till he took two steps in order to prevent from hitting the doe behind him. He finnally offered a quartering away shot then ran about 20 yrds at the shot. What a great hunt. I did order the .357 175 gr PR Dead Centers but they did not arrive till after I'd left the house. I think they would have worked great. Maybe next year.

[Busta]

Congratulations Norm!

Looks like a nice goat you got there.  What does one of those thing weigh, field dressed? Never hunted them, YET.