Author Topic: 300 yards and beyond - is it "hunting" or just "shooting"? (Read 5145 times)

kyote · « **on:** October 19, 2006, 05:52:17 PM »

300 yards and beyond - is it "hunting" or just "shooting"?
« on: October 10, 2006, 03:57:31 AM »

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Some people seem to think that its always possible to "get closer" and that hunters who take a (pick your range, but 300 yards is a common number) or longer shot are somehow less of a "hunter" and more of a "shooter".

There is no doubt that some "hunters" are merely people wandering around the woods with the weapon of their choice and that they are inept in the art of hunting as well as the art of using their weapon. This thread, however, is not about such people. It is not about the "general case" but rather about specific individuals and their skills, and the question of whether or not it really IS always possible to "get closer".

I think the answer is "No, it is not". In the 25 years I've been hunting Colroado big game I have gotten close enough to deer to reach out and touch them and have turned down quite a few shots at elk at rock-throwing distance. Nevertheless there have also been years when I was thankful that I could finally narrow the range down to 350 yards or even SEE an animal that matched my license.

Unfortunately there are often factors at work that are beyond the control of the hunter. Over the years I have seen many situations where it was impossible to "get closer" and a decision had to be made to shoot or go home empty handed. The wise hunter, IMHO, is prepared for the far shot as well as the close one.

I thought this was a great read (at least for the most part.)and was interested in relpying to it.But it was locked.I am wondering if GB would find it acceptable to do this post again?and hope fully this time we can stick to the questions asked by coyotehunter.

Graybeard · « **Reply #1 on:** October 19, 2006, 06:01:17 PM »

You're welcome to try it again but if the personal attacks start up again heads are gonna roll.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #2 on:** October 20, 2006, 01:11:25 AM »

Why bother? It is all subject to opinion. No matter what you or anyone else says, I am going to hunt the way I see fit. That is all I have to add to this discussion.

kyote · « **Reply #3 on:** October 20, 2006, 03:25:47 AM »

Redhawk I thought your replys and gbs and a couple others were great.then I think the arm chair folks got invovled and started the what ever..I don't have time right now but this week end I want to add to the post.you keep doing what your doing.you are one of the level ones.thank you.stay positive and don't let the b..s wear ya down..
and it went to a subject of opinion.and should not have.if we kinda stick with the intent(see below)I think it will be all right.if not..we will sic the rath of GB on em..he he he..

There is no doubt that some "hunters" are merely people wandering around the woods with the weapon of their choice and that they are inept in the art of hunting as well as the art of using their weapon. This thread, however, is not about such people. It is not about the "general case" but rather about specific individuals and their skills, and the question of whether or not it really IS always possible to "get closer".

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #4 on:** October 20, 2006, 04:14:17 AM »

kyote, know what you are saying, I know a lot of guys that go out on what they call hunting. Just as you described they are what I don't consider hunters.

To me a hunter is someone that puts his time in scouting, land management, practices his shoot skills on a regular basis, not just a week before hunting season starts. But for people to come here and judge all hunters and lump them into one category is wrong. The distance one shoots does not take away from there hunting skills. There is a lot of factors and reasons why someone makes a long distance shot. If the hunter is up to the task and thinks, that is his option at the time, then by all means he should take the shot.

I like to get as close to my game as possible and 95% of the time my shots are 100 yards or less, but I also practice long distance shooting just in case I need to make that shot and I have. There are just to any variables to make a judgement call if someone is shooting to far.

Don Fischer · « **Reply #5 on:** October 20, 2006, 05:38:21 AM »

I would think that it is the people that really are shooters that would stand up and say something about this thing many like to call "long range hunting". I agree with a lot of what Redhawk said. I think that hunters, no matter what range they choose to shoot, should be much more competent than many I've seen. And the guy that goes out once a year just befor the season, is a scar on all of us. Perhaps in the title of this thread, "hunting" or just "shooting", "just" should have been left out. For even those that do practice it know that it takes a special commitment to do it well. And when you have gotten into a range you choose to shoot, whatever that may be, its time for shooting skills to take over.

Where I live, I have access to shoot as far as I want within about 20 min of the house. And people all over Central Ore have the same opertunity, I don't run into many doing it. I have never run into anyone doing it. Outside of Brothers, east of Bend, is a shooting range I was at one time. As I recall they have a 1000yd range which would allow for some serious longe range practice. The guys we met there said it was used mostly by black powder shooters. The bulk of the centerfire shooters used the 100 and 200yd ranges.

Now is someone that never practices at 300+ yds a 300+ yard shooter? And if that is as close as you can get, do you need to be a shooter or a hunter? I think to many people that are not long range shooters want to associate hunting and shooting as one and the same to justify what they are doing. To many that don't practice regularly, REGULARLY, at those ranges go to higher velocity cartridges in the mistaken belief that it will make up for their lack of skills. I also think that most honest long range shooters use higher velocity cartridges to be able to use heavier bullets with better flight qualities which in turn buck wind somewhat better and deliver more down range energy. A good example would be Sourdoughs reason for going to a 338-378 for wolves at whatever that range was. He said he used to do it with a 30-06 but he wanted better power at those longer ranges. He could do it with a 30-06 but wanted something with more authority at those ranges.

How much of these things do the people Redhawk mentioned understand? How much do they really care about? This is all why I concider it shooting rather than hunting.

corbanzo · « **Reply #6 on:** October 20, 2006, 06:44:52 AM »

Talk to some of the sheep and goat hunters up here, they will tell you when its time to shoot long.

Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #7 on:** October 21, 2006, 02:53:52 AM »

Quote from: Redhawk1 on October 20, 2006, 04:14:17 AM

...To me a hunter is someone that puts his time in scouting, land management, practices his shoot skills on a regular basis, not just a week before hunting season starts. ...

Does 1-1/2 out of three count?

I hunt public land for elk and the area is a 4-5 hour drive rom home. Scouting time ahead of season equals zero. Pretty much the same story for deer, although every few years I get a draw license for private land right north of the house where I hunt coyotes. Antelope tags are on the same private land - when I can get them.

Land management? On public land? OR someone elses? No.

Practice shooting skills on a regular basis? That I do... Generally at the range at least once a month...

Skeptic10787 · « **Reply #8 on:** October 21, 2006, 04:01:19 PM »

Hunt [huhnt] -verb
1. To chase or search for (game or other wild animals) for the purpose of catching or killing.

That's the dictionary.com definition. In a literal sense, I agree with it.

nomosendero · « **Reply #9 on:** October 21, 2006, 04:12:21 PM »

300 yards & beyond, is it hunting or is it shooting. Well, as was illustrated last time by many, it may be shooting, or hunting & shooting.

I asked a simple question the last time we had this discussion by showing 2 different hunting situations & asking those who seem to
know exactly where hunting stops & shooting begins to tell me if 1 was only shooting & 1 was hunting or if both could be a combo
of the two. In fact I did this in 2 posts & 2 different ways. I know why the naysayers did not reply, so no need to think that they
would now, no need to bother.

Oh yea, one thing I will add since I remember one hunter said it was just not the case that we couldn't get closer. He said he had the experience to know better. Well, we can have alot of experience, but yet not experience everything, I know at least I have not experienced everything by a long shot, & some things I don't want to experience. Anyway, this happened to me once & I saw it
occur with a hunting companion as well. We were hunting Antelope on a ranch in WY. that borders a Ranch that was off limits to us.
We were doing a little spot & stalk type hunting & glassing when we saw a band of Antelope heading toward the other ranch &
quite close to the fence. I asked our rancher what would happen if I shot the Antelope, but he crossed the fence before going down. He said that can be a problem with some, but he had a relationship with the other rancher & retreiving the animal would not be a problem, but we cannot hunt on the ranch. So, I took position & took care of that. One of my friends did the same with a Mule Deer. Could we get closer, no because we had to set up quickly to get a shot at all, but enough time to be confident of a fairly long shot. The same can be true of a Deer that is about to go over a rise, & no I am not talking about him standing on the very top &
you don't know where the bullet is going. If he is about to dissapear over a ridge & you have a place to get into shooting position,
or yoh have to pass through some tall sage for a couple hundred yards to get into shooting position, but the Deer will top the ridge
in a few seconds, now what? I know what I will do if I am confident of range, POI, wind & if the animal pauses just long enough.

Yes, there are times when you can't get closer, I have seen it as I said before at least twice & the othe was a situation or example
that I have heard other hunters discuss as their experinces. Many of us encounter different situation & that is why I don't like these
blanket or "one size fits all statements", because it just doesn't work. I wanted to post this last week, but when I got on there I
found it was locked.

Otherwise, I think we pretty much covered it last time & not much will be accomplished. That's cool with me though, you can hunt
& shoot under the conditions hopefully where you are totally confident & I will do the same without worry if someone approves or
does not approve as long as I pay taxes & buy my own licences.

crow_feather · « **Reply #10 on:** October 21, 2006, 06:41:01 PM »

To practice the 500 yard shot at the range, while on a bench, and then go to the forest and try the same shot off a backpack is not the best of ideas. I would say that those varmint and coyote hunters that shoot from bipods while proned out would probably make the best long shooters.

But then, it is like shooting offhand at 100 yards. Many people can't hit a deer sized object at that range unless they are leaning on or resting the rifle on something. It was many years ago that I was at the USMC Rifle Range. But I believe I remember that the quote was "A 1/16th inch error will be a 12" error at 500 yards". It doesn't give a person any room for error.

99.9 per cent of the hunters will aim dead on at 500 yards. If there is any wind, the shot will be off. Also, a 1" moa at 100 yards does not mean a five inch group at 500 yards. Bullets can be more - or less accurate with a decrease in velocity. A trigger pull that is safe for a person wearing gloves is detrimental to a good shot at 500 yards. Then you have people that sight in and practice at 250 foot elevation when it is 75 degrees. They travel to 6000 foot elevation and hunt in 30 degree weather, expecting the same velocity and trajectory that they practiced with at home.

The longer the distance, the more factors that come into play. Why do you think that a sniper is a specialized position in the military? It takes training and knowledge. The fact that there is a great chance that an animal will suffer until it dies makes me want to tell most people to hold their shots at that range.

The other problem that isn't usually brought up is that there could be a hunter between you and that animal making a stalk to get in for the close shot. If you can't be sure your firing line is clear, on both sides of the animal, then you are pressing your luck. You must also remember that a hunter 400 yards out is a very hard target to see.

So look at the pros and cons.

Pros - you get your elk or deer or what ever.

Cons - better chance to wound or loose a wounded animal
possibility of shooting someone who is much closer to the animal than you
probability of missing due to wind, velocity change, bullet destabilization, trigger pull, small branch blocking target not visible
500 yards away, uncomfortable shooting position, or just being 1/16" off in one direction or another.

In closing, I guess it comes down to ethics and common sense. Are you a good enough shot to gurantee that there will be no cons just so you can tag an animal?

nomosendero · « **Reply #11 on:** October 22, 2006, 08:47:36 AM »

Crow feather said "In closing, I guess it comes down to ethics & common sense. Are you a good enough shot to guarantee that there will be no cons just so you can tag an animal?"

We should always strive for that regardless of range, those principles would apply to 50 yards or 500 yards. Actually I don't know why anyone would shoot at any yardage they are are not set up for to assure a quick kill.

Just like the Mil., the person who is able to shoot distance is in the minority, we know that. It just goes back to the fact that we need to shoot at ranges within our abilities.

As far as the idea that it is harder to know if there is a hunter between you and the animal at long range, that is not necessarily the
case. I hunt in very steep country here in AR. sometimes & an opening in the forrest on another hillside may only be a couple of hundred yards away, & it is harder to see everything between me and the Deer in this case than when Mule Deer hunting in WY. at
longer ranges, but regardless, we have to know it is safe before fireing.

ScoutMan · « **Reply #12 on:** October 22, 2006, 09:15:20 AM »

In the Larry Gibson post, he had a range finder, new its range, had a scope that could compensate for the extended range, had a solid rest. His ony variable was wind. In my humble opinion, he had taken care of 90% of the variables. It was an ethical shot.

crow_feather · « **Reply #13 on:** October 22, 2006, 06:12:27 PM »

An ethical shot is one that has taken care of 100 % of the variables. A 10% miss is still a miss. And there is more than range, rest, and wind. If a person doesn't know what they are, the person should limit his range.

A

Sourdough · « **Reply #14 on:** October 22, 2006, 09:10:43 PM »

A few years ago, I was visiting my Dad in Tennessee. Midday and we were sitting on the carport drinking tea and just talking and visiting. My uncle looked up and saw a Whitetail doe walking across a clearing. He mentioned it and said too bad it was so far away. I asked why, He said there will probably be a buck following her and she is too far away to shoot at. My uncle said you cann't shoot at anything beyond 150 yards, gun won't reach and you can't hit it that far out. (Here you have to realise, the only thing he had ever shot was a 30-30, 22rf, and 12ga shotgun, period in his life. Anything more powerful was outside his realm of experience). I asked him about how far away he thought the deer was? He and my Dad both said 500 yards at least. At the time I had my first Shepard scope on a .338win mag. The scope ranged the deer to 450 yards. When the buck appeared I took the shot, instant kill. That bullet dropped at that range 24 to 26 inches, and I knew that so therefore I knew where to aim. My uncle and my Dad were astonished, and they had to tell everyone. That practically started a war in the family. My brothers who also had never shot anything but 30-30s, and .35 Remingtons, thought it unethical for anyone to shoot beyond 150 yards. Knowing their limited experience, (practice for them is going out behind the barn and shooting one to three shots at a fence post the day before season starts someyears), I could see where they were coming from. The problem was they were refusing to admit or accept the fact that their views were not the only ways out there. When I told them that my guns were sighted in for 300 yards, they said no gun could shoot that far accurately, and no shooter can hold a gun steady enough to shoot that far anyway.

I honestly understand where they are coming from, and understand that they honestly believe the ideas they have in their heads, to their way of thinking is the only way period. So that is one subject we do not discuss. And I don't hunt with any of my brothers, I only hunt with my Dad. Dad is the only one with an open mind, he is also the only one who has came to Alaska to hunt with me..

Some people would say the shot I made earlier this week was unethical. I wanted to kill a cow Moose and only had varmit loads with me for my 30-06. I got to within 80 yards of her without her knowing I was there. I was unable to get closer due to dry brush getting too thick. At 80 yards I know my bullet will hit 2 1/4 inches high, so I compensated for that. I placed the bullet right behind her ear, killed her instantly. Anywhere else and that lightly constructed bullet would have only made a nasty surface wound. But as someone else said I took care of 100% of the variables. I don't consider that unethical.

ScoutMan · « **Reply #15 on:** October 23, 2006, 08:58:01 AM »

Quote from: crow_feather on October 22, 2006, 06:12:27 PM

An ethical shot is one that has taken care of 100 % of the variables. A 10% miss is still a miss. And there is more than range, rest, and wind. If a person doesn't know what they are, the person should limit his range.

100% perfection is only to be found in Valhalla. There are variables at 50 yds, 100 yds, etc. If we waited to eliminate all variables, we would never go into the woods.

nasem · « **Reply #16 on:** October 23, 2006, 09:47:56 AM »

Like redhawk says, its all subjected to opinion. And of course opinion SHOULD be based on someone's skills and capabilities.

kyote · « **Reply #17 on:** October 25, 2006, 04:50:33 PM »

there is a lot of good debate/writing here.I think today there are fewer hunters out there and more just shooters.
To get to an animal to shoot it, you must 1st hunt for it.be it a lucky stumble upon it, are you scouted pior to the hunt.even just being a good hunter and knowing what to look for when you arrive to the area where you are going to hunt.then when you see the animal,what next,lot of things going now,wind,cover,other animals that you are not hunting, like a tree rat that gives out the forest alert,and how close or how far it is from you.can you get closer?normally, yes you can.If you want to.and how bad do you want to?I have got so close I have jumped on them and killed them with a matchette/knife.not on some ranch with feeders.but in the jungles of central america.No big thing plenty of others have done it.to me it does not really matter how close are far it is when I see it.If I need to get close I will try.I now have no problem shooting a deer at 400 yards are better.Not over 500 yards though.I have a steel plate (9"x11")that is set at 535 yards depending on who lases it are which range finder we use.it can be a little closer.but not under 500 yards.I whale on that plate with my hunting rifles.yes, I use a nice sturdy bench.and all the helpfull acoochements that go with it.But,I know my rifles and ammo by playing with that plate.it has not got boring yet and probaly will not.I have a back pack that I but on the table and shoot off of.as long as I am off my feet and resting the rifle.I can hit the plate.no big Deal one of my buds with his 30-30 lever gun offhand whales on the ram at 500 meters with no scope.he can't see the plate at that distance to shoot at it..and most of my friends can whale on it after they learn how.But there are not a lot of folks that shoot at it.other folks that go out there and shoot normally set up at 100 yards fewer at 200 and even fewer at 300 yards.when they come over to see what were doing we invite them to shoot.off my bench use my rest ect.even my rifle.no one ever does.which leads me to believe most folks won't take the long shot.But,I am not so sure that is an accurate statement either.When out in the field and no one is looking ,they might just try it to fill the tag.
Having seen things out in the fields during hunting season.(My first outing in the U.S.)I went to the department of game and fish and told them what I had observed in the field.And asked how we could empliment a way for hunters to prove them selves before allowing them to have a deer or elk Lic...they would love to.But money prohibites it.and man power.
Two examples of many horrors that I saw.
1)My dad and I used to go to this really nice area in the mts.Lots of huge mule deer tasety ones, as there were apple orchards in the valleys down in the bottom of the mts.we set up in ths place I called the funnel tons of hunters hunting the north end (big area)and we would head to the south end were animals might move to to get out of the hunters way.very rugged and kinda remote.hardly ever saw any one else around there.we would set up in the rocks on the side of the mt.looking in to the forest and fingers comin out to this ravien that lead to another forest area were it was fenced.any how I see a doe way out there on the edge of the trees coming my way.my dad signals that he see's it also.were using our bino's.I look over to my right and see actually heard 1st two folks come over a myt top and stand there looking thru the rifle scope in front of them.they never saw us.Does are not legal, only three points are better.I thought this doe will come out in front of them.there is a canyon /valley between the doe and this man and women only the man has a rifle.the doe is moveing hard.tongue hanging out to the ground she just wants to get as far from the hunters as she could.I felt sorry for her.she was a small doe also.when the doe got ot were they could see it.it took em a while to spot it then I saw the rifle go up they did not have binos,this doe was now over 400 yards from them.the guy started shooting the doe ran down hill diagonaly towards me she would have to run a little ways up hill to get to the little valley next to me and escape he shot and reloaded.15 shots.he hit the doe in its left knee.. As she ran by me(I could have smacked her on her rump.)I saw the leg dangaling.well I never have been one to let an animal suffer.I will normally spend all the lighted hours to track a wounded animal if need be.or look for a dove I downed and can not locate.so off I went to try and dispatch this wounded doe.I tracked her down to a wash with these tall pines growing on the sides of it.was dark in there.I walked carfully and slowly as If she stopped I did not want to spook her.And wanted to try and put her down asap.there was sand and rock in the wash made tracking easy.then the tracks stopped.like thin air she disapeared into.so I had to look harder.there was a down tree I went back and could see that she crawled under it in a spot the water had washed the sand away.I looked in and saw her.she was looking at me and shaking.I put a 7mm mag bullet between her eyes.we can say her head blew off her body.
I went back to were my dad was. and saw the guy that shot her.he was all proud that he had hit it and asked if I saw it.I said yea,it went this way.he followed me then I let hium take over to see if he could find it.He had no idea I had found and shot her.well he could not find it..so I said look under here.when he saw the deer I said pull it out.he did and said my rilfe did that??as he saw the head 1st.I said no,I put it out out its misery.here is were you hit her.and showed the knee to him.he said it's a doe.I thought it was a buck.I said.well should not go to waste..you should take it for camp meat.I knew he was with a bunch of other folks.he had red hair and was the only one that brought his wife with out to the woods with him.I had seen them before.
I met the game warden that evening..went back and showed him were the deer was.sob never took it. let it go to waste.the hunter (if that is the correct word for the guy)was easy for the warden to find.He was the only red head in the area with his wife.

Slamfire · « **Reply #18 on:** October 25, 2006, 05:31:25 PM »

Quote from: corbanzo on October 20, 2006, 06:44:52 AM

Talk to some of the sheep and goat hunters up here, they will tell you when its time to shoot long.

I think I stated that trophy hunters NEED to shoot at game 400 or more yards away, but meat hunters don't. Once upon a time meat hunters shot sheep, but now it is too expensive for them.

Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #19 on:** October 25, 2006, 06:31:04 PM »

Quote from: kyote on October 25, 2006, 04:50:33 PM

....so off I went to try and dispatch this wounded doe.....I put a 7mm mag bullet between her eyes....

FYI - in Colorado your actions, while understandable, would have been illegal.

Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #20 on:** October 25, 2006, 06:35:51 PM »

Quote from: Slamfire on October 25, 2006, 05:31:25 PM

I think I stated that trophy hunters NEED to shoot at game 400 or more yards away, but meat hunters don't.

Sorry, I don’t buy the argument. In fact, I would suggest the meat hunters ***may*** well have the greater “NEED” – as well as the greater moral justification for shooting past distances for which they are fully prepared.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #21 on:** October 26, 2006, 01:23:25 AM »

Quote from: kyote on October 25, 2006, 04:50:33 PM

there is a lot of good debate/writing here.I think today there are fewer hunters out there and more just shooters.
To get to an animal to shoot it, you must 1st hunt for it.

Again, that is just "your" opinion. It is ludicrous to put a distance on when it is called hunting.

In the eastern States most long shots are 200 yards, out west, it is not uncommon for a shot at 300 to 400 yards. There are just way to many variables in a hunt to determine at what distance it is to long and therefor considered shooting and not hunting.

John R. · « **Reply #22 on:** October 26, 2006, 03:33:11 AM »

If you know your rifle (and you should) 300 to 400 yds. is no big stretch under the right conditions. The longest shot I've made was 275 yds. with my 7mm/08 zeroed at 200 yds. With that particular rifle I try to limit shots to 300 yds maximum. However with a 7mm Ultra Mag sighted in correctly 400 yds. would not be a problem on a deer standing still. It all depends on your skill level with your rifle.

Blammer · « **Reply #23 on:** October 26, 2006, 05:01:22 AM »

I was in TX hunting hogs with my 25 WSSM. I was zeroed for out to 200 yards. It was the farthest I'd planned to shoot a hog. Most of the time you can pretty much walk up to them to get a few. I digress.....

We decided to do some nightime coyote hunting. We set the caller up and called, then shined around. Found 3 pair of eyes looking back. Setting up on a 6" diameter level cut telephone pole at "just my height" made for a GREAT solid rest for my AR. (Just as good as being bagged in at the range!) I dialed the scope to max and let fly a round at the song dogs. Nothing. Another, and another. I stopped after 3 and determined they are WAAAY out there. After missing and calming down from the excitement. I then realized they are farther out than I was accustom to seeing pretty much anything. Being from NC where the farthest shot MAY be 150 yards, and in the dark in a "foreign" land really skewed my ability to judge distance. I was sure I was within my ability to cleanly take the animal. whoops....

anyway, the entire point is. I was HUNTING, there was no way to get closer because it was an open field we would have had to cross to get to them.

the next day we went back and measured the distance it was 290 yards.

I am sure some of the locals would have dropped them, because they would have been accustomed to shooting at that distance. For them 300 yards is like my 100 yards.

I will have to say, it's my experience, an individuals hunting distance is determined by that individual.

I was just out of my skill level on that event.

992 · « **Reply #24 on:** October 26, 2006, 05:24:35 AM »

Maybe we should have to be certified to get a hunting permit,if you cannot shoot and hit from any position,at at least 500yards,then all you can get is a rock throwing learners permit.
Then again,some of us,like me,would probly cheat and carry a slingshot.
Most people pay the same thing for a hunting permit,that the pro's do,so I don't guess that that price reflects anybody being ''special''.

992

Don Fischer · « **Reply #25 on:** October 26, 2006, 04:09:21 PM »

Quote from: Blammer on October 26, 2006, 05:01:22 AM

I was in TX hunting hogs with my 25 WSSM. I was zeroed for out to 200 yards. It was the farthest I'd planned to shoot a hog. Most of the time you can pretty much walk up to them to get a few. I digress.....

We decided to do some nightime coyote hunting. We set the caller up and called, then shined around. Found 3 pair of eyes looking back. Setting up on a 6" diameter level cut telephone pole at "just my height" made for a GREAT solid rest for my AR. (Just as good as being bagged in at the range!) I dialed the scope to max and let fly a round at the song dogs. Nothing. Another, and another. I stopped after 3 and determined they are WAAAY out there. After missing and calming down from the excitement. I then realized they are farther out than I was accustom to seeing pretty much anything. Being from NC where the farthest shot MAY be 150 yards, and in the dark in a "foreign" land really skewed my ability to judge distance. I was sure I was within my ability to cleanly take the animal. whoops....

anyway, the entire point is. I was HUNTING, there was no way to get closer because it was an open field we would have had to cross to get to them.

the next day we went back and measured the distance it was 290 yards.

I am sure some of the locals would have dropped them, because they would have been accustomed to shooting at that distance. For them 300 yards is like my 100 yards.

I will have to say, it's my experience, an individuals hunting distance is determined by that individual.

I was just out of my skill level on that event.

WOW! Shooting at night with a spotlight at eyes at 290yds. How did you, first, see the eyes and, then, how did you know what they were?

Mac11700 · « **Reply #26 on:** October 26, 2006, 07:20:14 PM »

Quote from: Don Fischer on October 26, 2006, 04:09:21 PM

Quote from: Blammer on October 26, 2006, 05:01:22 AM
I was in TX hunting hogs with my 25 WSSM. I was zeroed for out to 200 yards. It was the farthest I'd planned to shoot a hog. Most of the time you can pretty much walk up to them to get a few. I digress.....

We decided to do some nightime coyote hunting. We set the caller up and called, then shined around. Found 3 pair of eyes looking back. Setting up on a 6" diameter level cut telephone pole at "just my height" made for a GREAT solid rest for my AR. (Just as good as being bagged in at the range!) I dialed the scope to max and let fly a round at the song dogs. Nothing. Another, and another. I stopped after 3 and determined they are WAAAY out there. After missing and calming down from the excitement. I then realized they are farther out than I was accustom to seeing pretty much anything. Being from NC where the farthest shot MAY be 150 yards, and in the dark in a "foreign" land really skewed my ability to judge distance. I was sure I was within my ability to cleanly take the animal. whoops....

anyway, the entire point is. I was HUNTING, there was no way to get closer because it was an open field we would have had to cross to get to them.

the next day we went back and measured the distance it was 290 yards.

I am sure some of the locals would have dropped them, because they would have been accustomed to shooting at that distance. For them 300 yards is like my 100 yards.

I will have to say, it's my experience, an individuals hunting distance is determined by that individual.

I was just out of my skill level on that event.

WOW! Shooting at night with a spotlight at eyes at 290yds. How did you, first, see the eyes and, then, how did you know what they were?

Maybe one of those 3 billion candle watt hand held spot lights?

Mac

Don Fischer · « **Reply #27 on:** October 27, 2006, 05:05:50 AM »

When I was a kid and after my first turn at holding the burlap bag on a snipe hunt, I would take other kids out and put them on a stand with a burlap bag, in the dark, in the brush, to wait for their snipe to come along! Or a 55gr Hornady, whatever the case might be!

kyote · « **Reply #28 on:** October 27, 2006, 11:52:14 AM »

Don,
I wonder if most folks understand what you just wrote??I sure as heck do...

I did not have time the other night to make light are post the 2nd horror story of many I have seen..will try to night.whole differnt scenerio..

Blammer · « **Reply #29 on:** October 27, 2006, 02:20:20 PM »

Actually it was one of those light force 170 with the big bulb.

We could tell they were coyotes by the way they moved around and how they sat.