Author Topic: Car for kid, and related issues?  (Read 974 times)

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Offline Questor

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Car for kid, and related issues?
« on: October 25, 2006, 09:36:36 AM »
I've got a teenager now and don't like the idea of having him drive solo when he's 16. I'd just as soon have him learn driving starting at 16 but wait until 18 to have his own car.  Among other things, the insurance statistics look pretty grim for the youngest of drivers.

Do you have any thoughts on how best to introduce kids to driving?
Safety first

Offline jpsmith1

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2006, 11:09:33 AM »
No offense, but you are probably too late.  I've already started teaching my kids to drive.  They are 3 and 5.  They each drive a lawn tractor (with me on it too) an ATV ( SOLO!!!!)  and a dirtbike (The 5 year old).  I'm a firm believer in starting early.  I'm also already teaching them to shoot and handload because they show an interest in it.

I'll be if someone did a further breakdown on the insurance stats, they'd find that farm boys and generally rural people are less prone to accidents because they have been exposed to large, powerful and heavy machines early in life and learned to respect what the machines can do.  City boys don't get that.  They might have to push a little mower around a postage stamp.

Just my two cents worth.
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Offline Questor

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2006, 04:49:19 AM »
I've started my kids on riding lawnmowers and boats. They are OK. I do see a difference between technically operating the equipment in a traffic-free area and operating on public thorofares. The difference is the judgement that it takes to cooperate with other drivers.

The insurance stats I don't like are that 16 year-old drivers are 10 times more likely than 25 year old drivers to be involved in a collision. If there is a passenger, it is 20 times more likely, and if there are two or more passengers, it is 30 times more likely. Figures are from Insurance Institute.  Delaying driving until 18 cuts the likelihood of accidents a lot.
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Offline prairiedog555

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #3 on: January 12, 2007, 12:02:52 PM »
The most dangerous time of day to drive is when high school gets out. 
My kid was given plenty driving practice, but within the first month driving she got 2 tickets, a wreck and a minor in posession, (one of her friends had it in car_
I am in favor of 18 for driving.  In this little town 5 kids in 3 accidents have been killed in last year.

Offline beemanbeme

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2007, 12:40:06 PM »
I, seemingly in the minority these days, do not think its some sort of "rites of passage" for a kid to get a car at 16.  I don't have a problem with them getting a job at that age and helping out with their overhead. 
I raised two sons and neither got a car while they lived at home.  They had access to a car (if it didn't inconvience their Mother or me) and they paid for any increase in our insurence and kept their mother's car full of gas.  Sorry, no free rides in life; no free rides at my house. 

"a ticket, a wreak, and a possession charge"  Wow, that kid wouldn't be driving one of my cars. 

Offline Sourdough

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #5 on: January 12, 2007, 01:04:46 PM »
Here kids can get their learners permit at 14, they have to have it for one year before they can get a licsense.  Then for the first six months they are not allowed to have anyone on the vehicle under the age of 21, except siblings.

I started my son driving at the age of 8.  I took him out on the pipeline right of way and let him drive my old VW Beetle.  He slao drove my track rig and helped pull stumps.  Then when we went hunting I let him drive the Buggy no faster than second gear while we cruised the trail for Moose.  He also started driving snowmachines and fourwheelers by himself at the age of 10.  So when he turned 14 he was not too excited about getting his learners permit.  In fact he did not get it for two months after he turned 15, there fore he did not get his drivers licsense till a couple of months after he turned 16.  His Mother gave him a small SUV to drive then, that lasted for two weeks.  The girls said "it was quite", put his ego in the basement.  Then his mother and he witnessed two of his friends get broadsided in a small SUV by someone that ran a red light driving a big truck.  The next day he asked me for my old 87 F-150.  I let him drive it for one week, checking on his progress, without him knowing it.  I soon realised he was the most cautious teenage driver I had seen.  I bought him a BRIGHT SCREAMING YELLOW 2003 Chevy S-10 with ZR-2 package.  The girls love it.  Sharp truck, but according to him the worst thing I ever did to him.  He claims he pickups a police escort everytime he drives into North Pole or Fairbanks.  He does not dare speed, run a stop sign, or even think about going through a yellow traffic light.  He's 18 now and been driving for two years.  The only accident was backing out of the garage, and trying to get around my pickup.  He backed into a tree.  Dented his truck, made him sick.

Last Monday night he and I were driving back from town, the topic turned to seat belts.  Sky said he could not understand why anyone would drive without one.  Then he said," Dad I just got a real cold chill".  At that time one of his best friends had an accident just north of Fairbanks.  He slid on the ice and crossed the center line.  His friend was driving a Dodge Caravan, and was hit on the passengers side by a Ford Explorer.  His friend sustained massive head injuries, and transported to Anchorage.  They took him off life support the next morning after his parents arrived.  Seatbelt was not used is in the police report.  If he had been wearing his seatbelt he could and probably would have survived that accident, since only the passengers side was damaged.  Sky just left to go to a get togeather of his friends trying to deal with their loss. 

Circumstances have prevailed, to make my son think of driving as a very serious responsiability.  I don't worry about his driving, I worry about the drunks and drug users out there he is faced with each and every day.

We have to let them fly sometime, we can't protect them for life.
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Offline sparsons

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #6 on: January 12, 2007, 02:18:07 PM »
nope you aint alone. I grew up in th 60's. I didn't have a car till my second year in college and I bought that one. None of my friends had cars either. I did use my folks car. I had keys to my mom's car and I also had a job and was helping her make payments on the car. My dad sold cars so I grew up respecting the value of the machine. I took drivers ed. which helped some but most of my driving education came from my dad. Age does not make one entitled to anything. If a son or daughter thinks they  should have a car at 16 or 17 years of age that would be my first clue that they are not even close to being mature enough to drive me to the store.  I had to earn the respect of my parents before I got the family cars by myself. I made a decision  I would only allow two other people in the car with me, I made this on my own. Those two people were not allowed to yell and carry on like idiots nor could they smoke in the car. I think the most important thing my dad taught me was respect for the car.  I see very little of this today even among adults.

Offline hysteriapb

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2007, 08:01:53 AM »
I'll be if someone did a further breakdown on the insurance stats, they'd find that farm boys and generally rural people are less prone to accidents because they have been exposed to large, powerful and heavy machines early in life and learned to respect what the machines can do.  City boys don't get that.  They might have to push a little mower around a postage stamp.

Quoted for truth.
Im now 18 (soon to be 19) and i grew up driving lawnmowers, tractors, and trucks on my grandparents farm not far from my home. I believe that makes a big difference... Since I got my license at 16 i've only had one ticket (which i paid) and one "accident" (i hit a deer that ran out right in front of me and it broke a headlight). My sister (just 17 now) didn't have this farm experience and in just one year of driving she's been pulled over 6 times, amazingly enough she'd avoided a ticket each of those times. I think it really depends on the kid... how responsible they are, how much you can trust them.
Also i did get a car when i turned 16, not right away but a few months after, but i had to drive myself and sister to school 35 miles everyday so it was kinda necessary, but i paid for my own gas when i drove somewhere besides school. One thing i would point out (not trying to be the bad guy...) if you choose to not allow your child to have a car, they will likely ride with their friends who get already have licenses which very well may be worse...

Offline Sourdough

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2007, 09:03:19 AM »
hysteriapb:  Well said about them riding with friends.  When my son first got his licsense and started driving many of his friends wanted him to drive them places.  It was hard for him to say no, but he did not want to have his probationary period extended for getting caught with other kids in his car so he refused to take them.  One of his friends had gotten a new ford pickup, (her folks are rich) and she started driving her friends around. Second day she wrecked.  Judge took her driving priveledges for 6 months, then she had to start all over again getting a new licsence with a new probation period.   

As for me, when I turned 16 I bought my own car.  A 1954 Plymouth, 4 door sedan, flathead six, and a three speed shift on the column.  That was in 1965, and so far the only accidents I've had was when people ran stop signs and I broadsided them.  That has happened twice. 

I always thought it was improtant that the kid buy his or her own vehicle.  But my wife felt differant and gave our son his first vehicle.  She gave him a little KIA Sprotage, I felt sorry for him driving this little femanine vehicle, (that is his words, my feeling also) So I bought him a pick-up.  He is paying half of the price of the vehicle, that was our deal.  I paid 50% down, then financed the rest and he is making the payments.
Where is old Joe when we really need him?  Alaska Independence    Calling Illegal Immigrants "Undocumented Aliens" is like calling Drug Dealers "Unlicensed Pharmacists"
What Is A Veteran?
A 'Veteran' -- whether active duty, discharged, retired, or reserve -- is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote a blank check made payable to 'The United States of America,' for an amount of 'up to, and including his life.' That is honor, and there are way too many people in this country today who no longer understand that fact.

Offline Swamp Fox

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2007, 02:28:23 PM »
I do the 50/50 thing with my kids.
They have all been involved in extracurricular(?) activities and had jobs. We would get an inexpensive but servicable car and have them make payments that equal half the value of the car and half the value of the insurance. By the time they paid their half there wasn't much "party" money, or time, left.
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Offline toysoldier

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2007, 06:18:49 PM »
I think that starting kids driving early just increases the likelihood that they will have a serious accident early. I know, lots of kids on farms drive lots of thing early. They also have a much higher rate of accidental death than city kids. Driving safely requires the development of coordinated muscle skills and cognitive ability that show up in their own time. I see no reason to be in a hurry to teach a kid to drive, and I'm happy that many states issue very conditional licences to young people.

As for what vehicle, I'd say something not too big or powerful. What's a "feminine" car, anyway? There's too much cr#p about "macho" vehicles for boys who don't have a handle on their hormones yet. If you want to kill your child, give him/her a muscle car *and* a cell phone.

Offline Sourdough

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #11 on: January 14, 2007, 09:41:58 PM »
Toysoldier:  I totally disagree.  I took a survey so to speak, the other night at a Hocky game.  I ask parents about the driving record of their kids.  The ones that had been driving since they were big enough to reach the pedels have not had any moving violations or accidents.  Yes, some of them, like my son have bumped into trees along the driveway, or slid on the ice and gone into a ditch.  But they have had no accidents on the streets or highways.  Several kids on his hocky team that are the city type kids, their parents did not teach them to drive till the were 14 or 15, are not able to drive right now due to speeding tickets, accidents, tickets for running red lights,  and even a DWI.  One young lady in his class has totaled three vehicles.

I have a nephew that lives in Virginia.  There they have to undergo a strict routine before being allowed to drive.  Then they are on probation for a long time.  Can not drive alone till the age of 18.  The first thing my nephew did when he got out to drive on his own, at the age of 18.  He was going down a residential street at 70mph in his Moms Mini Van.  He hit a cross street, lost control, went into a convenience store parking lot.  Hit the curb and went airborne.  Tore the front suspension off the car.  Insurance canceled, big fine, and totaled Van.  It totally blew everyones mind in Virginia last year when I let my son drive to the grocery store.  He was sixteen then, and I sent him by himself.  No need for me to go with him he knew where to go.  Back there they have a provisional licsence till they are 18, and his cousins can not drive alone.

As for Feminine vehicles and Masculine vehicles.  Some vehicles like the little KIA Sprotage is preferred by girls, because it is small and easy to get around in parking lots.  In other words easy to drive.  Young men up here won't be caught dead in one.  A Macho vehicle is one that can be used both on and off road.  That is not improtant down south in some states, and areas.  But here in Alaska it is a big issue.  We drive in ice and snow nine months out of the year.  And if someone gets stuck in a snow bank, every young man wants a vehicle that can either power its own way out and back onto the road, or can pull a friend out.  The nearest tow truck is sometimes 300 miles away.  To go to our cabin we often run through 2ft of snow for 27 miles, and cross one river with no bridge.  My son's truck and mine will make that trip with no problem.  Also by starting our kids early they learn how to handle that high horse power, and high center of gravity before they are turned loose on the roads.  They learn to respect the machines they are driving.  Oh yes the kid tipped over a truck when he was twelve.  We were on our way to the cabin in the spring, he was going about 10 mph.  His right wheels broke through some ice.  The truck he was driving had five foot tractor tires mounted on it.  Over he went, seatbelt held him in place.  He never even unbuckled his seatbelt.  I hooked a cable onto the frame and pulled him back onto his wheels with the tractor.  I held him from going back over till he pulled forward and got out of the hole.  He had to drive the truck, so I could drive the tracked tractor.

I also feel every kid should have lessons on an ice skid pad.  My son turns 18 in a few weeks, and I would not hesitate to put him in a semi and let him head for the lower 48 down through Canada alone.  The training I have given him I feel he could handle it.  When he goes on a date he always takes another couple and he drives my F-350 diesel, supercrew, longbed, duelly.  If he can navigate a parking lot with that thing he can drive anywhere.
Where is old Joe when we really need him?  Alaska Independence    Calling Illegal Immigrants "Undocumented Aliens" is like calling Drug Dealers "Unlicensed Pharmacists"
What Is A Veteran?
A 'Veteran' -- whether active duty, discharged, retired, or reserve -- is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote a blank check made payable to 'The United States of America,' for an amount of 'up to, and including his life.' That is honor, and there are way too many people in this country today who no longer understand that fact.

Offline williamlayton

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #12 on: January 15, 2007, 12:29:13 AM »
I am so glad I do not have to go thru that episode again.
I feel for you guys.
I was lucky because I got a Lic. at 14--but not a car til I was in college.
My son got an old wreck of a car---which was fine with him. He had a few episodes.
You can't protect them from life.
Blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline 30-30man

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #13 on: January 15, 2007, 02:53:18 AM »
If you get your kid a car.  I'd suggest something safe but with very limited power.  I started my kids with a Ford Escort.  It was small enough so they could handle it and had very little power.  I only managed to have to take care of one fender bender.  What ever you do don't buy the kid anything with a v-8.  Your asking for trouble.  Their first car should have the power of a mo-ped. Most of us started driving at 15 but it is a different world now.  Good luck!

Offline magooch

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #14 on: January 15, 2007, 03:19:52 AM »
Our two kids got their own car/pickup when they were 16.  My wife and I told them they had better be very careful and take care of their rigs, because if anything happened to them, or if they got a ticket, they would be walking.  Under no circumstances would they ever be allowed to drive any of our cars, or trucks.  It worked for us.
Swingem

Offline beemanbeme

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #15 on: January 15, 2007, 04:38:05 AM »
When I add up the numbers, I seem to keep coming up with the same answers:  For the cost of a Ford 350 dually 4x4 --especially with the add on goodies like winches and roll bars so the kid won't have any gender confusion-- a young person could buy a "girlie" car and go to college for a couple of years. 

Offline Sourdough

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #16 on: January 15, 2007, 12:24:04 PM »
3030MAN:  Something you said struck home.  You mentioned it's a differant world than when we started driving. 

Yes I live in Alaska, we drive on Ice and Snow nine months of the year.  But the traffic is comperable to when I started driving in rural Tennessee back in the 60s.  From North Pole to Fairbanks there is an hour of ruch traffic in the morning and an hour in the evening.  When I usually drive in around 9 or10 AM I might meet six or seven cars in the 20 miles during the winter.  During the summer there might be 50 or 60, due to toursit.  Here it is still like it was in the lower 48, 40 or 50 years ago.  Another thing that makes it a great place to raise kids.

Another thing the kids do up here is what they call rallying.  We have impressed upon them the fact that the highway is not the place to have fun, but the place for serious driving.  So to have fun, they will pool their money and get an old beater(something like an old GEO Storm or Metro.  Or an old Escort, Nisson, or Toyota, even an old Crown Victoria once, they will take it out on the trails, or to a gravel pit behind my place, and run it hard.  Two rules, strictly enforced by the kids, seatbelts and helmets required.  Yes, they sometimes run into trees, bogs, banks, and jumps.  But at least there is no one else out there to run into.  Usually one good jump where they go airborne will damage the front end enough they have to drag it home.  Then they get out the cutting torch and cut the front fenders, and any other body parts that are causing trouble.  Sometimes they have to weld A-arms back in place.  Then they go again.  By the end of the day the vehicle is totally distroyed.  They cut it up, throw it in a truck, and haul it to the dump.  Seems to get the wild impulses out of their systems.  They have been doing this for four years now, about every three to four months.  Not a single one of these kids have ever gotten a citation, or had an accident.  They know what it's like to roll a vehicle, and the causes.  They understand the limits that can be placed on a vehicle before it goes out of control, and the consaquences of loosing control. 

The weather that has everyone stranded right now in the midwest is a common occurance to us, and our kids drive on it right off the bat.   If we let the weather bother us we would never go anywhere.  We had seven inches of snow yesterday, it's snowing now, and more expected for tomorrow and Wednesday.  We've had our dirt street plowed once this winter, and might get it plowed once more before spring breakup in April.
Where is old Joe when we really need him?  Alaska Independence    Calling Illegal Immigrants "Undocumented Aliens" is like calling Drug Dealers "Unlicensed Pharmacists"
What Is A Veteran?
A 'Veteran' -- whether active duty, discharged, retired, or reserve -- is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote a blank check made payable to 'The United States of America,' for an amount of 'up to, and including his life.' That is honor, and there are way too many people in this country today who no longer understand that fact.

Offline 30-30man

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #17 on: January 15, 2007, 02:21:38 PM »
l've always wanted to live in Alaska.  It was 80 degrees today.  I am still wearing flip flops and shorts.  I've always wanted to experience snow....The only snow I see is about every 6 years and then it is just a dusting.  All the people make a dash to the grocery store to buy milk and bread.  Then it melts 1 hour later.

Offline Cheesehead

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #18 on: January 15, 2007, 04:52:25 PM »
My daughter turns 16 this year. She has been driving my f150 since she was 13 and loves it. I take her ice fishing with me and she drives all over the lake with me at her side, great fun for both of us. We are looking to buy her some reasonably priced used vehicle with side air bags. This is all based on good behavior and good grades.

Cheese
Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance.

Offline Sourdough

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #19 on: January 15, 2007, 07:43:45 PM »
My wife is looking at the Mazda RX-8, it has side and side curtin airbags, front and rear.  But that is not the car for a teenager, unless she is Danica Patrick's protogae.
Where is old Joe when we really need him?  Alaska Independence    Calling Illegal Immigrants "Undocumented Aliens" is like calling Drug Dealers "Unlicensed Pharmacists"
What Is A Veteran?
A 'Veteran' -- whether active duty, discharged, retired, or reserve -- is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote a blank check made payable to 'The United States of America,' for an amount of 'up to, and including his life.' That is honor, and there are way too many people in this country today who no longer understand that fact.

Offline Bubber

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Re: Car for kid, and related issues?
« Reply #20 on: January 20, 2007, 06:56:57 PM »
Currently I am 24. I grew up on a farm a half hour from the nearest town. I was driving tractors and motorcycles without an adult within a half mile by the time I was 8 and was driving to the nieghbors alone the time I was 12.

I did not get my liscence untill I was 18(senior year), I really had no need for it despite wanting it. I was basicly given the 77 chevy pickup my dad had bought new and had drove for 200,000 miles. It was agreed that it was mine but if I needed a new one I would have to buy it. They covered insurance for the first couple years and even some fuel from the farm pump while I was at home and going to college. But after that I have been expected to toe the mark. It is almost 7 years and a little over 60,000 miles later and I am still driving the same pickup. I have one ticket under my belt which I not only had to pay for but got my ass chewed up and down for.

My parents have no regrets about it, I was pretty responsible and was allowed the privlage of driving. I have no doubt that had I been screwing off much more than I did I would have been left afoot in a heatbeat. Take from this what you will, but if I have children some day I belive I will take a similar route.