Texas BBQ: Correcting a failed brisket?

[Questor]

To the Texas contingent of barbecuers:

I tried cooking a brisket last night using the oven method of coating the meat with a dry rub, baking it uncovered at 350F for an hour, then adding beef stock to the baking pan and cooking it covered for 3 hours until falling apart tender.

I think I must have done something wrong because the result was just stringy meat that, while flavorful, had a dry texture. Up north we call that a pot roast.

Is that what I was supposed to get? What's the right texture?

I wonder if I cooked it too long.

[hardertr]

Did your rub have some type of acid base to it (vinegar, tenderizer..?)
Did you SCORE the meat? (cut a checkerboard pattern all over and all the way through the fat...up to an inch and a half deep in the thicker parts?
Did you take your brisket out of the juice and let it rest for an hour before you cut it??

I've never done a complete brisket in the oven...it's sacreligious.  I have finished them in the oven after I've smoked them in a low-temp smoker for an hour.

350 for the first hour is probably where you went wrong.  Poaching it in stock for 3 hours probably didn't help either.  Did you take your brisket out of the juice and let it rest for an hour or so before you tried to slice it??  Brisket is NOT supposed to be juicy (to the point your grain actually seperates while it cooks.)

When you slice it...slice it fairly thin and ACROSS the grain.  The "worst" brisket I ever had was one I actually made...and my wife sliced it the wrong way.  It did seem like a cross between pot roast and spaghetti 

[gdolby]

It sounds like hardertr has a lot more knowledge than I do, but I think your big problem was the 350. I never cook my briskets over 250 and as long as I dont cook them too long i can cut them anyway I want and they come out good. the only prob I ever had was left it in the oven too long. Take care and better luck on the next one

[williamlayton]

I have friends who say they do brisket in the oven, even swear by it, but I can't see it.
Like you, it sounds like pot roast.
Slow, low heat cooking is the way I like it.
falling off the bone or flaky is not something I favor.
I like to slice it.
170 to 180 degrees for at least 8 hours by smoke---can't do that in an oven I don't think.
This is my opinion.
Blessings

[Questor]

Thanks for the insight. What I'm trying to understand now is whether the meat should be firm or soft. Mine was soft. I did cut it across the grain, as I should have. I prefer beef to not be so tender as to fall apart. I like to have to cut it. Does brisket allow for this kind of cooking or does it require a very long slow cook to keep it from being rubbery?

Do you have a trick for making the brisket cook up a bit firmer without being rubbery?

[rockbilly]

Questor,  First, BBQ is not done in an oven, Second, never score the meat before cooking, and never remove the fat before cooking.

You can do a fair job on a brisket in the oven, Use your rub,, them place it on a roasting rack in a roaster large enough to take the entire piece of meat.  Place it on the rack with the FAT side up, turn the oven to about 350 for an hour or so to brown the meat, then cover loosly with foil or with the lid to the roaster, allowing two inches or so above the brisket, reduce the heat to 175-200 degrees and let her cook for 3-4 hours.  Remove from the oven, remove the lid or foil and let the meat rest for an hour before attempting to slice it.  After resting, remove as much fat as possible without cutting into the meat, slice across the grain and serve with the sauce of your choice.  (When I don't make my own sauce, I use Masterpiece..........it is very good!)

Most briskets will have grain running at more than one angle, you may stary cutting across the grain and later find that you are cutting with the grain.  When you do simply change your cutting angle. 

Good brisket should be tender to the point that a knife is not needed to cut it, but should remain togeather when sliced.  Keep in mind, the best brisket always starts on a grill or smoker.  You can brown one on a smoker or grill to get the smoled flavor, then move it to an oven to finish the cooking at 175-200 degrees for 2-3 hours.   

I did 10 briskets and about a hundred pounds of ribs last week for a club function.  I used the mesquite and the wood from a pear tree that I had removed from my yard.  It turned out great, a good mesquiter flavor, but not too strong.  I kept one large side of ribs for the wife and I, they were delicious, but after three days I was ready for a change.

[Questor]

Rockbilly:

Thanks for the detailed description. I can visualize that. I think I'll take another stab at it doing the following:
1) Since the briskets available to me are about 2" thick or less and have very little fat layer, and only weigh about 2 pounds, I think I'll try different heating:
2) 250F uncovered for an hour.
3) 250F covered for 1hr and take a sample cut and see how I like it. If it seems to need more time, then
4) 250F covered for another hour. Try another sample taste. If it still needs more cooking, then
5) 250F covered for a final hour.

From your description I got it pretty much right for texture. It just seemed too dry. I think overcooking is a factor though, because the recipes I have refer to much bigger pieces of meat.

Any more of this and I'll need to take classes to learn the Texan language.

[hardertr]

2" thick with very little fat     sounds like you are buying the trimmed briskets.  For about $1/pound less, I get the full fat, full size (6-8" thick at the big end and close to 15 pounds) version.

I wouldn't suggest cutting into your meat AT ALL until you're almost ready to take it out.  As soon as you make that first cut, the juice will drain from the entire brisket and your thin side will cook faster than the thicker side.

On a small piece of meat like that, I would go for 4 hours at 250 (wrapped in tinfoil and sitting in an inch of Dr. Pepper or Rootbeer).  When you pull it out of the oven, let it drain/rest on a cookie rack for at least 30 minutes before you slice it.

One of the things that makes a good brisket GREAT (other than smoke) is the fat.  You don't have to eat it, but it sure adds flavor to the meat.

You'll find that anybody that has ever made even ONE brisket that turned out good, automatically considers themself an expert....and no two experts will ever agree on exactly how to make a perfect brisket.

[williamlayton]

I eat the fat and the crust--I am after brisket---not health. 
Rockbilly nailed it.
I digress---I like fat.
Blessings

[rockbilly]

Questor.  One more time.  Quickly brown the meat to sear in the juices, hence, 350 for an hour or so.  REDUCE heat to 175 degreesx or so and SLOW cook for two-three hours depending on the weight of the briskit.  A small cut of meat should be ready in about 1-1 1/2 hours.  Slow cooking is the secret to having a flavorful, tender piece of meat.

[williamlayton]

Cast Iron browning works.
I do not brown with a smoker though.
Some do.
Blessings

[rockbilly]

If you are doing it in the oven, kick the broiler on for a few minutes to lightly brown it.  Brown the non-fat side first, then flip it and brown the fat side slightly, turn the broiler off, reduce the heat and let her cook.  I wouldn't attempt to do it in an iron skillet.  As Wiliamlayton said, you can do it on a smoker, or on a grill and get a good rine on the meat.  Then put it in the oven for a couple of hours and give me a call when you are ready to take it out................

Anothe point that no one made clear.  Never, Never, Never put sauce on a briskey while cooking.  It is OK to use a rub, or a good marinade (Claude's Brisket Marinade is good if you don't want to make your own) before cooking.  Let each individual add the amount of sauce (heat the sauce ) they want to the meat after it is served. 

[ggeilman]

First of all your first error is putting it in the oven and calling it bbq. Call it pot roast, call it what you like, it ain't q! BBQ, by definition is cooked slow over indirect heat between 200-250 degrees on a smoker. Cooked it too long? 1 to 1.5 hours a lb is normal for a brisket. If you really want to que invest $200 in a bandera or WSM. Here is what brisket should look like:

Check out our forum: http://www.bbq-brethren.com/index.php

Greg Geilman
San Antonio, TX