Author Topic: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups  (Read 972 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline ken2222

  • Trade Count: (23)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 666
  • Gender: Male
Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« on: December 28, 2006, 07:39:26 PM »
with XTP 240gr/t7 50gr x 2 pellets/CCI 209...is this a forearm issue? Where should I start with forearm screw torque?  Ken

Offline Busta

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (5)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2586
  • Gender: Male
Re: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« Reply #1 on: December 29, 2006, 04:32:22 AM »
ken,

check your PM, I replied to it before seeing this. probably should just copy and paste it here. if you dont mind, I could do that. might help someone else.
U.S.A.F. Veteran
NRA Life Member

Offline ken2222

  • Trade Count: (23)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 666
  • Gender: Male
Re: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2006, 07:20:40 PM »
Please do...I'm not sure how....I thought it all to be GREAT info!  Thanks again, as you know, I'm following your advice!  Ken

Offline Keith Lewis

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 804
Re: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« Reply #3 on: December 30, 2006, 12:07:30 PM »
Please publish the info. I have a Huntsman which I have not had a lot of time to shoot so I may run into the same problems.

Offline Busta

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (5)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2586
  • Gender: Male
Re: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« Reply #4 on: December 30, 2006, 01:38:27 PM »
OK Guys, this has been my experience with the Huntsman over the last 4 years, your mileage may vary. Hopefully this will help someone else too.

ken,

You might not like what I am going to tell you, but the Huntsman breech plug was not designed for pellets, especially 777 Pellets. 777 pellets are not reliable in my Huntsman, I get slight hangfires and of course accuracy suffers greatly. The breech plug was designed for loose powder, however it will shoot Pyrodex pellet fine due to the real Black Powder that is bonded to one end for ignition. 777 Pellets do not have the Black Powder bonded to them and are harder to get ignited.

Are you getting these slight hanfires or hesitations at ignition?

I am betting if you switched to 777 loose powder or Pyrodex Pellets, your groups would tighten up substantially.

I know this is probably not what you wanted to hear, but until H&R/NEF redesigns the breech plug 777 pellets will not be 100% reliable in the Huntsman/Sidekicks. I know there are other who claim to use 777 pellets, but I cant hit the broadside of the barn with them. With 777 loose powder, my Huntsman shoots as good (actually better) as my Whites, Knights, and T/C.

I shoot everything from 200 grain saboted bullets to 460 grain pure lead conicals in mine. I took that little 5x5 elk in Colorado with 80 grains 777 FFFG, fiber gasket wad and a 430 grain White Super Slug (obsolete). I use 777 FFG for saboted bullets.

Unless your lockup is loose, I really dont think it is the gun. You can put a 3/8" O-Ring over the forend lug to basically float the forend as best as can be expected. Directions for this are in the FAQ's in the NEF/H&R Center Fire Rifle Forum.

Verticle stringing can usually be contributed to inconsistant measuring, and yes, pellets can be inconsistant due to several factors. If you have a powder scale, weigh 10 or 20 of those pellets and record the weights, you will soon see they are not equal. One load could have two pellets on the light side, the next load could have two pellets on the heavy side. 777 pellets are packaged in a box that is not sealed air-tight, this allows the pellets to absorb humidity like a sponge. Breech plug design is another factor.

Before you blame the rifle, I would start with some 777 FFG loose powder. Just remember 777 FFG is 15% more energentic than other loose powders and all pellets. 85 grains of 777 FFG is equal to 100 grains Black Powder, Pyrodex, 777 Pellets, Pyrodex Pellets.

My Huntsman loves the 300 grain SST/Shockwaves (85 grains 777 FFG) better than the 250 grain SST/Shockwaves. So you may also want to try the 300 grain XTP's if you prefer that bullet.

Sorry I wrote a book, but that has been my experience (4 years) with the Huntsman and 777 pellets and powder. I went to the .25 ACP ignition last year, and wont be going back to 209's and plastic primer carriers.
U.S.A.F. Veteran
NRA Life Member

Offline lik2hunt

  • Trade Count: (33)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1629
  • Gender: Male
  • I want to acheive excellence, not perfection.
    • Authentic and Genuine
Re: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« Reply #5 on: January 01, 2007, 03:02:07 AM »
I have gotten GREAT accuracy form my 24" barrelled Huntsman using the 300 grain 45 cal  XTP over 76.2 gr. 777 (equals 90 gr. Pyrodex). The only problem was finding the 50/45 sabot. Seems Traditions is the only company making them that I could find.
lik2hunt------>in OK





“The thing that separates the American Christian from every other person on earth is the fact that he would rather die on his feet, than live on his knees!"
George Washington…. also known as the Father of our Country

><> Galatians 2:20 <><

www.dsheriff.org

Offline usherj

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 218
Re: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« Reply #6 on: January 01, 2007, 04:46:09 AM »
TC makes 50 cal Mag Express Sabots for .451" bullets. They come in packs of 50, part#8281. I use them with XTPs for practice.

Offline lik2hunt

  • Trade Count: (33)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1629
  • Gender: Male
  • I want to acheive excellence, not perfection.
    • Authentic and Genuine
Re: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« Reply #7 on: January 01, 2007, 06:30:03 AM »
Thanks man, I'll "hunt" for them.
lik2hunt------>in OK





“The thing that separates the American Christian from every other person on earth is the fact that he would rather die on his feet, than live on his knees!"
George Washington…. also known as the Father of our Country

><> Galatians 2:20 <><

www.dsheriff.org

Offline MikeC

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 71
Re: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« Reply #8 on: January 01, 2007, 03:05:08 PM »
I have gotten GREAT accuracy form my 24" barrelled Huntsman using the 300 grain 45 cal  XTP over 76.2 gr. 777 (equals 90 gr. Pyrodex). The only problem was finding the 50/45 sabot. Seems Traditions is the only company making them that I could find.

Is this a vol;ume measure or using a powder scale?

Offline lik2hunt

  • Trade Count: (33)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1629
  • Gender: Male
  • I want to acheive excellence, not perfection.
    • Authentic and Genuine
Re: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« Reply #9 on: January 01, 2007, 03:48:43 PM »
I actually used the Lee Dippers for this. They're accurate enough to get the BP right. I use 35mm canisters to carry the loads in after measuring. Loose powder load of course.
lik2hunt------>in OK





“The thing that separates the American Christian from every other person on earth is the fact that he would rather die on his feet, than live on his knees!"
George Washington…. also known as the Father of our Country

><> Galatians 2:20 <><

www.dsheriff.org

Offline MikeC

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 71
Re: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2007, 12:04:02 PM »
Thanks, I will have to get a set. I only have a BP powder measure that goes up in 10 grain increments (used with my flintlock). I haven't done a lot of shooting with my sidekick yet. I ordered some MMP easy-load 50/45 sabots. I haven't gotten them yet. I tried the 300 gr XTP mag 50/45 bullets with 2 t7 pellets. They came with sabots (black) but I couldn't tell what brand they were. I got 3 shots to touch each other at 75 yrds and one about an inch from that cluster. They were very hard to load though. I have a lot of experimenting to do yet.

Offline lik2hunt

  • Trade Count: (33)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1629
  • Gender: Male
  • I want to acheive excellence, not perfection.
    • Authentic and Genuine
Re: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« Reply #11 on: January 02, 2007, 01:39:34 PM »
Quote
They were very hard to load though. I have a lot of experimenting to do yet.

At the range I always carry several patches pre coated in Bore Butter and some dry patches in seperate ziplock baggies.. After every shot, and it gets a little monotinous, I wet patch, flip it over to the unused side, patch again, and follow with the same procedure with the dry patch also. This doesn't thoroughly clean the bore but it removes most residue and coats the bore enouugh for the sabot to load easily every time. In the field if I think I'll need a second shot then I just load without this procedure, but I usually don't figure on a second shot with the Huntsman.  ;)
lik2hunt------>in OK





“The thing that separates the American Christian from every other person on earth is the fact that he would rather die on his feet, than live on his knees!"
George Washington…. also known as the Father of our Country

><> Galatians 2:20 <><

www.dsheriff.org

Swampman

  • Guest
Re: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2007, 01:39:58 AM »
I really like regular old 3F GOEX.

Offline ken2222

  • Trade Count: (23)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 666
  • Gender: Male
Re: Huntsman 50 shoots verticle groups
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2007, 04:14:09 PM »
Well Guys...I'm hoping the weather holds this weekend. Sunday I'm taking the Huntsman AND my .204 Handi to the range. The light recoil of the .204 should make shooting all day enjoyable...it's gonna be a costly day! I'm taking lots of loose t7 and the Winchester t7 primers, don't have the 25 acp plug yet. I have plenty of stuff to try. I'll keep you posted....and please, carry on.... Ken