381" LFN rifle mould

[admiral]

Veral, i have several of your moulds and use your lubes and hardness tester all the time. the last mould i ordered from you was a .375-240-LFN in .381" for my 38-55 Win. 94. I foolishly did not state that these bullets need to chamber in a lever gun. well as you can imagine the throat dosen't like your standard profile and won't chamber them so for the last year i have been sizing down the noses to .370" in increments with some homemade sizing dies in my Lyman 450. needless to say it is a pain in the neck and alot of extra work. I was wondering if after ordering a new mould in the lever gun nose profile you could do something with the current mould? I was thinking is it possible to open the cavities up to .413" for my .405WCF 1895 or .425" for my .404 Jeffery? i would hate to waste this mould by just letting it sit around. Thanks, Patrick.

[swampthing]

Not Veral,
              I was up against that same wall with my .444marlin. It's an easy fix. Seat the bullet deeper and crimp tightly with a Lee Factory Crimp Die.
                              What I did was, adjust the bullet seating depth until you can feel the last quarter of an inch of lever travel give resistance upon chambering a roud. Then crimp with a Lee Factory Crimp Die until you see the case mouth imbeded into the bullets ogive. The bullet is seated to touch the lands and should show "land" marks when you get it right. The idea is not to cram the bullet into the lands but to have them kiss enough so that there is a visible, but minor, indentation. Of course you will have to lower powder charges, due to the deeper seated bullet. Same rules apply start low and work up, Once you get it right the accuracy will be excellent. My .444 shoots very tight groups and its not even firelapped, yet.

[Veral]

  Seating gas checks below the ctg neck works great if pressures aren't too high, but as you work up to maximum pressure, when pressures reaches the point where the bullet base upsets, accuracy goes out the window.  If you have adaquate powder capacity, shot buffer over the powder, enough to get firm compression, solves the problem and allows extreme pressure without losing accuracy or getting leading.

  But I also recut molds, for half the normal price.  As a rule, the new cavities need to be about .030 larger to get a cleanup.  Or, if bullet weight isn't a critical factor, I can open the mold to an identical shape, but larger, and can usually step up just one caliber with this trick.

When ordering a mold or any rifle I strongly recommend the customer send a throat slug so I can custom cut the mold so it fits.  This keeps us both happy, and costs customers less $$$$ and frustration.  I don't charge extra for this service.

[admiral]

Thanks Veral. Mould is on the way along with an order for another mould.

[Veral]

  Your mold and order for a new one and to have it bored out, arrived a short time ago, which is when I realized that you were trying to crimp in a grease groove!

  I make almost all levergun bullets without crimp groove, with the intentions that the customer seat them to touch the rifling then crimp lightly with a Lee Factory crimp die.  As the throat wears, this allows seating out to optimum accuracy as needed.

  I didn't contact you about it yet, but will make sure I get through to you befor ruining your perfect mold  by boring it to a large size.! 

  To all my customers.  Reports like this of customers fighting to get results with my molds really hurts me.  Please don't fignt my bullets trying to get performance.  If you have a problem, contact me and I'll walk you through it quickly.   When I reload it has to be easy the reloads superior to any factory load, and I expect every one of my customers to have the same.

[admiral]

Veral, so this whole time it was operator error? i feel like an idiot. I didn't realize there was no crimp groove which is why i sized the sides of the bullet nose protruded from the case to .370".  i will try what you suggested and load some ammo for a test tomorrow morning when i go shooting. i have your book and was rereading it about bullet fitting. you must realize that to me the idea of hammering a lead slug against a case filled with WW alloy with a steel rod down the barrel in my pristine 1894 38/55 is a horrific thought. I worked up the courage to do it this afternoon after veiwing your post. I cast a pure lead slug from my 348WCF mould that is .350" and dropped it down the barrel after chambering the WW filled brass case. I used a .368" polished steel cylinder about 1.5" long on top of the bullet with an alluminum rod 5/16" diameter that i hit with the hand sledge. it was nerve racking. But after doing this it revealed what i have been fighting. the groove diameter of this rifle is .380". the chamber is undersized for the bullet and offers resistance when closing the lever. It is the brass case that is fitting tightly in the front of the chamber. Veral your are right that it is not the bullet as i thought but the chamber. I apologize and do not want to hurt you or your reputation. i was way off base in my idea of what was going on. I now see and as i was getting good accuracy before i only expect it to improve without my excessive sizing of the noses. So don't recut the mould. i will send you the price difference and have you make a 30-LCFN instead. Thanks, Patrick

[Veral]

  Great Frank.  Don't feel too chagrined.  This is part of doing business with a technology freek!  And please understand that I feel bad enough for both of us!

  Your comments about fear of swaging a throat slug are priecless, because you aren't alone, so a lot of readers will benifit from your well defined leter.

  Since your chamber is too tight, to allow a groove diameter bullet, the best option is to neck turn your brass.  RCBS has an econimical neck turning tool.  Cut just enough to make the neck walls uniform in thickness and you'll be twice happy, because with uniform neck walls your bullets will be far better centered on takeoff.  You'll be well rewarded with the improved accuracy.

  Email me with the diameter you want for that 30 LCFN and I'll make it along with the other mold you ordered, and return all promply, as I should be able to cut them in the next couple days.  I'll trust you that the check for the  balance is on it's way.

  The 30 LCFN will be the same way, no crimp groove.  Purchase a Lee factory crimp die for it also, or perhaps wait to see if recoil sets the bullets deeper in the case in your gun.  I have never had to crimp 30-30 ammo, even with very stout loads, like 2450 fps with 170 gr bullets.
 My email address is:         LBTisAccuracy@Imbris.net