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Offline bearfat

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valve clearance check
« on: January 21, 2007, 03:20:03 AM »
My Polaris MV7 is getting close to the 100 hour valve check.

I had a Honda Foreman they insisted get brought back in after a couple tanks of gas for a valve check. Well it was many tanks of gas later when I got it in and I noted the mechanic scribled on the work order, "Valves very loose." I asked the service mechanic in charge if I had done any damage and he responded, "Well it's better to run them loose than tight."

My Polaris 6x6 (400 hours) never had the valves checked and when I brought it up to a different dealer/service mechanic he didn't seem to think it was a big deal and when I pressed him on possible damage he simply responded, "Well it wouldn't hurt to check them."

When I did trade the 6x6 in (shortly thereafter) the lead mechanic at a 3rd dealer test drove it and said, "It's run pretty good. We usually don't get them in this good of condition."   

Do different manf. make a difference regarding valve clearance? What have the rest of you seen on various models? What damage can occur with loose valve clearance?

I did snoop around on the web and the only thing I'm really seeing is harder starting, longer warm up time needed.

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Offline 30-30man

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Re: valve clearance check
« Reply #1 on: January 21, 2007, 05:04:36 AM »
I'm convinced that the valve clearance thing is just a ploy by many manufactures to get customers into the dealership. I have never heard of any atv with valve clearance problems even after hundreds of hours.  I've have a 1982 Honda ATC110 three wheeler with thousands of hours on it and it never had the valves checked.  The dealership in my area wants over $300 just to do it.  I say buy a manual and do it yourself if you can.  I own a 2006 Bruin that I haven't touched yet.  When it gets hard to start, I may try adjusting the valves.  Either way I try not to visit the dealership after the sale unless I have to.  They are notorious rip-off artists when it comes to work performed.
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Offline bearfat

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Re: valve clearance check
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2007, 06:44:50 AM »
I guess that's where I'm at too with ATV's although I have definitely noticed valve problems on motorcycles effecting performance.

I rarely open my ATV up for more than 15 seconds anyway nor push it wide open for as long and hard as I have done on motorcycles.

Now the ATV quad runners might set us straight and I'm hoping they respond...
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Offline Old Syko

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Re: valve clearance check
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2007, 02:57:24 PM »
Valve adjustment is not as critical as most dealers and manufacturers would like us to believe.  I check mine about every 500 hrs. or so and only once have I found a tight valve.  BTW, valve lash getting too tight can cause burnt valve faces or burnt seats but with today's technology and metallurgy even that is unlikely.  Too tight or loose will both cause a loss in performance but unless they are way off most will never notice.  Even with all that said, I still believe in checking ocasionally just for the fact that when I want the thing to go it had better go!
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Offline Paladin

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Re: valve clearance check
« Reply #4 on: January 23, 2007, 04:06:30 PM »
if it ain't broke, don't fix it
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Offline RonO777

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Re: valve clearance check
« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2007, 02:46:02 PM »
I normally dont reply to threads like this and against my better judgement Im going to.
Ive done five tuneups this week. Out of the five ONE didnt need the valves adjusted. It was an older trx400. Two were first services and two were yearly services they were all 4wheelers. The 5th was a streetbike with 16000 miles it needed one valve adjusted. I hear this kind of crap all the time Ive got a 80 something trx whatever and have never had the valves adjusted, heck I only change the oil every five years. The maintenance schedule is there for a reason. If you dont want to take it to get it done get a service manual and do it yourself. But it what it comes down to its your money and your atv if you dont want to take care of it dont. And while your at it why bother cleaning you gun to heck Ive fired 10,000 rounds and have never cleaned the barrel.
And just so you know Ive been working on motorcycles for a living since the early 90's

Ron
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Offline 30-30man

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Re: valve clearance check
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2007, 01:55:49 AM »
I don't think we ever said it didn't have to be done.  We just said that the manufacturers have a schedule that make money for the dealers and are excessive.  It is the same thing at the Jiffy Lube places, they want you to change your oil every 3000 miles.  The truth is most dino oil will go over 10,000 miles before it breaks down.  I'm all for anyone making a living but the prices at some of these dealers are ridiculous for having any service done.   ::)
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Offline bearfat

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Re: valve clearance check
« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2007, 05:21:09 AM »
Ron0777 I was hoping for professional information like yours.

Wish you would post more often over here although I understand you work with it all day and it's the last thing you want to do.

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Offline RonO777

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Re: valve clearance check
« Reply #8 on: January 25, 2007, 02:35:50 PM »
Ill be happy to answer your questions the best I can.
30-30man here is a good read on oils. http://motorcycleinfo.calsci.com/Oils1.html
There is also a link on that page on oil filters.
Some of the valves and seats on the newer motors are very sensitive to dirt. Just a little will start the valve to wear. Then you just cant put a new valve in you have the recut the seat because the dirt will be in the seat also. This is mainly from the airfilters not being cleaned right or more to the point not being reoiled either with the right oil or not enough.
What Ive seen over the years is the motors that just get putted around need the valves adjusted more than a motor that has been ran hard. My motorcycle has 60k on it and Ive never had to adjust a valve. But I still check it once a year somewhere between 16k & 18k. I run it very hard. I had a customer with the same bike at 16k had to have 3 valves adjusted he putts.
But normaly the one who putts doesnt stay on top of the maintenance ie air filter and oil.

Ron

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Offline bearfat

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Re: valve clearance check
« Reply #9 on: January 25, 2007, 03:57:46 PM »
Ron0777 thanks for the information and link.

30-30man it's going to take me days to get through all that technical information...unbelievable how well you wrote that. Writing is a skill few have and you have it.
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Offline markc

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Re: valve clearance check
« Reply #10 on: February 01, 2007, 02:59:15 AM »
Ron, thanks for posting.  Let me ask you about frequency of oil changes for ATV's.  How often?  I supposse the answer has something to do with the amount of use, but is there a recommended frequency for quads and such that do not have an hour meter?   How do you know when it is a must?   Thanks..
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Offline Sourdough

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Re: valve clearance check
« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2007, 09:13:02 AM »
Had a new Honda in 1988 that had come from the factory with the valves too tight.  I was told to bring it back after 500 miles for a checkup.  I took it back at 200 miles because it just did not seem right.  I'm hard of hearing I could not hear anything amiss but the wife said it did not sound right to her.  They found the problem, valves were too tight.  Luckily no damage done. Last time it was in the shop.  Still runs like a top.  Just all the plastic is busted, the shocks are shot, the CV joints pop and snap, no brakes, squels like mad for the first mile or so most mornings, muffler has a hole in it and it is noisy.  But still gets me from point A to point B.
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Offline Drilling Man

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Re: valve clearance check
« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2007, 09:25:41 AM »
Quote
I'm convinced that the valve clearance thing is just a ploy by many manufactures to get customers into the dealership

  Maybe, but if your the unlucky owner that happens to have one go tight durning break in, your also going to be the one with a burnt valve to pay for...  (assumeing you don't ajust them)

  My Yamaha dealer says they need to be checked/ajusted after breakin, and then they pretty much stay put...  It's the first time around that's important and he doesn't care if "I" ajust them or he does...

  DM
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