41 mag or 44 special loaded to potential for deer and hogs?

[6.5BR]

Considering either in an FA 97 4.25 or 5.5, if anyone has any leads on a good used one.

I do load my own, wondering what pros/cons of each.  Ammo not an issue......since I load.  Thanks.

Btw, owned 44mags-sold all, have a couple of 657 S&W's now.  Have a lead on a 24-3 in 44 with 6.5", might prefer shorter barrel for carry though......not sure how much you can push a 44 special in the model 24?  Looking for 1100-1200 240/250s with 44 special.

Thanks for all feedback.

[ccoker]

I dig my 657
it shoots easier to me than 44s and is highly effective on deer
soon will take a hog with it

[6.5BR]

I would have thought the 44 special is very similar with top loads as a 41 magnum in recoil, and similar in killing power, though there may be some advantage in the larger caliber of the 44. 

Certainly went to the 41 long ago as top loads in 44 magnum are too much for my needs, and my recoil tolerance.  A handy 44 special seems like it would have good field effectiveness with top loads.

Anyone who hunts with 44 special, or mid range magnum loads using 240/250 at 1100-1200fps?

[Lloyd Smale]

either one will kill deer. Me i prefer a 44 special but for no other reason then that thats what i like

[6.5BR]

Hi Loyd, like to hear more about your experience in the field, load/bullets used, and gun used.

[Lloyd Smale]

two pigs with the 44 special. Well one with my old model 357 conversion and the other with my 629 using speicail level loads. One was a 421429 at about 1000 and the other was an rcbs 250kt at 1000 both gave complete penetration through both shoulders of pigs about 200 lb at about 30 yards. Ive shot a few deer with the same level of loads and allways have gotten complete penetration broadside with them too. Animals typically run about 10-50 yards and pile up and ive allways had a blood trail a blind man could follow. A 250 at 1000 fps out of a 44 or 45 will do alot more killing that people give it credit for. I was all set last year to shoot a 1000lb bison with my 44 special old model. I was confident enough in a 250 at 1150 to use it on the buffalo. At the last minute my buddy came up with a 500 linebaugh the Hank Williams Jr. had owned and we thought it would be cool to shoot it with that so the 44 stayed in the holster and the .500 did the deed but i have no doubt whatsoever that the 44 specail was up to that task. At that speed a 250 lead swc cast correctly will do a hell of alot of penetrating.

[6.5BR]

Too bad you did not use the 44 special on the Bison, would have been 'classic' and done the job.  I know a 240 .429 does a lot at 1050, and read where one person's idea re: handgun penetration/power, once the bullet has penetrated, what more can you do?  SO, given that a bullet from 900-1000 will clear a deer, does having 200 or even more fps in a handgun assuming cast bullets used do any more damage or killing?  I tend to think it is likely the wound channel is very similar in diameter, so if so, then penetrating them at 1000 mv or 1200, or even 1400 seems irrelevant.

Seems suffice to say (using .40+ and 200+ grain), 1000 fps is fine for closer shots, and leave nothing to be desired in killing.

Thoughts from anyone? 

[safetysheriff]

i see it as the .41 mag' being better than the .44 special for a few reasons:  the accuracy is probably better at longer ranges since it shoots flatter; and the .41 mag' handles heavy bullets very well (see   www.leverguns.com and look at the articles section with Paco's article about heavy loads in the .41 mag'.    very interesting).   the weight of the .41 mag' built on a .44 mag' frame helps with recoil and the extra metal around the bolt cuts makes for a greater margin of safety over the .44 mag'. (such as in a BlackHawk by Ruger and perhaps one or more of the Smith's) 

i readily learned to handle the .44 mag' using 265 gr' RNFP's by National Bullet with 21 gr's of WC-820 with Win' primers in Rem' brass.   it's a fairly strong load using that surplus/bulk powder i get from Pat's Reloading.   but with practice it has been very manageable and accurate.   i'd expect the .41 mag' to not be as powerful, but to certainly be as accurate and as deadly on whitetails and most hogs.    the .44 Special just doesn't have as much velocity as i'd like.   

to each his own i guess.

take care,

ss'   

[6.5BR]

Thanks for the insight, I am wanting a little handier gun-hence shorter barrel that is going to limit max velocity in 41, and some also in 44 special if I went that route, and have the Paco's article saved on my favorites, thanks, and also see your point on velocity, I guess for trajectory.  I am wondering how much more speed some are getting with 41's, I was guessing about 1250 or so might be expected in say a 4.25 or 5.5 FA97 or Taurus or Smith 4".......not planning for shots much more than 50 yds with open sights, 60-70 would be a stretch under ideal conditions.  Thanks.

[redhawk500]

Considering either in an FA 97 4.25 or 5.5, if anyone has any leads on a good used one.

I do load my own, wondering what pros/cons of each.  Ammo not an issue......since I load.  Thanks.

Btw, owned 44mags-sold all, have a couple of 657 S&W's now.  Have a lead on a 24-3 in 44 with 6.5", might prefer shorter barrel for carry though......not sure how much you can push a 44 special in the model 24?  Looking for 1100-1200 240/250s with 44 special.

Thanks for all feedback.

My two large hogs were taken with factory .44 Magnum Winchester 240 grain JHP and S&W 25-5 .45 Colt hand loaded with 18.5 grains of 2400, 255 grain cast SWC for 1040 fps.  I liked penetration of cast bullets but think heart-lung shots with either would work.  As to deer, I've never shot a whitetail with a .44 Special, but have shot a water buffalo cow with 240 grain cast SWC at 1008 fps.  Two shots, one dead, 650 pound (estimated), cow.  Over 300 pounds of tasty meat from the butcher!  My shooting buddy used a 240 grain SWC @ 1000 fps to kill a whitetail doe this season, short run and one dead deer the result.  For dedicated deer hunting I'd use fast JHP, 180 grain Sierra @ 1300 fps from my 6 ½" S&W 624, using 20.0 grains of 2400.  Fact is, the standard 1000 fps 240 grain cast SWC .429 bullet kills very well on nearly anything, from deer to buffalo and a lot in between.  I like 8 grains of Unique. 13 grains of Blue Dot and finally 17 grains of 2400 with a good 240 grain SWC, plain base, .44 Special bullet.  I just bought a used .41 Magnum Model 57 S&W 6".  It is rough with a few nicks but after some buffing, smoothing that target trigger face, narrowing it, and finally a new front sight, and re-bluing,  it should be ready for black bear hunting up in Maine.  My nickle plated 57 took my first deer at 40 yards.  Winchester 170 grain Silvertip in .41 magnum dropped my deer like a lighting bolt, just four feet in the air.  Get both as you can afford and enjoy.  I like 215 grain cast SWC with 10 grains of Unique for 1270 fps in my six inch S&W 57.  Fifty rounds offhand in black of standard slow-fire pistol target on good day.  Bad day equals all within 8 inches.  I like 200 grain Speer HP with 19.0 grains 2400 for 1408 fps as deer handload.

[Lloyd Smale]

Where did you shoot the water buffalo do you have a web sight link. My buddy and i are thinking of wacking one for meat in the near future. Something a little difffernt then bison with a handgun anyway. Old Elmer would be proud of you taking one with the 44 special!!!

Considering either in an FA 97 4.25 or 5.5, if anyone has any leads on a good used one.

I do load my own, wondering what pros/cons of each.  Ammo not an issue......since I load.  Thanks.

Btw, owned 44mags-sold all, have a couple of 657 S&W's now.  Have a lead on a 24-3 in 44 with 6.5", might prefer shorter barrel for carry though......not sure how much you can push a 44 special in the model 24?  Looking for 1100-1200 240/250s with 44 special.

Thanks for all feedback.

My two large hogs were taken with factory .44 Magnum Winchester 240 grain JHP and S&W 25-5 .45 Colt hand loaded with 18.5 grains of 2400, 255 grain cast SWC for 1040 fps.  I liked penetration of cast bullets but think heart-lung shots with either would work.  As to deer, I've never shot a whitetail with a .44 Special, but have shot a water buffalo cow with 240 grain cast SWC at 1008 fps.  Two shots, one dead, 650 pound (estimated), cow.  Over 300 pounds of tasty meat from the butcher!  My shooting buddy used a 240 grain SWC @ 1000 fps to kill a whitetail doe this season, short run and one dead deer the result.  For dedicated deer hunting I'd use fast JHP, 180 grain Sierra @ 1300 fps from my 6 ½" S&W 624, using 20.0 grains of 2400.  Fact is, the standard 1000 fps 240 grain cast SWC .429 bullet kills very well on nearly anything, from deer to buffalo and a lot in between.  I like 8 grains of Unique. 13 grains of Blue Dot and finally 17 grains of 2400 with a good 240 grain SWC, plain base, .44 Special bullet.  I just bought a used .41 Magnum Model 57 S&W 6".  It is rough with a few nicks but after some buffing, smoothing that target trigger face, narrowing it, and finally a new front sight, and re-bluing,  it should be ready for black bear hunting up in Maine.  My nickle plated 57 took my first deer at 40 yards.  Winchester 170 grain Silvertip in .41 magnum dropped my deer like a lighting bolt, just four feet in the air.  Get both as you can afford and enjoy.  I like 215 grain cast SWC with 10 grains of Unique for 1270 fps in my six inch S&W 57.  Fifty rounds offhand in black of standard slow-fire pistol target on good day.  Bad day equals all within 8 inches.  I like 200 grain Speer HP with 19.0 grains 2400 for 1408 fps as deer handload.

[Lloyd Smale]

We do alot of long range shooting and once you get velocity up to about 1100 fps it doesnt make much differnce to go any faster. Sure it might shoot flatter but out past 100 yards your still going to have to use sight to compensate and still have to figure out how much. Personaly Id take a 429 250 over a 410 250 even if the 44 was 200 fps slower. A 44 special in a good strong gun will push 250s to 11-1200 fps and with a hard cast bullet that will do alot of killing. About the only advantage i see in a 41 with its velocity edge is if you want to use jacketed bullets but that aint happening here. Bottom line is were spliting hairs here and both will do the job in the hands of someone that can use them. Long range handgunning is not a matter of which caliber you shoot its a matter of the caliber of the shooter.

i see it as the .41 mag' being better than the .44 special for a few reasons:  the accuracy is probably better at longer ranges since it shoots flatter; and the .41 mag' handles heavy bullets very well (see   www.leverguns.com and look at the articles section with Paco's article about heavy loads in the .41 mag'.    very interesting).   the weight of the .41 mag' built on a .44 mag' frame helps with recoil and the extra metal around the bolt cuts makes for a greater margin of safety over the .44 mag'. (such as in a BlackHawk by Ruger and perhaps one or more of the Smith's) 

i readily learned to handle the .44 mag' using 265 gr' RNFP's by National Bullet with 21 gr's of WC-820 with Win' primers in Rem' brass.   it's a fairly strong load using that surplus/bulk powder i get from Pat's Reloading.   but with practice it has been very manageable and accurate.   i'd expect the .41 mag' to not be as powerful, but to certainly be as accurate and as deadly on whitetails and most hogs.    the .44 Special just doesn't have as much velocity as i'd like.   

to each his own i guess.

take care,

ss'   

[6.5BR]

BTW, I want to clarify, I have a lead on a 24-3 smith, but I would not expect to shoot heavy 44 specials in it, not like I would in a strong single action.  Thanks to all for the experience shared.  Great info.

[Lloyd Smale]

the 24s will safely take loads like kieths 1200 fps 250s all day long.

[redhawk500]

Where did you shoot the water buffalo do you have a web sight link. My buddy and i are thinking of wacking one for meat in the near future. Something a little difffernt then bison with a handgun anyway. Old Elmer would be proud of you taking one with the 44 special!!!

Considering either in an FA 97 4.25 or 5.5, if anyone has any leads on a good used one.

I do load my own, wondering what pros/cons of each.  Ammo not an issue......since I load.  Thanks.

Btw, owned 44mags-sold all, have a couple of 657 S&W's now.  Have a lead on a 24-3 in 44 with 6.5", might prefer shorter barrel for carry though......not sure how much you can push a 44 special in the model 24?  Looking for 1100-1200 240/250s with 44 special.

Thanks for all feedback.

My two large hogs were taken with factory .44 Magnum Winchester 240 grain JHP and S&W 25-5 .45 Colt hand loaded with 18.5 grains of 2400, 255 grain cast SWC for 1040 fps.  I liked penetration of cast bullets but think heart-lung shots with either would work.  As to deer, I've never shot a whitetail with a .44 Special, but have shot a water buffalo cow with 240 grain cast SWC at 1008 fps.  Two shots, one dead, 650 pound (estimated), cow.  Over 300 pounds of tasty meat from the butcher!  My shooting buddy used a 240 grain SWC @ 1000 fps to kill a whitetail doe this season, short run and one dead deer the result.  For dedicated deer hunting I'd use fast JHP, 180 grain Sierra @ 1300 fps from my 6 ½" S&W 624, using 20.0 grains of 2400.  Fact is, the standard 1000 fps 240 grain cast SWC .429 bullet kills very well on nearly anything, from deer to buffalo and a lot in between.  I like 8 grains of Unique. 13 grains of Blue Dot and finally 17 grains of 2400 with a good 240 grain SWC, plain base, .44 Special bullet.  I just bought a used .41 Magnum Model 57 S&W 6".  It is rough with a few nicks but after some buffing, smoothing that target trigger face, narrowing it, and finally a new front sight, and re-bluing,  it should be ready for black bear hunting up in Maine.  My nickle plated 57 took my first deer at 40 yards.  Winchester 170 grain Silvertip in .41 magnum dropped my deer like a lighting bolt, just four feet in the air.  Get both as you can afford and enjoy.  I like 215 grain cast SWC with 10 grains of Unique for 1270 fps in my six inch S&W 57.  Fifty rounds offhand in black of standard slow-fire pistol target on good day.  Bad day equals all within 8 inches.  I like 200 grain Speer HP with 19.0 grains 2400 for 1408 fps as deer handload.
Lloyd,
Glad to hear someone as dedicated to ironsighted revolvers for hunting as I am!  I hunted with North Texas Outfitters, just west of Dallas.  Their web page is: http://www.huntinfo.com/nto/
Paul Cantrell - 940-567-2302
P.O. Box 687
Chico, TX 76431
Ranch ph. # - 940-567-6959
I can't say too many good things about them.  Brian, my guide is a handgun competitor and I didn't get the glassy eyed stare treatment when I told him I would be shooting within fifty yards with iron sights.  They have a practice range available to sight in your firearms, bows, shotguns or whatever.  They field dressed and quartered the cow, sold me ice to transport it and even recovered the bullet from the off shoulder for a souvenir.  On the drive back to Tennessee I drained my marine coolers and replaced the ice as I went.  My cow was ready for the butcher when I got home.  My wife prefers this meat to all other wild game, and we eat lots of elk and deer at our house.  It is slightly marbled and doesn't require the care to keep moist that lower fat venison requires.
One thing about my earlier post about the .44 Special and .41 Magnum, the pressures vary with the primer used.  I used CCI 300 primers for the data.  If you use Wincherster Large Pistol Primers, the .41 Magnum max load is reduced to 17.8 grains of 2400.  Stepping up to CCI 350 magnum primers requires reducing the max load to 16.8 grains of 2400.  Lyman used Remington 2 1/2 primers to develop their .44 Special data: Unique (8.0 grains max) and 2400 loads (17.7 grains max).  I use WLP primers and reduce my maximum .44 Special load to 17.0 grains.  The Blue Dot data is my responsibility and is a SWAG.  I estimated Blue Dot as slightly cooler than Unique and capable of working up to 1000 fps with CCI 300 primers.     

[ccoker]

one thing I like about the 41 mag is that commercially available ammo is readily available (although a tad pricey) that works well

both the Federal 250g cast core and Winchster 240g platinum tip make one ragged hole at 25 yards with my off the shelf 657 with a 7.5" barrel.  That's putting the front of the barrel on a rest and wrists on the bench with out trying to damned hard..
both open sights and a red dot.. with the latter it's quicker of course..

both loads claim about 1250 FPS and easy to shoot..

[Lloyd Smale]

redhawk what was the weight of that water buffalo and what was the throphy fee if you dont mind me asking.

[redhawk500]

The Buffalo weighed about 750 pounds, judging by the horses that have stepped on my toes.  My wife goes to endurance rides and the horses are weighed as part of the activity, so I have a little actual data to work from.  Over 300 pounds of wrapped meat from the butcher.  I went hunting on the cheap, $750 for a cow hunt was pretty reasonable to my mind.  They charged a reasonable amount for a lodging per night and ice, otherwise the hunt was an all inclusive deal.

redhawk what was the weight of that water buffalo and what was the throphy fee if you dont mind me asking.