Author Topic: 45 ACP Self-defense ammo (Read 2396 times)

Dusty Miller · « **on:** February 22, 2007, 03:14:54 PM »

Is the Corbon ammo considered just about the best for self-defense shooting? I want something that'll work in my Series 80 Colt Commander, Kimber CDP II (4"), and my 3" Para C6.45 Carry.

Heavy C · « **Reply #1 on:** February 22, 2007, 03:28:42 PM »

I don't know if it's "the" best, but is considered one of the best. It's what I carry. It cycles reliably in my Kimber Ultra Carry and at the moment that's all I have to go on.

RangeMasterTX · « **Reply #2 on:** February 22, 2007, 06:30:34 PM »

our department mandates federal hydrashocks which function flawlessly in both my kimber and colt fullsize and my series 80 commander and my wifes ultra carry but back when I had a choice I carried aguila's IQ their 45 is 117 grain bullet at a supposed 1400 fps ( I was clocking them at an average of 1460 out of my amt backup) I tested this ammo on a section of interior wall in an old house out in the sticks I was tearing down cardboard six feet from the exit holes showed only minor fragment penetration cardboard six feet beyond that showed ZERO penetration it immpressed me and it looked scary in the ballistic gellatin. just my opinion but if u can afford to practice with it it will do the job its some type of MIM aluminum alloy its accurate and worked in every gun I owned

Castaway · « **Reply #3 on:** February 24, 2007, 03:11:40 AM »

185 grain HydraShocks. If you believe Marshal and Sanow it's tops.

superjay01 · « **Reply #4 on:** February 25, 2007, 04:32:25 AM »

I have to give another vote for the federal hydroshocks that's what in all my self-defense pistols, I have never had a feeding/jamming problem in any of the guns that I own.

Mikey · « **Reply #5 on:** February 26, 2007, 01:07:41 AM »

Dusty - Corbon hasn't won any accolades by law enforcement for their ammo as of yet that I am aware of. I do not recall reading of any department(s) that have gone to using it for their line officers. I think many departments prefer the Federal loads instead and I believe they are 230 grainers.

Let's try and remember that the 45 was developed for a reason - to put a big, fat heavy slug through someone at 50 yds. It was meant to be the pistol version of the 45 Colt, which was supposed to 'de-horse' a man at that distance. At the other extreme is the Aquila ammo the Rangemaster spoke to but you have to wonder if the frangibility of those loads would allow for the type of penetration you need to stop an aggressive attack. Sorry, but I want to see both an entrance and exit wound when I shoot. You simply cannot count on a 'shock' or 'hydrostatic shock' principle to work on an agitated, hyped or drugged up individual, you need to put one through bone and muscle to bring him/it down.

I have stuck with plain jane ball ammo for years for that reason and the last time I tried, it worked. Of course, that was under full field conditions with the other guys looking for blood and heavily armed in the process and in the middle of close combat. I don't know if it would still work that well (lolololol) on the street, so to improve things a bit and to continue with the use of non-expanding full metal jacket bullets (in the interest of human consideration) I have gone to the use of the Mag-Tech 230 gn fmj-swc over mil-spec charges; they cut an incredibly square hole in the target, penetrate on through pressue treated 4x4s, group like a wonder and are easy to shoot. HTH. Mikey.

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #6 on:** February 26, 2007, 04:44:25 PM »

Well DOGGONE it I went out and bought some Corbon 185's today. Trouble is I'd never be able to afford to buy enough to do a thorough test on all my 45 ACP guns. Shoot, maybe I'll just sell off the semi-autos and stick with 357 revolvers for self-defense work.

Paul S · « **Reply #7 on:** February 26, 2007, 05:42:49 PM »

I also use the Federal with good luck. Another one my Kimber seems to loves is Hornady +P loads. They function great and they will leave a mark.
Paul

Mannlicher · « **Reply #8 on:** March 01, 2007, 01:23:56 PM »

I have had best reliability in my Commander with Federal 230 grian HydraShock. I do admit to carrying ball in my Springfield 1911 A1. Shoots accurately, performs well, is totally reliable.

ccoker · « **Reply #9 on:** March 04, 2007, 04:25:46 AM »

federal 230g +p HST
www.le.atk.com/pdf/Pierce%20County%20Workshop.pdf

RangeMasterTX · « **Reply #10 on:** March 11, 2007, 09:08:46 PM »

Just a bit of advice, regardless of circumstances if you are ever forced to use your side arm for its intended purpose then you must be prepared for the aftermath. some slick prosecutor asking why YOU CHOSE such a destructive ammunition to put the poor helpless crackhead down? it might be a good idea to have an answer for that such as "sir I chose x ammo after speaking to our local police dept sheriffs dept etc. and its what they use to protect our city/county" that is if what they use works in your weapon perfectly and it probably will but avoid handloads the soccer moms in the jury more then likely will have no clue what 9.5 grains of bluedot under a 185 xtp means other than thinking you must have made it as damaging as possible that is if they allow you to bring in your load data which they probably won't. I personally would rather be judged by twelve than carried by six any day. but I also believe in planning ahead. JMHO

myronman3 · « **Reply #11 on:** March 19, 2007, 08:55:54 AM »

Quote

"sir I chose x ammo after speaking to our local police dept sheriffs dept etc. and its what they use to protect our city/county"

how about "sir, i figure if you are going to do something, it should be done right." show me where this has ever been an issue. i think some ammo company started that one in order to sell some bullets. i will also take my handloads over factory ammo for reliabity.

K.K · « **Reply #12 on:** March 19, 2007, 02:31:57 PM »

All great points, guys. My two cents is that the defensive ammo world is very competitive, and we have never had it so good in terms of quality ammo. The price of premium defense ammo is a pittance comapred to value if and when you had to use it. For what it's worth, find a good self-defense load and bullet from a reputable company (Federal, Speer, Cor-Bon, Winchester, etc) and make sure that it functions every time. sight in, and practice with generic or reloads, a lot!

Flint · « **Reply #13 on:** March 19, 2007, 04:42:57 PM »

A comment from my CCW instructor was to carry the ammo who's box states (for) "Personal Defense". The point being there is no cause for a lawyer to claim the bullet was chosen for offensive purposes. In ballistic gelatin testing he also found Winchester to expand a little better than the Federal, but they're both good, and devastating.

Winchester Silver Tips come in a box labeled as a personal defense cartridge. I looked at my Federal Hydra-shock boxes to see if that is printed, and it's not.

WST feeds OK in my Combat Commander, but FHS sound smoother chambering. I haven't finished testing them completely yet to see which I want to carry in the long run. Presently, the magazines are loaded with WST.

myronman3 · « **Reply #14 on:** March 20, 2007, 02:58:35 AM »

i think i will get the ammo that says "kills thugs DEAD!!!" or maybe "thieves check in, they dont check out!"
seriously, some people watch too much t.v..

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #15 on:** March 20, 2007, 05:02:27 AM »

Yeah, like the jurors who'll be deciding whether you shot the guy legitimately or just went on a trigger happy shooting binge!

myronman3 · « **Reply #16 on:** March 20, 2007, 07:21:03 AM »

if it comes to that, i am sure the facts will speak for themselves. if it comes down to whether or not i used ammo labeled "defensive", then chances are it was a situation that could have been avoided. if the day comes where i have to pop someone, it will be done with the most lethal choice available; and that fact should be emphisized. using your mentality, why even carry a gun? use a taser. or a slingshot. or your fingernails. maybe you would feel better knowing the opposing lawyer couldnt say "he loaded his own ammo." it is like taking your knives to someone else to sharpen, because you are afraid that someone is going to sue you after cutting themselves; so you are going to take the position that "hey, i didnt sharpen it, someone else did, sue them." it is really quite silly. me, i like my knives razor sharp and my ammo to inflict maximum damage.

i am still waiting for someone to show me where it has been an issue in any case. anyone?

Mannlicher · « **Reply #17 on:** March 31, 2007, 04:20:13 PM »

I had some reliability issues with CorBon. I am back using the 230 grain HydraShock in my Series 70 Commander and my two Springfields.

the_shadow · « **Reply #18 on:** April 04, 2007, 01:58:09 PM »

I've found the 230 Hydro Shocks from Fed. to work real good. These are mostly for in the winter mounts. Most people out and about wear heavy jackets. This brings up a question. I see a lot on the forums using reloads for C.C.I carry. I've been advised to use commercial ammo, and carry the box in the glove box of my car. I do know that if possible its better to be judged by 12 than carried by six. Anyone know for sure?
James

Mikey · « **Reply #19 on:** April 05, 2007, 12:20:11 AM »

the_shadow: there has not yet been the documented court case in which a defendant has been held liable for using reloaded ammunition in a defensive shooting situation. Mikey.

williamlayton · « **Reply #20 on:** April 05, 2007, 01:57:24 AM »

I must stand with Mikey on this issue.
I guess if you shot a guy with a .44 mag, a mountain gun, or a .50 someone would try and take you to the wall for overkill.
I still feel pretty safe using Ball--this thought has been a slow change for me--and I like the Federal.
Now i don't care for reloads, but that is just me. I mean I like reloading and shooting reloads, I just prefer to carry factory. Just call me anal, I can stand the heat, but it is not that I am afraid of retribution because of being too hot.
BTW--due too recent legislation here in TEXAS, by GOD we'uns will not have need of fear or litigation from the shot folks or their family after September (I think it is Sept.) due to the Castle Law, which recently passed.
In this law, if you have been legally shot, you have no argument and can't sue the shooter---well, I guess some will anyway, but the point is, you have a legal defense.
Blessings

Mannlicher · « **Reply #21 on:** April 07, 2007, 11:49:19 AM »

I carry Federal HydraShock 230 in my Series 70 Commander and in one of my Springfield 1911-A1 pistols. In my other SA, I carry hardball.
While no .45 ACP loading is a magic bullet, most will do the job fairly well. Ball ammo still works too, for those that have forgotten.

Some folks still worry too much about the wrong things though. If your .44 Mag Mountain gun is used in a defensive shooting, and the shooting is justified, it won't make a whit bit of difference IF it goes to trial. Most justified shootings do not go to trial, regardless of what the internet mall ninja's say.
It is more important to use the handgun, and load that you feel will do the best job of saving your life in a time of need. Anything other than that is of secondary, or even tertiary importance. It is not prudent to depend on a less than optimum caliber and load if it offers a poor chance of surviving a deadly encounter.

toysoldier · « **Reply #22 on:** April 12, 2007, 01:46:22 PM »

The increasing size of the average American should be taken into consideration when choosing defense loads. You may need more penetration and less expansion. Some years ago, the operator of a "gaming house" opened his door and took a simultaneous double twelve-gauge load to the chest. He was a really big guy, and the shot made an hourglass-shaped hole in his chest, but none reached his sternum. It did make his heart do a hop, skip and jump for a few days.

Anterior body wall fat can easily reach 5" thick. That's before you get to the muscle and bone. If you're shooting a .45, maybe you should just stick with FMJ. $:-\$

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #23 on:** April 12, 2007, 02:49:15 PM »

If that old boy ACTUALLY took a simultaneous 12 ga. double to the chest and live to tell about it you gotta KNOW he's got some bragg'n rights!!

thxmrgarand · « **Reply #24 on:** April 13, 2007, 05:46:54 AM »

Perhaps I have a misunderstanding of the term ball ammo. What I think it means in this discussion is the typical 230 grain full metal jacket .45 ACP. Five or 6 years ago the local state biologist called me and asked if he could tow into our local trap club a black bear he had caught in his live trap. The trap is made of a culvert pipe. He wanted to put the bear down with no newspaper photographer around and our club has a locked gate. I said sure, and our club caretaker first tried what we called ball ammo. It would not penetrate the bear's skull; just stunned him a little. After a few shots that barely made the bear angry they used a rifle to do the job. When I think of ball ammo I think of munitions restrictions in place during WWII that required fmj non-expanding bullets. Those restrictions do not apply to US citizens defending home and family. Thanks for any clarifying answers.

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #25 on:** April 13, 2007, 01:44:29 PM »

Your understanding of "ball" ammo is pretty much what I've always thought it to be.

toysoldier · « **Reply #26 on:** April 13, 2007, 03:14:16 PM »

Quote from: Dusty Miller on April 12, 2007, 02:49:15 PM

If that old boy ACTUALLY took a simultaneous 12 ga. double to the chest and live to tell about it you gotta KNOW he's got some bragg'n rights!!

My wife worked on the unit where he was hospitalized. Never heard what kind of load it was, probably a quail load. The point is, rapidly-expanding bullets may blow a big hole in someone's lardbelly, without penetrating to the vitals and putting him down. As for shooting a bear in the head, that's a heavily-muscled, thick-boned skull. It's not surprising a round-nosed low-velocity slug glanced off.

Dee · « **Reply #27 on:** April 13, 2007, 03:25:59 PM »

200 grain truncated flat point.

akr · « **Reply #28 on:** April 15, 2007, 02:38:43 PM »

Quote from: RangeMasterTX on March 11, 2007, 09:08:46 PM

Just a bit of advice, regardless of circumstances if you are ever forced to use your side arm for its intended purpose then you must be prepared for the aftermath. some slick prosecutor asking why YOU CHOSE such a destructive ammunition to put the poor helpless crackhead down? it might be a good idea to have an answer for that such as "sir I chose x ammo after speaking to our local police dept sheriffs dept etc. and its what they use to protect our city/county" that is if what they use works in your weapon perfectly and it probably will but avoid handloads the soccer moms in the jury more then likely will have no clue what 9.5 grains of bluedot under a 185 xtp means other than thinking you must have made it as damaging as possible that is if they allow you to bring in your load data which they probably won't. I personally would rather be judged by twelve than carried by six any day. but I also believe in planning ahead. JMHO

I have thought about and worried about all those things, too, and I have decided to use a water pistol for my nightstand gun until I can get to my Daisy BB gun.

Dee · « **Reply #29 on:** April 18, 2007, 03:57:15 PM »

I would be more concerned about possibly causing a permanent stain on the carpet. My wife would really be mad. But then again she has been wanting hardwood anyway.