Optima Elite

[45/70fan]

How is the action strength of these compared to a Handi? Specifically can you load the CVA 45/70 to Ruger levels?

[quickdtoo]

I would say that since the OE is offered in 300 WinMag, it's stronger than a Handi since H&R doesn't offer any magnum rifle calibers. Send Mark an email and see what level the 45-70 barrel will be rated for. See the sticky above for his email addy.

Tim

[45/70fan]

CVA's response:
"This is a very common question.  We do not discuss reloading data.  That is what the books are for.  You can shoot any factory loaded 45-70 ammo in your Elite rifle, including the high performance LeverEvolution ammo and Garrett ammo".   

I guess that means level 2 loads like the Handi.

[Mac11700]

CVA's response:
"This is a very common question.  We do not discuss reloading data.  That is what the books are for.  You can shoot any factory loaded 45-70 ammo in your Elite rifle, including the high performance LeverEvolution ammo and Garrett ammo".   

I guess that means level 2 loads like the Handi.

Well...you can read it that way if you choose...but...CVA/BPI is giving a normal legal response...just as most other companies do these days...They won't be held liable for what hand loaders do with their rifles...The reloading books will tell you how to check for pressure signs...and it is being suggested you follow what the books tell you...Use a logical approach to what you can and cannot load it up to..



.300 Win Mag  64,000psi SAMMI...Hodgdons 2007 annual max loading is 53,600 CUP with Hodgdons powder...and 63,500psi with IMR powder...



Hodgdons Annual max listings is 50,000cup for Ruger #1 loadings

I'm not saying you can or should load to these levels either...no 2 guns are exactly the same...there are way to many variables in reloading and these are maximum book loads for each......but...use common sense and always follow safe reloading practices checking for pressure signs on each load...You'll most likely find an exceptionally accurate load before you reach your shoulders breaking point and the gun...

Mac

[45/70fan]

Thanks Quick and Mac, it looks like the potential could be there.  I foresee a new CVA in the future with 45/70 and 222 barrels.
Mac, I see you are testing a 45/70 barrel for CVA. Is it really a bull barrel as listed on their website?

[Mac11700]

The barrel I got to test was not their bull barrel model....it was the standard contour model...The bull barrels are supposed to arriving at the factory sometime this month per Mark...He told me that the preproduction bull barrels shot the same for them as the standard contoured one I had when they tested them..that the targets they shot at 100 yards were virtually identical...They were using Winchester factory 300 grain loads for their testing on them...For me it's going to be one of those must have barrels..like most of the others as well

Mac

[45/70fan]

I'm thinking the extra weight of the bull barrel would help keep the balance when putting weight in the stock. Not to mention helping the recoil of the heavy loads. I want the 45/70 loaded as hot as possible without stressing the rifle. A hot rodded 45/70 is just plain fun, especially when one your friends want to try it. The look on their face is priceless after the BOOM. If I want something to kick less I'll use my 22-250 or 25/06.

[Mac11700]

Heavy loads will always stress a rifle more than normal loadings...it's something that just can't be helped..and I have found that the laws of diminishing returns comes into to play with the 45-70 above where I have loaded them to...I just don't get a high enough return for an extra 50fps-75fps over what I am already pushing them to with the bullets I shot so far ...I will be trying some of the Barnes originals and see how they do at the 300-400 yard mark later own out of it..the extra velocity will help with them I am sure since they don't open up at as low of velocities and they have much higher BC's...but I really don't need to extend my ranges with it any further than 250-300 yards...if I want to shoot further...I'll use a different rifle...I have plenty of them to do that...

One thing to realize... The Elite is not a Handi when it comes to recoil...The stock design allows the rifle to recoil almost straight back...everyone that has shot one of them will attest to this fact..and the Crush Zone recoil pad works superbly soaking up the recoil even with my hot loads...of the 75 rounds I put thru it that day... I shot the first 40 rounds thru it free recoil..The 41 shot was with my 2115fps 405 grain Cast Performance load...That one touched my caps bill..and got no face slap.....so from shot 42 on.. I shot it normally......I can manage about 20 shots out of my Marlin...and about 10 from my Handi's free recoil style before the recoil gets to much for me for good groups with my loads...I shot the 45-70 with out additional weight in the stock or with a padded cheek piece as I have always prescribed to anyone shooting the Handi's or even the Marlins...The shove was a bit more than my XLR but way less than a unweighted Handi..and muzzle climb was way less than either the Handi or XLR...and I was using a 4x12 Leupold scope on it...not my 2x7. Adding weight to the stock won't be difficult and should reduce it even more...something I might consider doing if & when they offer the big bore magnums like the 338 WM and the 375 H&H or even the 458 WM...These are always a possibility if enough folks ask for them...We can only hope they become a reality...

Mac