First time to the range

[crow_feather]

After buying my rifle - 45-70 - last winter, and reloading cases till spring, I finally got to the range to try out my paper patch and other loads.  Reading articles tells us a few things, but nothin beats experience.

The first lesson learned is that those loads that crowd the max length might not fit come spring.  I pushed and tapped, but some loads that fit when I loaded them did not fit this spring.  They had to be taken apart after I got home.

The second lesson is that if the powder is not compressed, the bullet isn't much good after 150 yards.  I had bullets hitting the ground after the 150 yard marker when they punched a hole four feet high at 90 yards.  I discovered that these loads were with the powder charge lightly compressed at .2" or less.  The powder that I compressed .4" grouped into 1 1/2 " at 90 yards and contacted the top of the berm at two hundred yards.

So if you are just starting, keeping your bullet close to the lands might be nice, but I found that compressed powder loads are more important.  I guess the trick is to put in enough powder to compress .4 to .5, yet still have the length long enough to get close to the lands of the bore.

It is a bit trickier than loading with space between the powder and charge as in smokeless loads.  I was working with three different bullet weights and two different powders.  I believe that I will slow down to one powder (2f) and one bullet style.  All in all, my first day at the range was as informative as most of the articles that I have been reviewing.  Both are necessary in order to learn.

C F
a novice

[rbt50]

i just got this book on pp bullets and was a big help to me .
the name is loading and shooting paper patch bullets a beginner, guide. i got it at buffalo arms.

[sharps4590]

crowfeather, .4-.5 sounds like a lot of compression to me.  At most I compress 1/8 in, or, .125 and those loads in my rifles will do MOA or close to it out to 500 yds.

You didn't mention a blow tube, are you using one?  I know there are differing opinions on a blow tube but my experience indicates they assuredly help in keeping the fouling soft.  Thus, loading with cartridges loaded to seat on or near the lands is not rendered near impossible by the accumulation of fouling.

You mentioned Ffg as a powder you're using.  Were the other loads with GOEX Ctg. or Swiss?  My experience, again, indicates that either of the aforementioned powders give less fouling and better results than plain Ffg.

It sounds as if you had a heck of a good time and a pleasant learning experience with your rifle and loads.  As you've indicated, loading black is quite dissimilar from loading smokeless.  I believe you're on the right track and your personal experience will give you much more confidence than what you read or hear.  Keep at it and good luck!

Vic

[handirifle]

OK someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the powder compression isn't for more power, but rather a smoother, more consistent burn, correct?

My guess is that you have incomplete burning if the bullets are hitting the ground at 150 and 4 FEET HIGH at 90?  Sounds like a charge from a 30-30 trying to push a 400gr bullet.  I have owned a 45-70 and shot a fair amount of BP through it.  I've never, not even on uncompressed loads, had a bullet lob like that.

I'll bet you could have looked downrange and found big chunks of unburned powder on the ground.

I often heard it's not good to load BP cartridges too far in advance, maybe this is why?  Also might have some damp powder.

Otherwise sounds like it was a fun day at the range, and yes, .4-.5 does seem like a LOT of compression.  I could never get close to that without destroying a case.  If you're trying to stuff more powder in the case that way, the best method is to seat the bullet out farther, but that too, has it's limit, as you mentioned.

[boommer]

GUYS I read a lot of posts and replies and  and not to be a smart ass but I think some of you guys try to think to far into this black loads theory
and worked with alot of loads and and by no means a expert but if my bore to slug to twist is right the powder grade is close compression is slight
couple thousands neck tension it is a starting point never over a 6 inch group at 100 yards then just tweak it from there!YES fouling is a problem
but thats workable to keep it soft or just duplex your loads  what I am saying this is not witch craft just I see guys think that all the voodoo
will work but not until you get BASIC worked out  I never had the inter net when I got started only lyman so maybe I see things different?
I work with 1.5 swiss on all my straight wall cartridges now and each one likes different compression some with cards some not  some mag primers
some not tried grease cookies  never seen the need for them even with 34 inch barrel on a high wall 45-90 the more you get powder to burn efficient less the fouling so maybe I am wrong but but it's my world!!

[sharps4590]

what did boomer say?