Send the Bush a message.............

[rockbilly]

This sounds like a fair plan, I doubt that GWB will go along with it as it does nothing to increase his image with the President of Mexico.  I suggest everyone give him a call at 202-456-1111 and let him feel the pulse of the average American.

Tell the White House that the best way to create trust for the guest-worker program is to set aside the immigration bill for now and spend the next eight months fully enforcing and implementing the laws on the books. Then, the President can come back in January and see whether a guest-worker program is really necessary. By then, we will know whether enforcement is working.

Following are even more talking points here.
 
  
Talking point:      The president wants us to trust him to make sure S. 1348 doesn't repeat the mistakes of the 1986 amnesty, but you have to earn trust. The president has had six years to enforce our existing immigration laws, but he has failed to do so.  
  
Talking point:      S. 1348 continues to offer legal status at the very beginning, before ANY new enforcement. The much-touted triggers apply only to requiring enforcement before a guest-worker program and before the illegal aliens apply for a path to citizenship; they can work and live in the U.S. legally for the rest of their lives, regardless of whether any new enforcement ever happens.
  
Talking point:      It would be easier to trust President Bush to enforce our existing immigration laws if he had shown more interest in doing so during the first six years of his administration.
  
Talking point:      The enforcement provisions of S. 1348 are about certain levels of hiring, certain amounts of facilities, and certain infrastructure being in place. They are not about meeting particular goals about reducing illegal immigration.
  

[Almtnman]

I called him this morning and couldn't get the 202-456-1111 number to connect. I got a message saying it was dis-connected. I went back and found another number that I got through on 202-456-1414. Left him a message letting him know that me, my family and all my friends were very unhappy with him representing a bunch of illegal aliens and not listening to American citizens.

[ironglow]

  Can't fault you on that Rockbilly...
  We've had 3 administrations since the "reform" bill passed during the Reagan administration. Not one of them has obeyed the law.
  All the politicos in one party and some in the other party want to go on inviting lawbreaking acts to continue.
 
  Bush is no better Clinton in this respect..both have shrugged their shoulders at the law..the law they have been sworn to uphold..

[deltecs]

If they don't obey their oath of office, don't enforce existing law and so want to enact new laws (1300 pages, don't read it just sign it!), and don't do what their constituency wants,,,,then why would a rational person believe they are acting honestly and erstwhile on other issues? And that assumption is a basis of law enforcement and our justice system.

...TM7

It is uncommon that I agree with most posts from other authors apparent anti bush attitudes.  This post is definitely one I agree with.  Especially since I do not know what his opinion was when Slick Willy committed perjury in a court room deposition and was disbarred subsequently for it.  Not to mention his violation of oath of office to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution.  These facts are probably why I don't necessarily believe the majority of Americans require a deadline for our troops return from Iraq.  Clinton had a 70% plus approval rating according to American polls at the same time he lied and was caught.  Using 7's reasoning it is only logical to presume the American polls with regard to the Iraq troop removal are also wrong in principle.  It is frightening that what's good for the goose is not good enough for the gander for the same reasons as quoted.

[superjay01]

since when has bush cared about the average American? Seems to me the only people he cares about is his business buddies.

[deltecs]

Your study of Clintonism is interesting, but is recent history, at least until we get Clinton 2.. .
But his courtroom charges revolved around sexual peccadilloes, probably because he refused to all out attack Iracq; and NOT grave leaks of secret information, lieing about real events and fabricating intell reports, thusly leading to a foreign policy and expense of perpetual war. Clinton is most likely quilty of far more serious things than frolicking in the W House, for which the Repubs misjudged public opinion whilst dwelling on such practices common among world leaders and politicians, and other power brokers.

...TM7

Clintons problems were about incompetence.  He violated civil rights in Waco, killed innocent women and children in Idaho and Waco, broke his oath of office to preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution by committing perjury that resulted in a judges dismissal of a sexual harassment lawsuit that denied this individuals right to fair and impartial trial.  Had he told the truth and upheld his oath of office, would he have been found guilty of violating federal law?  As President of the United States, the executive branch is charged with enforcement of law and as President has the highest standards in that enforcement.  Also, what about Slick Willy's position with regard to firearms?  In his campaign for re-election, he stated that 20,000 felons had been prevented access to handguns due passage of the Brady Bill, which he wholeheartedly endorsed.  Why then were only 3 prosecuted for attempting to possess a firearm, another felony violation of federal law for felons, when every application had the name and address of the 19,997 other felons?  Did Slick Willy lie to the American people again or did he ineptly perform his duty to prosecute these so called criminals?  Can we expect anything different from his wife?  At least Bush is making some effort to curtail terrorism on the home front and take the fight to them, very much in line with his duties as President and did so with the consent of Congress.  Do not pee on my boots and tell me its raining.

[deltecs]

The point I'm trying to make is that the media and its coverage of Iraqi war dissenters, civil rights for terrorists with equal protection under US law, and embellishment of individuals' loss of relatives in the war, has swayed the American people into believing Pres Bush as a totalitarian dictator.  These same people refuse to acknowledge that their party leaders of choice have also been just as corrupt, if not more so since Congress did not approve of their choice of actions.  The Demoncrats have for years promised some sort of health care reform for the populace.  It wasn't until the Repubs gained control of Congress that some prescription drug relief was enacted under Bush.  Why didn't the Dems enact one during the 20 previous years that it controlled Congress.  The reason for all the Bush bashing is for positioning in the 2008 Presidential election by liberals hoping to gain control of the White House.  Bush was given erroneous intelligence by our civil servants with regard to Iraq.  These same civil servants gave the same information to Clinton.  Bush was under immense pressure from the American people to protect the homeland from further terrorist attacks.  He made a decision with Congressional approval using the same facts he had, to invade Iraq.  Iraq and Hussein did not and had not complied with the first Gulf War peace terms.   Hussein hated the US and had weapons of mass destruction.  His previous actions in the invasion of Kuwait, left no doubt in the minds of world leaders that he did not care a bit about what the rest of the world thought about using negotiation instead of war.  He openly supported the terrorist attacks on the US on 9/11.  He had the money, means, and weapons to bring more terror attacks to our homeland.  Bush did what he and others, including our Congressional delegation from both parties, thought to be prudent and overthrew Hussein.  I do not agree with all that Pres Bush has done.  I do think he has ethically tried to uphold his oath of office, which is more than I can say of past presidents. 

[deltecs]

From what information I've researched, my statements and conclusions are as accurate as I can logically make them.  The masses as you suggest should be more discerning as to the media news.  This I agree with.  However, I do not agree with conclusions that are patently designed to undermine the Presidents integrity.  Errors by our so called intelligence services are just that.  Given false information, most people would make the wrong decision.  Unless you are privy to the inner workings of the Presidential circle and have the same information he's getting first hand, then all other information is hearsay and omitted from the Courts with good reason.  I definitely lean Conservative yet have no political affiliation and am non partisan.  My personal conclusions over the last 55 years have led me to believe that the course of America is not the way of the liberals.  I dislike the misinformation by the media and liberal disregard for the value of the individual.  An example is the liberal Supreme Court justices that decided that modern homes in Connecticut are subject to eminent domain, so the community can raze them and sub contract the land to a developer for a higher tax base.   This is completely different than seizure for eminent domain where the public welfare outweighs the home owners use of the land.  IE.  bridges, highways, etc., all government property, not sold to private developers so the community gets higher taxes.  I dislike the liberal stand on any firearms restrictions; the liberals continue to disregard the facts that violent crime has been reduced in every state with concealed carry.  I don't think bigger government can take care of the people better than they CAN themselves.  If they choose not, too bad as that is capitalism.  Those who work harder for what they want generally get it.  Until some clearer evidence is presented and proved, I will still support the Conservative side of politics, currently Pres Bush.

[williamlayton]

Bill Clinton will--whether anyone agrees with the conclusion or not--probably be judged as one of the most competent Presidents since Harry Truman. His incompetence with women will surely be judged as a blip compared too others and there is strong evidence to say that at least one of our last 8 Presidents saw the sexual issue from two sides. Those page boys have long been a favorite of many in the congress.
The last three Republicans who slept in the white house have been pawns of of power brokers not known.
Now I am not a Democrat--but I have always been a Conservative Democrat and the Republicans have always been what they are, never mind those who they would put in the white house.
I want to start a good conservative Constitutional Party. Don't bring up the Libertarian's--they have more garbage in their portfolio than they can sort out among theirownselves.
Blessings

[powderman]

TM7. I'm not sure whether clinton lied about his sexual escapades, or whether he just wasn't smart enough to know he was having sex, he is married to hillary ya know. POWDERMAN. 

[Dee]

TM7. I'm not sure whether clinton lied about his sexual escapades, or whether he just wasn't smart enough to know he was having sex, he is married to hillary ya know. POWDERMAN. 

Now there is a valid point to ponder.

[alsaqr]

"He violated civil rights in Waco, killed innocent women and children in Idaho....."

Wrong on the Idaho thing.  That one happened on the watch of our beloved Big Daddy Bush.   

[powderman]

DELTECS. Good posts. If president Bush were a dumcrap, the libs would all love him. POWDERMAN. 

[SHOOTALL]

who is going to pay ? i mean the cash part ? is PRES. BUSH wrong to find a least expensive way ? lets face it no pres. has done a good job with respect to the illegals , its always a cost issue ! no pres. party , wants to add a cost that no one gets a benefit from , read vote !
its like a stray dog , not legal but as long as everyone enjoys its company , no one calls the dog warden ! but if it does something wrong the dog catcher gets the flack !

[Dee]

I believe the real issue is enforcing the present laws. Also, cost effectiveness in ridding us of the illegal alien would be minimal if you simply made it ILLEGAL TO HIRE AN ILLEGAL, and enforce the law. They would pay their own way home, with no jobs available here, and the others would not come in the first place.
These illegals that are working on stolen or false social security #s are paying into the tax base and aren't getting any of it back. That means more money for the government to waste. They aren't going to run off a cash cow. It doesn't really affect THEM, but it certainly does us.
What they don't really care about is, the illegal has learned how to exploit our social services, and are.

[rockbilly]

Shootall, congratulations!  If the democrat party has it's way, or gets any stronger after next election, then YOU (we) will pay.  Check out my post, "Lady Speaker,"  that kinda outlines the democrat plan.

[SHOOTALL]

We will pay no matter who gets elected ! we always do !
we need to enforce the laws we have , and should have been doing so !
and take a look at the dem. and rep. parties they take a very small difference and try to mask it to the voters as a major issue when in fact there is little difference anymore ! i guess when you have career politicians the need for reelection over rides the needs of the country no matter what party they hail from !

[Dee]

We will pay no matter who gets elected ! we always do !
we need to enforce the laws we have , and should have been doing so !
and take a look at the dem. and rep. parties they take a very small difference and try to mask it to the voters as a major issue when in fact there is little difference anymore ! i guess when you have career politicians the need for reelection over rides the needs of the country no matter what party they hail from !

That's it right there!

[alsaqr]

i'm totally bent out of shape at congressional Democrats.  Just want to puke that Republicans Kyl, McCain, and that idiot from SC are in favor of forgiving illegal aliens.  Most of all i totally detest the white house for not enforcing US law.  Worse that that the white house is holding US law hostage until they get amnesty for their beloved illegal aliens.  After all it was the Bush Bunch who dreamed up this deal with Teddy Baby Kennedy. 

There is a very good chance that i will not vote next year.  Am tired of having to vote for the lesser of two evils.  Evil is still evil.  In the end the Republicans are just as evil as the Democrats. 

[SHOOTALL]

don't get mad at the illegals , can't blame them , its like getting ticked off at flies in the house when you are to lazy to shut the door ! even if they do pick up the crumbs on the floor !

[powderman]

don't get mad at the illegals , can't blame them , its like getting ticked off at flies in the house when you are to lazy to shut the door ! even if they do pick up the crumbs on the floor !

SHOOTALL. Good point, but I'm fed up with them laughing at our laws and disrespecting America. Find em, arrest em, ship em out. Make the penalty so harsh they would never want to come back. POWDERMAN. 

[magooch]

No sir, I am mad at anyone who comes, or tries to come here illegally and I'm mad at our elected officials who don't vigorously enforce the present immigration laws.  The problem is that too many politicians have bought into the idea that immigration is complex and must be addressed with comprehensive legislation.  I think the majority of the public looks at it from a simpler point of view; just control the borders and get the illegals the hell out.

[SHOOTALL]

guy's govt. in this country is over 200 years old , how many " new " laws are needed ? a few maybe !
take the patriot act , it takes away freedoms to address issues we already have laws for !
restore the 2nd amd. and see how many terrorist make it ! enable the public to protect themselves , not heard them around like a target !
the people in govt. seem to think new law instead of why is the old law not being enforced ?
it seems it is much more important to see why 5 deadbeat attorneys were fired instead of why the INS isn't keeping the illegals out !

[rockbilly]

I think the majority of the American people live with their heads in the sand,  all one need to do is a little research and they would see that amnesty is not in the best interest of this country. Most people have made no effort to familiarize themselves with S 1348, and how it will effect the American citizens.  This will give you some good information on why the bill should not be passed.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxo6RpjPC7M

[Dee]

don't get mad at the illegals , can't blame them , its like getting ticked off at flies in the house when you are to lazy to shut the door ! even if they do pick up the crumbs on the floor !

Sorry SHOOTALL, I agree with you much of the time, but I HATE A THIEF, and the illegals have learned to manipulate out social services and are STEALING US BLIND. That is why health, and auto insurance is thru the ceiling, why hospitals are closing, and the one's that are staying open are charging a Kings Ransom for an over night stay or a visit to the emergency room. I HATE A THEIF.

[powderman]

We keep hearing about them doing jobs Americans don't want. Bullhockey. Our store just completed a remodel. The plumbers went yabba dabba doo all day. Skilled labor??? Every faucet is loose and swings right and left, they are not supposed to. They put the partitions in where the side of the stool is 2 inches from the wall and the TP holders are wherever they decided to put them. They installed toilet seat covers with lids, and electric eyes to flush,  Shut the lid to flush. Water fountains are mostly in pairs. The tall ones come to the bottom of my pants pocket, the shorter ones just above my kneecap. The store mgr said his 2 year old would have to stoop down to get a drink. The contractors have not been paid, and won't till a host of things are made right. Missing trim, loose baseboards, leaky plumbing, toilets that don't flush, etc.  Even customers complained about the shoddy work. One man, a teacher, said his 5th grade class could do better. YEP, we need that skilled labor. POWDERMAN. 

[SHOOTALL]

that what the lowest bidder will get ya !
store clerks show same traits in some stores !

[nomosendero]

The message was sent. Aint it great!!!

[powderman]

I don't know what part of the word ILLEGAL is so hard to understand. Those people shame the millions of hard working Americans who have followed the rules and laws of our land to become American citizens. POWDERMAN. 

[SHOOTALL]

DEE , i want the laws enforced with regard to the illegals , my point is that laws are already on the books ! who and why aren't they being enforced ? how did 12 million people get in with out someone saying why !
if the illegals are theft's then the officials that turn their backs are just as guilty !
but its hard to fault someone that comes in when some seem to hold the door open !
lets get our house straight then work on the neighbors !