Author Topic: my gun , not my state  (Read 725 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline SHOOTALL

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23836
my gun , not my state
« on: June 13, 2007, 07:03:44 AM »
Should we be allowed by federal law to carry our concealed weapons to other states if we have a lic. in our own state ?
Are the laws that say we cannot in violation of the 2nd Amd. ?
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline deltecs

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1605
  • Gender: Male
Re: my gun , not my state
« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2007, 01:01:05 PM »
The idea that the federal law gives permission for someone who has a legal concealed carry permit to carry in some other state is not currently protected.  A bill in both houses of Congress addresses this issue for all states that allow concealed carry.  The US Constitution and the 2nd Amendment basically recognizes and states that right to keep and bear arms shall not be ignored.  This is substantially different than granting rights and protections to those who carry arms.  A thorough review of the Federalist papers, the language of the Bill of Rights, US Constitutional law, and US Supreme Court decisions on the term "people", 14th Amendment due process clause, and English Common Law logically leads me to believe that any restrictions on the right to carry arms is a violation of law anywhere.  The right to carry arms is a fundamental right not a governmental right granted.  Thus, it follows that this right to self presevation by arming oneself existed prior to any and all governments and supersedes any restrictions enacted by government.  Now, to have this fundamental right recognized in all states and cities in the US is a completely different problem.  Too much emotion for logical conclusions and realism, too many bleeding heart liberals, too many unethical politicians using this as the cause for crime and promising to reduce crime by elimination of firearms, and too few who have common sense.
Greg lost his battle with cancer last week on April 2nd 2009. RIP Greg. We miss you.

Greg
deltecs
Detente: An armed citizenry versus a liberal society
Opinion(s) are expressly mine alone and do not necessarily agree with those of GB or GBO mgmt.

Offline SHOOTALL

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23836
Re: my gun , not my state
« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2007, 02:13:27 AM »
Good points all ! 
Would the current laws in DC with regard to not being able to own a hand gun , if the court decision that the law was unconstitutional is upheld , help in this push to get the right extended nation wide and eliminate other gun control laws ?
I feel the gun control laws have nothing to do with crime other than to make gun owners criminals , they seem more aimed at people control , and the removal of the peoples only way to ensure that govt. does the will of the people ! It is a fact that guns do cause harm in our society but the also serve a valued need , much as a car does ! the good out weighs the bad !
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline deltecs

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1605
  • Gender: Male
Re: my gun , not my state
« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2007, 11:47:16 AM »
Good points all ! 
Would the current laws in DC with regard to not being able to own a hand gun , if the court decision that the law was unconstitutional is upheld , help in this push to get the right extended nation wide and eliminate other gun control laws ?

Not necessarily.  Since Wash. DC is federal land and government control, the 2nd Amendment only forces federal jurisdictions to recognize armed citizenry.  However, some States like Alaska has identical language in its State Constitution, which then would have to follow federal law and its interpretation.  Identical language and identical intent would necessitate identical treatment under the law.  One of the US Supreme Courts decisions the Antis use as an example of firearms restrictions is Miller.  What they don't tell you is that in Miller during the initial lower court trials, Miller made no defense that a shotgun had any military justification.  The High Court ruled that since no military association was entered, Mr. Miller had no absolute right to parade with a shotgun on public grounds.  The Court did insinuate that had a different defense been presented in the lower courts that their decision probably would have been different than that entered.  So in reality, any arms having a military application could be legal using Miller as the Court precedent.  In the case of the Appeals Court overturning DC's handgun law, the High Court if it agrees with the Appeals Court ruling, will have substantial impact on the States.  Wouldn't that be great?
Greg lost his battle with cancer last week on April 2nd 2009. RIP Greg. We miss you.

Greg
deltecs
Detente: An armed citizenry versus a liberal society
Opinion(s) are expressly mine alone and do not necessarily agree with those of GB or GBO mgmt.

Offline SHOOTALL

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23836
Re: my gun , not my state
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2007, 12:01:17 PM »
Yes it would ! I have heard the argument that since  drivers lic. is good all over then the ccw lic. should be , not sure that is a good route to take !
A dri. lic is a privlige and the gun is a right , I believe to compare only invites problems down the road !
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline deltecs

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1605
  • Gender: Male
Re: my gun , not my state
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2007, 11:16:18 AM »
It is unfortunate that even many firearms owners believe that the 2nd Amendment guarantees them the right to own guns.  It does not.  It merely recognizes a fundamental right to self preservation and defense of state.  This fundamental right as stated in the Bill of Rights only means that the federal government shall not ignore impugn this individual right.  The 9th Amendment though recognizes that any right not granted to the Constitution, like both the right to bear arms and drivers licenses, belong to the States or the people respectively.  This is how different States have undermined the fundamental right to bear arms.  Drivers licenses are recognized by all States to be a privilege.  I totally agree that any comparisons between the 2 is not only counter productive but increases the public misconception between right and privileges.  The Anti's don't care about saving lives regardless of their rhetoric.  If they did, they'd outlaw individual ownership of autos.  Can you imagine the fervor against any politician that suggested this?  Anti firearms is about people controlling others using the law.  Any politician that campaigns against firearms ownership does not get my vote regardless of party lines, since they ignore my inherent rights and think they know what's best for me using their standards of ethics.  I'll keep my firearms to prevent government abuse of fundamental rights.  Detente.
Greg lost his battle with cancer last week on April 2nd 2009. RIP Greg. We miss you.

Greg
deltecs
Detente: An armed citizenry versus a liberal society
Opinion(s) are expressly mine alone and do not necessarily agree with those of GB or GBO mgmt.