Author Topic: WATCH THIS (Read 2362 times)

ms · « **on:** July 18, 2007, 12:59:45 PM »

http://www.taurususa.com/video/taurus-theJudge-video.cfm

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #1 on:** July 18, 2007, 01:58:03 PM »

I don't have a lot of expertise in the area of the 410 shotgun as a self-defense item, but a 410 revolver strikes me as a crock of brown stinky bovine gravy when it comes to SD. Just WHAT is the advantage of that light shot load over the 357 mag, 44 special, 40 S&W, 45 LC, 45 ACP, or 44 mag? I think somebody is trying to reinvent the wheel.

ms · « **Reply #2 on:** July 18, 2007, 10:43:12 PM »

You point a shot gun at someone with buckshot or bird shot it's about 98% chance someone getting hit.

williamlayton · « **Reply #3 on:** July 19, 2007, 01:20:08 AM »

There are a number of makers of pistols with this ability, and, they serve the purpose for which they are designed---notice the alternating shot loaded.
My friend has one for his lake house and finds it invaluable when putting the boat in early in the morning. He has dispensed several cottonmouths and, once, a bob-cat which was lurking in the boathouse.
I don't know that the .410 would do much too a gator though.
Blessings

TGFOGAL · « **Reply #4 on:** July 19, 2007, 08:47:53 AM »

A two or three foot pattern from a 410 can mean the difference between a hit and a miss when the bad guy is moving.
It may keep him from continuing the attack when a miss would not.

rockbilly · « **Reply #5 on:** July 19, 2007, 09:39:49 AM »

A .410 in the face up close and personal with take the will to fight out of the majority of the people, but it has always been my opinion, if you gotta shot them, kill 'em! That way you don't end up in a civil court with a settlement to support the thug for the rest of his life.

*It may work for snakes and bobcats, but I have something much better for the bad guy that tries to take my vehicle..............

GRIMJIM · « **Reply #6 on:** July 19, 2007, 11:50:50 AM »

I told my wife about the alternatiing load. You shoot with the shot then when they flinch you have time to get a good bead on him with the bullet. She thought it was pretty funny.

K.K · « **Reply #7 on:** July 19, 2007, 03:29:41 PM »

I don't think that I would carry one as a personal defense weapon, but the results on that close-range shoot-n-c target are impressive. Any bad guy you hit in the mug with that load will most likely wish he stayed home. Also, the .45 LC ain't no slouch in the PD department either! I did read that accuracy at 25 yards was poor with keyhole tendencies. Like I said, it's not for me, but I would NOT want to be on the receiving end! Pretty cool for snakes and birds at short range too.

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #8 on:** July 19, 2007, 08:17:21 PM »

My preference is to rely on a KNOWN STOPPER and leave the unproven techniques to others to try.

Heavy C · « **Reply #9 on:** July 23, 2007, 05:32:12 AM »

American Rifleman has an article on The Judge this month. With 410 shells it seemed to do okay, but they had issues getting a decent group with 45 Colt at 25 yards. I believe the best group they achieved was a little over 4". The model they tested had the 2.5" chamber. It's a neat concept, but I'll probably pass on this one.

35Rem · « **Reply #10 on:** July 23, 2007, 07:42:52 AM »

Quote from: ms on July 18, 2007, 10:43:12 PM

You point a shot gun at someone with buckshot or bird shot it's about 98% chance someone getting hit.

You ever pattern a shotgun up close? My Mossberg 500 w/ 18" Cylinder barrel (Open Choke) throws a 6" pattern at 30 feet. That's hardly pointing and hitting.
Shotguns have to be aimed at close distances folks.

Old Griz · « **Reply #11 on:** August 10, 2007, 07:39:12 PM »

People have strange notions about shotgun patterns and the effectiveness of bird shot as a self defense load. I think a lot of them are relying on TV/movie shotguns and not real life shotguns.

bscman · « **Reply #12 on:** August 13, 2007, 07:34:09 AM »

45/410 revolvers and derringers have been around for ages...Taurus isn't pioneering anything here.

It sure looked impressive at 10ft shooting a shootnsee target...but imagine what good is that 410 shotshell going to do with an attacker wearing a heavy coat? What if the window is still up? What if your wife or kid is in that seat? Are ya gunna spray then with #6, too?

And don't try telling me it's a great vehicle defense tool because the extra shot can mean the difference between a hit and a miss...that's a bunch of garbage! If someone is at your car door trying to hijack you, how do you miss? You should be able to instictively be able to shoot accurately at that distance, no sights needed, and be able to hit a man sized target. If you can't hit a man size target standing on the other side of your vehicle, you have NO reason to be carrying a firearm....!!!

And what happens if you're loaded up with shotshells and the attacker is 25' away? Sure and heck isn't going to be effective whem the spread of the shot is like 8' at that distance.

Good luck...but I'd rather survive a car jacking!

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #13 on:** August 14, 2007, 03:36:15 PM »

Well stated bscman, this idea is one that deserves an early death!!

wJAKE19 · « **Reply #14 on:** August 23, 2007, 06:34:41 AM »

I sure think this would be a fun rabbit hunting gun. for SD I will stick w/ my XD.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #15 on:** August 23, 2007, 07:36:20 AM »

It would make a great snake gun , a 410 buck shot load is not a bad load , mossberg makes a 410 home defense pump shot gun ! each year the county papers around here publish a story about some kid killing a deer with a 410 , the last 2 one was 40 yards and the other 70 ! lucky shot maybe but the fact remains it will kill .
now on average a shot gun sends its load down range at 1200 plus feet per second , now if the buck shot loads that are made for the derringer are used the fps would be lower than the long gun but I'm not sure how much . that's what would make the difference . some of the shells carry 3 ooo buck some five #1 buck and others #4 buck ! now if the speed was 800 fps and the shot was 3 ooo buck wouldn't the shot be somewhat like being hit with 3 38spl rounds at once ? add the other chambers and you can have alot of fire power in a short time in a very close space say like a small room or maybe a car or truck ! with regard to the wife , teach her to duck when you are saving her life ! besides unless you have really short arms the muzzle should be past her !
heavy coat , got any idea how many people carry a mouse gun ( 22 short , 25 acp, 32 acp etc )? do like them , go for the face !
i don't think the idea is a wide pattern , its multiple hits , ie. more shock to the bad guy ! as far as hits on target i have heard 1 in 7 in a real gun fight and that's from trained officers , don't sneer until you have been in a fight where some one wanted to hurt you !
think of it this way the judge is sending more power down range than any solider did with a 36 cap and ball revolver did during the Civil War every time the trigger is pulled ! its a shame none of those guys are alive to tell us how they worked ! best we have is Wild Bills tally of kills ! seemed to work for him now didn't it ?

papajohn428 · « **Reply #16 on:** August 26, 2007, 05:31:22 AM »

I think Taurus is just looking for something different to market, since many of their guns are just knock-offs of the Smiths. 45/410 guns have been around for years, and the main knock on them is that they just don't shoot the 45 LC very well. For a snake gun, sure, it'll work fine. Maybe carry two snake loads, the rest slugs, but it's still not very concealable, and there are a lot of better choices for a truck gun or CCW. Personally, if I was gonna carry anything that big I'd like a 5 or 6 shot 44 Spl, or a 357 snubby. I know two people who have bought The Judge, and both say they like it as a novelty, something they didn't have. It's not what I'd pick for a defensive gun, but I'd rather not stand in front of it when it goes off, either. Call me a wussie. I don't mind the sight of blood.........unless it's mine!

Papajohn

stuffit · « **Reply #17 on:** August 26, 2007, 09:20:58 AM »

If you're a re-loader then this handgun seems an excellent choice for it's ostensible role as a carjacking arrester/deterrent/terminator. By utilizing the brass 410 shells you could make a variety of multi-projectile loads from # 2 shot up to a couple or three stacked round .450 balls. The possibilities for dealing out death and destruction to the evil, ungodly carjackers are endless. You could even load up the brass .410 casings with an appropriate 0.452" bullet, cast or jacketed as long as you kept the pressure contained within a safe range and probably improve on the accuracy obtained from standard length 45 Colt rounds.

From the point of view of dealing with carjackers, deteriorating accuracy at ranges past 15yds - 25yds doesn't seem an issue since car jacking can hardly be effected at those distances. And, with the smaller diameter multi-projectile loads there's certainly much less chance of collateral damage. Considering the endless possibilities for alternating types of loads in different chambers staggers the imagination. It's a specialized handgun, no doubt, but it's design seems well suiited for it's purpose, particularly with the flexability loading your own in the 410 brass cases offers.

stuffit

randyb · « **Reply #18 on:** September 04, 2007, 09:39:19 AM »

birdshot is for birds, snakes, etc.

Buckshot is for larger critters (like criminals).

In .410 I'd opt for the 000 Winchester or the 00 S&B load for self defense. All birdshot is going to do to a determined attacker is make him a madder determined attacker.

Neat concept and one I'd love as a fun gun, but wouldn't be my choice for self defense from people, just snakes.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #19 on:** September 04, 2007, 09:52:10 AM »

shame it ain't 28 ga !

Dand · « **Reply #20 on:** September 09, 2007, 10:20:29 PM »

once a police officer let me watch a video of an older lady giving testimony about an assault on her in bush Alaska. She was in the outhouse and a guy tried to reach in and molest her. She had been carrying a 410 for grouse. She got the gun on him and fired a round at 15 or 20 feet - can't remember if it was to his crotch or rear - anyway assailant stopped pronto when she presented the gun. I think he started acting like he doubted she she would shoot - so she convinced him in no uncertain terms. Seems like she might have chased him a ways too afterward. I believe it was ruled a self defense shooting and she was released. We watched it a couple times. The way she told the story we were rolling on the floor and cheering her on.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #21 on:** September 10, 2007, 02:59:10 AM »

the Bond derringer has no cyl/bbl gap like the Taurus wonder which has more thump on the target ? maybe the bbl length vs gap would cancel out ! i like the idea but not the maker of the Taurus , think i would get the Bond gun ! if for no other reason than the judge would be easier to grab and twist out of your hand in a close confine like a car !
i don't care for the attitude displayed by Dick Metcalf's writing or shows so maybe that's why i like the Bond better , just being honest !

coyotejoe · « **Reply #22 on:** September 30, 2007, 05:03:02 AM »

I have one of the "Comanche" singleshots in .45/410. I milled off the bulky adjustable rear sight as I never considered using the .45 Colt rounds, I consider it strictly a small game gun and it has taken several grouse, both on the ground and on the wing. Velocity of 3" Federal #6's runs just under 1000 fps from the solid chamber and 10" barrel with patterns effective on game to at least 25 yards. As to the Judge, it is indeed a specialized piece but for it's purpose I'd not complain of accuracy with the .45 Colt since few people shoot really well in a life and death situation. If it will keep .45s in six inches at twenty-five yards that is way better than anyone will shoot while being shot at. Legally, it would be hard to justify shooting someone more than fifty feet away. For a strictly defensive weapon, with no sporting potential, I think "The Judge" is not a bad idea, I just wish it were made by someone with a better reputation than Taurus.