Author Topic: What is your HOME defense weapon? (Read 37586 times)

Cheesehead · « **Reply #330 on:** July 03, 2009, 06:52:14 PM »

Some do not find it entertaining and want it locked.

Cheese

Mohawk · « **Reply #331 on:** July 03, 2009, 07:25:52 PM »

Quote from: mcwoodduck on July 01, 2009, 12:49:57 PM

OH lots of people like #4 buck as it is still buck and will work well both indoor and outside and holds some where between 27 to 41 .24 caliber balls.
Kind of like touching off a whole AR 15 Mag out of each shell.

No it's not.......

teamnelson · « **Reply #332 on:** July 03, 2009, 07:44:45 PM »

41 subsonic .24 caliber balls traveling in a small cloud with an MER of 100yds ... ok, you're right. It's not the same. Ballistically, that's more like the terminal performance of an OTS Mini-14 in the hands of an inexperienced shooter whose watched too much TV. Either one is pretty good for HOME defense though.

Savage · « **Reply #333 on:** July 03, 2009, 11:57:07 PM »

For across the room home defense ranges, #4 buck should do just fine. Even with an open choke, the pattern would be close to fist size. Even #4 chilled shot would work pretty well at those ranges! FWIW, voodoo would be more effective at 100yds than #4 buck! The energy of a single pellet of #4 buckshot, in no way compares to a single 5.56 round at any range. I'll take the AR.
Savage

williamlayton · « **Reply #334 on:** July 04, 2009, 12:14:18 PM »

Well, sure some find it entertaining, and, it is. It is also like sitting in one spot and watching a Merry-go-roud. Every 15 seconds the white horse shows up.
I am not argueing for locking it--I just don't see anything new or provoking after this many hits.
Blessings

Mohawk · « **Reply #335 on:** July 05, 2009, 02:51:03 AM »

I guess #4 buck would be ok, but I personally stick with 00 size. Seen the effects of 00 buck at 6 yds and it is disturbing. Overpenetration was not an issue as 9 pellets entered and only two, barely, exited. Overpenetration is overrated. It's the 15 of 41 pellets of #4 that missed would be a greater concern. When it comes to penetration and a gelatin block says 14" that may only mean 7" when you include muscle, bone, stretch resistance of organs, ribs, angle, clothing, etc. But then again, a load of #4 birdshot will do a number inside a room on an armed burglar.

lrs · « **Reply #336 on:** July 06, 2009, 05:32:51 AM »

Perhaps another good question would be:

" HOW FAST can you deploy your home defense weapon "
If an assailant is whittlin his way through your front door with a buck knife, you have all the time in the world to watch the news, finish your dinner, go unlock the safe, get your gun, remove the trigger lock, open up a fresh box of shells, load the firearm, walk back to the front door, and send a couple of rounds through the door.
I've never had an intruder in my home, but as I understand, it does not happen this way.

gstewart44 · « **Reply #337 on:** July 06, 2009, 06:55:10 AM »

Not sure what state you live in but in Florida if you "send a couple of rounds through the door" to a perp that has not made entry into your home you are going to be in some deep doo-doo and looking forward to a lot of time in state lockup.

teamnelson · « **Reply #338 on:** July 06, 2009, 07:36:19 AM »

IRS, see you don't need guns. A call into 911 and lickety split they'll be someone round to stop the guy carving his initials in your front door - loads of time.

lrs · « **Reply #339 on:** July 06, 2009, 08:25:11 AM »

I was just trying to make this a little more interesting.

Forget it.

teamnelson · « **Reply #340 on:** July 06, 2009, 04:01:57 PM »

Actually IRS I think you raised a good question. Gun in the hand is worth 2 in the safe. Dad taught us to stage a few around the property, all in cond 1. I bet I still haven't found 'em all since he passed, which he did in his sleep in his scooter chair, a .22 in a holster riveted to the chair.

Mohawk · « **Reply #341 on:** July 06, 2009, 06:23:57 PM »

Most of the time they just ram the door in, by foot or shoulder. Locks keep honest people honest, that's it. But, at least in Texas, forced entry is forced entry. Depending on how the DA interprets it, entering a locked door by any means other than a key could qualify. Where it gets tricky is a case I once studied. A woman was sleeping on her couch. She forgot to lock her apartment door. A person living in her complex was intoxicated and entered her home thinking it was his own apartment. Was it a forced entry? A good preparation is always best. Not just with guns, ammo, tactics......but also with what the LAW says NOT what the guy at the gunstore told you. Every defense situation is different even in your own home. A basic rule of thumb I've always remembered is that if you had "time" to decide to use deadly force, you were probably wrong in using it outside of a legal war.

bilmac · « **Reply #342 on:** July 07, 2009, 12:45:19 AM »

The acid test that almost all LE agencies use is "did you fear for your life or were you protecting someone else's life".

Mohawk · « **Reply #343 on:** July 07, 2009, 07:12:43 AM »

Quote from: bilmac on July 07, 2009, 12:45:19 AM

The acid test that almost all LE agencies use is "did you fear for your life or were you protecting someone else's life".

You would think......

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #344 on:** July 07, 2009, 07:36:21 AM »

don't forget -What would a normal person do when faced with the same situation .

but that dosen't take into account politics now does it .

Crimson Mister · « **Reply #345 on:** July 07, 2009, 10:02:19 AM »

I have a noisey wife and an ankle biting dog. That should buy me the time I need to get myself to safety.

Mohawk · « **Reply #346 on:** July 07, 2009, 06:32:54 PM »

I know in some jurisdictions your head better be falling off before you will be legally deserving to defend yourself. And ironically, these are the same jurisdictions that give 1st degree murderers probation and time served. And whatever you do, DO NOT ever harm a dog as he is trying to bite school children. You will get time for animal cruelty.

bilmac · « **Reply #347 on:** July 08, 2009, 12:52:44 AM »

Mohawk

I think I would be looking for a new place to live and leave the places you talk about to their misery.

mechanic · « **Reply #348 on:** July 08, 2009, 11:15:44 AM »

Here in Ga. you only have to believe that your life is threatened. Does not matter if its in your house or out accd. to our local sheriff. There has to be some indication however that you really were in trouble, can't just up and shoot someone. Have to ask Atlaw, but "he just needed killin' probably wouldn't make the grade. I was told that an elderly person or woman accosted by a younger and stronger person, etc. can use whatever force required to defend themselves. They look a little differently at a young strong male, unless he is attacked by a someone with a weapon, etc. In most cases local authorities make the call.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #349 on:** July 09, 2009, 03:24:27 AM »

local laws and tradition of the area could /do impact what happens but three things need to be present before you defend yourself with deadly force .
1- a threat that makes you fear death or grave bodily harm .
ie a threat by someone .
2- means to carry out the threat ie a knife , club or gun etc. this could also include dispardity (sp) of force ie a bigger person , male vs female , age , physical handicaped , or number of attackers .
3- the attacker moves , attacks or in some way starts the attack .

At that point you are forced to defend yourself ! no matter the law of the land it is stop the attack or suffer !

Lawndart · « **Reply #350 on:** July 10, 2009, 04:08:34 PM »

Quote from: Crimson Mister on July 07, 2009, 10:02:19 AM

I have a noisey wife and an ankle biting dog. That should buy me the time I need to get myself to safety.

you have nothing to fear.

Lawndart · « **Reply #351 on:** July 10, 2009, 04:18:34 PM »

Quote from: Savage on July 03, 2009, 11:57:07 PM

For across the room home defense ranges, #4 buck should do just fine. Even with an open choke, the pattern would be close to fist size. Even #4 chilled shot would work pretty well at those ranges! FWIW, voodoo would be more effective at 100yds than #4 buck! The energy of a single pellet of #4 buckshot, in no way compares to a single 5.56 round at any range. I'll take the AR.
Savage

I agree. Most anything will work in normal HD distances.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #352 on:** July 11, 2009, 01:52:19 AM »

Not sure a 223 round or 3 would make the same impression at ten yards a 12 3.5 mag load of #4 buck would make . A 223 at yardage would be easier to hit with for sure but at close range buck shot and the guns that shoot them in the hands of someone that really understands them can be effective to be sure . Nothing is faster to target than the gun invented to hit moving targets .
The biggest mistake most make is the idea that you most use a shotgun with rifle tactics or a rifle for shotgun tactics . If you had a shotgun would you set up to snipe someone at 300 yards then blame the gun ? or lay in wait until they were in range ? It seems here most pick their pet gun them try to make it best at everything , just ain't so !
Best thing to do is have one or 12 of each and learn tactics and how to apply them .

Mohawk · « **Reply #353 on:** July 11, 2009, 05:28:50 AM »

I would save the AR (.223) for another purpose. The 12ga with 00 Buck is plenty for burglars threatening your life.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #354 on:** July 11, 2009, 05:31:50 AM »

Check out IN THE BOX for how much wall buck will go thru. it will open your eyes as it ain't as much as you think , hit a stud and forget it .

mechanic · « **Reply #355 on:** July 11, 2009, 05:50:01 AM »

Lately I'm thinking the best weapon is your brain.

We have had two home invasions in our area where the people opened the door and let them in...............If you don't know them, don't open the door! Keep any weapon handy because thats better than none. If they break the door greet them properly!!!

Mohawk · « **Reply #356 on:** July 12, 2009, 03:32:36 PM »

You are worried about wall penetration during a home invasion? If you have him isolated behind solid cover then, run to safety.

teddy12b · « **Reply #357 on:** July 13, 2009, 02:21:07 AM »

The wall arguement is a good one, but like anything there are two sides to that arguement. There may be a case where the bad guy is on the other side of two walls and #8 shot in your shotgun won't get to him but he's still in your house and shooting at you. I imagine that in some cases you may want to get through a wall or two also.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #358 on:** July 13, 2009, 07:15:38 AM »

Then there is the old one about putting a fist thru a wall but never thru a chest . so why would you want something that won't go thru a wall if you are defending your life ? as it can't be depended on to stop someone from hurting you .

Mohawk · « **Reply #359 on:** July 13, 2009, 12:23:54 PM »

Simple simplicity of a shotgun over a rifle is a good start. Being awoke out of a dead sleep and into a home invasion is confusing enough. Granted individuals can be trained to recover enough, quick enough to react with a rifle, but I think the less thought that goes into it the better. Point a shotgun and aim a rifle. This is why the shotgun was prefered in heavy jungles and trenches. Reactions had to be quick due to close quarters, and it you made two or more hits with one shot, as with a shotgun, you were ahead of the game. With the exception to a hostage scenario, the shotgun is more versatile. After training with a shotgun and training with an AR, the shotgun takes my affirmative nod for anything close quarters. And the last thing I want is a sustained fire-fight in close quarters, even behind walls. Shoot your way out of it, not into it. Thus the term "covering fire". It gives a means of escape. And if not, I would prefer a .308 if left in need of a rifle. That's just me......