Author Topic: Confederate Mortar Base, PLEASE HELP WITH INFO (Read 6384 times)

lance · « **on:** August 19, 2007, 02:47:02 PM »

I'm asking for help........ from time to time, i get PM's, e-mails, or people in person asking about my mortar bases. anywhere from: what kind of base is that, to, cool you make the Confederate Base, or, Hey you invented a new kind of base............... i always say i just copied a picture of a real Confederate mortar, that i saw in the book:Civil War Weapons And Equipment, by Russ A. Pritchard jnr. i had no plans, just the picture in the book, so i just made a few that looked close enough to me.i would like to be able to tell people the history about these style of bases, but i haven't found much so far. i do have a few pictures, but that's about it.............. for me it's the easiest base to make, it's very strong, i've tried to blow some apart, but it's too strong of a design. the side pieces slip into Dado's cut in the side runners, no glue, the bolts hold everything together....now i'm not too good with a computer, plus i have no plans, wouldn't know how to use them, if i had them anyway. folks like DD,CW,GGASKILL,TERRYC, just to name a few make great plans, so maybe someone can put some plans on here to help others.............also any history about the bases would be a BIG HELP. i'll post what few pictures i have, have to be logged on to see them, like i said i ain't a computer person

lance · « **Reply #1 on:** August 19, 2007, 02:50:45 PM »

another pic of the book,close up, you should be able to double click these pics and zoom and read the fine print

lance · « **Reply #2 on:** August 19, 2007, 02:53:46 PM »

here's a pic of the 18th South Carolina Mortar Battery, i think they live in Arizona.

lance · « **Reply #3 on:** August 19, 2007, 02:54:47 PM »

here's a pic a stole from this very forum.

lance · « **Reply #4 on:** August 19, 2007, 02:59:42 PM »

o.k. this is the last one

copdoc · « **Reply #5 on:** August 19, 2007, 03:34:04 PM »

Thanks Lance
I found the 35mm shots I told you about from Gettysburg and shot a digital pic. It is not real clear but you can see it. This base is on a 24 pounder. I wondered how "standard" this base was. I think I am going to use it for a Confederate 12 pounder. I have never seen an original Confederate 12 pounder How about anyone else. Lance you did a good job on these.

Just noticed the ones in your book look like THE ones from Gettysburg.

lance · « **Reply #6 on:** August 19, 2007, 03:44:03 PM »

Thanks Jim, those are some great pics............... as far as i know, no 12pd Tredegar mortars survived the war, so who is to say what they looked like? i have to guess at history on this base, and i hate to guess. shortage of materials, lack of proper military paint, plus the South was colorful with alot of individual expression.............but are those correct guesses? you really can't beat a base like this, my mortars don't jump or move around, it's like they are glued to the ground. sure would like to know the true history...........

copdoc · « **Reply #7 on:** August 19, 2007, 04:01:06 PM »

Hi Lance
I edited my last post about the same time you posted I think. it looks like the ones in your book are THE Gettysburg Coehorns. After making 3 full sized Coehorn beds with a few hand tools I am going to try that one. Whittling an oak 7 1/2 X 9 board is too much as the arthritis develops. It is neat that one is at Gettysburg and it looks like a stable platform for shooting. Thanks again for the pics. I hope someone has some more information on them.

I know what you mean about plans. One of my best friends can draw them up or follow them. I jut cut away anything that does not look like a cannon.

I have read none of the 12 pounder Tedegar mortars survived, but I have seen bigger war souvenirs so I hope we get to see one from a basement or barn one day.

lance · « **Reply #8 on:** August 19, 2007, 04:16:31 PM »

Jim, i'm that way too, i can look at most anything and just build it,never need plans...... i have a metal lathe, but i don't consider myself a machinist. i do antique gun repair, talking about the expensive antiques, some of the boys have vintage civil war weapons, they trust me anyway...............i've built every kind of mortar base you can think of, but this Confederate base with the Dado cuts is my favorite. i think you'll like it, plus not much wood to it. we'll just have to track down the history part of it

Double D · « **Reply #9 on:** August 19, 2007, 11:10:52 PM »

Quote from: lance on August 19, 2007, 02:47:02 PM

... folks like DD,CW,GGASKILL,TERRYC, just to name a few make great plans, so maybe someone can put some plans on here to help others ...

Never accuse the the Double d of being able to produce nice drawings...Pencil and Paper Version 1.0 is my method right now. George converted my old 5.5 Auto sketch floppy discs for me--Thank you George--but I haven't had time to relearn it yet. Now these other guys, that's different they are good!!

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #10 on:** August 20, 2007, 12:20:29 AM »

Quote from: Double D on August 19, 2007, 11:10:52 PM

Quote from: lance on August 19, 2007, 02:47:02 PM
... folks like DD,CW,GGASKILL,TERRYC, just to name a few make great plans, so maybe someone can put some plans on here to help others ...

Never accuse the the Double d of being able to produce nice drawings...Pencil and Paper Version 1.0 is my method right now. George converted my old 5.5 Auto sketch floppy discs for me--Thank you George--but I haven't had time to relearn it yet. Now these other guys, that'd different they are good!!

I thought you were up to P&P v1.1 now (that's was the move from wide lines to narrow lines on the paper).

Double D · « **Reply #11 on:** August 20, 2007, 07:43:48 AM »

Nope, PP 1.1 is the skinny pencil and graph paper...

Lance your practically neighbors with Tim, he does CAD

lance · « **Reply #12 on:** August 20, 2007, 03:15:08 PM »

well guys, i'm not sure what to do. the only plans needed would be ones to pass on to folks that ask me for plans. it makes me feel bad that folks e-mail me for plans, and i tell them i don't have any. really i don't, i just grab material and say to myself, that will work........... and who's to say my models are to scale anyway? i made what looks good to me, why make plans for an unknown scale, but people still ask. so you tell me what to do about it..........................darn, i was hoping a history buff might have some info on this style of Confederate base, i've never been able to find any. i thought for sure, the great cannon sleuth INTOODEEP might have some small fragment of info.

............anyway, i sure would like to know the history.

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #13 on:** August 20, 2007, 04:17:58 PM »

The history will be revealed - in the mean time, make some measurements and I'll do the CAD work.

copdoc · « **Reply #14 on:** August 20, 2007, 05:05:49 PM »

Quote

The history will be revealed - in the mean time, make some measurements and I'll do the CAD work.

We are all counting on you Tim.

Lance, what type of wood did you use? I used oak for the others but I have some ash. I was saving it for another cross bow because it is the only thing that can take force from an 800 lb bow, but I can not find anymore single trailer springs, so I might use it for a hand cannon, matchlock ot another mortar. If I could get away with pine for the 12 pounder it would be better as I have not been able to scrounge up any more ash.

lance · « **Reply #15 on:** August 20, 2007, 05:22:00 PM »

hi Jim, the little reds ones i use scrap Maple, bigger ones get Tikka or Spruce. do you know what kiln dried oak cost now adays......... i've never had any problem with them, i've tested them as hard as i could too. Spruce kinda "gives" i would avoid yellow pine for sure. i can tighten the trunnion caps down so hard on the spruce, that the "tube" will not move. it's such a great design, i think almost any wood can be used. with paint, only you will know what it's made with................you would think this kind of base wouldn't be such a history mystery, i'd just like to know who and where they were built during the war. i'm not kidding, i don't know.

LivnDream · « **Reply #16 on:** August 20, 2007, 05:42:53 PM »

Lance , i just autocaded up a base like this for a small mortar project im working on
i like it simple yet sturdy. i dont know if my dimentions are rite but i think it looks good with my barrel drawn on it .
i know what you mean about the cost of oak , i finally found a local sawmill for kiln dried 8' boards for $10.00

lance · « **Reply #17 on:** August 20, 2007, 05:59:27 PM »

Quote from: LivnDream on August 20, 2007, 05:42:53 PM

Lance , i just autocaded up a base like this for a small mortar project im working on
i like it simple yet sturdy. i dont know if my dimentions are rite but i think it looks good with my barrel drawn on it .
i know what you mean about the cost of oak , i finally found a local sawmill for kiln dried 8' boards for $10.00

i'm sure your dimentions will be fine, you'll like this base. what color will yours be? i've seen them, black,red,green, light blue, gray,and yellow. one thing about Confederate weapons, they used what they could get their hands on.

LivnDream · « **Reply #18 on:** August 21, 2007, 11:09:12 AM »

not sure what color as im not a big fan of painted wood mite just put a clear finish to let the wood show

Double D · « **Reply #19 on:** August 21, 2007, 11:26:43 AM »

If that is a confederate pattern mortar there is a good chance it was made for yellow pine and finished with linseed oil.

copdoc · « **Reply #20 on:** August 21, 2007, 03:48:04 PM »

Hey DD
I know little about wood. Is yellow pine the best pine and how do you tell them apart? I have a real old rough sawn 2x12 that is pine but appears harder than the pine I see in the usual boards. The sled on a Confederate 24 pounder in Ft Benning iooks like pine. I thought it might be a replacement. Maybe it is the original.

Coehorn at Ft Benning.

lance · « **Reply #21 on:** August 21, 2007, 04:19:13 PM »

hey JIM, when i said to avoid yellow pine, i meant todays yellow pine lumber. they don't let the trees get old enough before they turn them into lumber. now if you happen to have an old yellow pine board, and it's harder than the pine you see today, well you got a good one.

copdoc · « **Reply #22 on:** August 21, 2007, 05:41:40 PM »

Thanks Lance
I have had the board since about 1976. When I built my first cannon a friend found the board and asked if I could use it. I used railroad ties instead. I have drug that piece of wood all over the place. It had to be for a reason. It is not but about 4-5 ft long so it will not be enough to make the sled for the 12 pounder Maybe make an English type bed for a small mortar.

What is heart pine? I remember my Dad saying that is what my Grandfather used to panel the old farm house. He made floor wall and ceiling out of it. A vandal burned it down about a year ago.

Does anyone know if the Ft Benning sled might be original?

lance · « **Reply #23 on:** August 21, 2007, 05:55:29 PM »

Jim, when i used to live in Carolina, the good yellow pine was called heart pine, fat wood, rosin wood, "lighter" as in fire lighter,and a few other names. that was the pine that you could carve almost like a bar of soap, it was full of sap. over time the sap would get very hard, also that pine had a very tight grain. today most of those trees are gone, today if it's 20 years old, it gets turned into lumber. people still dig up the old yellow pine stumps when they can find them, and cut them into little bundles of fat wood..........sorry to hear about that house burning down.................the Ft.Benning Sled is a question for others,cause i don't know.

Max Caliber · « **Reply #24 on:** August 22, 2007, 01:50:47 AM »

Here are a couple of views of the Ft. Benning coehorns. The Confederate coehorn bed and hardware appear to me to be modern made, the handles appear to be cast and the bed made of pine.

copdoc · « **Reply #25 on:** August 22, 2007, 09:24:55 AM »

That's it Lance.
The wood was dense grained and sap had extruded to where it looked like it had a thick coat of polyurethane. It is a shame as a piece of family history is gone and some punk runs free. I looked at the board I have again. I don't think it is as thick grained and does not have as much sap. It is prob regular pine, just rough sawn and older.

Max Caliber
I thought is was a repro and pine when I looked at it but that has been 5-6 years ago. My photo is a scanned 35mm. The base on the Union gun may be original and certainly looked old. That was a great museum. I copied my Confederate sled from a period photo. It has been it several books so I'm sure most of you have seen it but I will look for a copy. What a bunch of whittling I had to do to cut it out. Lance's/Gettysburg design looks so much easier.

Double D · « **Reply #26 on:** August 22, 2007, 10:08:05 AM »

Fine looking mortar Copdoc... very period looking. It looks very right!

Max Caliber · « **Reply #27 on:** August 22, 2007, 10:35:08 AM »

Copdoc,

Fine looking mortar, has lots of character. Another thing about the Ft. Benning coehorn is that the bed has a Roman ogee molding around the top, probably not something one would find on an original. The U.S. mortar bed does look original with original paint that has now turned almost black.

lance · « **Reply #28 on:** August 22, 2007, 03:37:51 PM »

LivnDream, bet you are seeing some more bases to make,going to make one of each? Max Caliber, it's always great to look at mortars, thanks for sharing the pics. Jim, i really like your mortar, the powder can inside, does that mean you shoot a pound at a time

really looks like you could get a few more pounds in there if needed. now that's a museum piece if i ever saw one!!! Double D, know what i like best about starting this topic,well besides having all these cool mortars to look at...... Tim has a house full of mortars and lives about an hour from me.....Jim has a bunch of mortars and come to find out only lives about two hours from me. i'm going to have to flip a coin from now on and see which house to go play at

Tim, don't worry, you'll always be gun number one

copdoc · « **Reply #29 on:** August 22, 2007, 04:46:36 PM »

Thanks everyone
Lance I will see you and Tim soon I hope . A house full of mortars. You guys should sponser an artillery show. I would take mine if you come help load them.

Any of you ever going to the Greensboro Gun Show this weekend?

Here is the Confederate mortar I copied. I enlarged it with xeroxgraphy, knew the bore diameter and used algebra to get rough measurements. I got to see the one in Ft Benning about a month after I finished cutting and boring the barrel. I did not expect to find one there. I was pretty close if I do say so myself. Thank goodness I had a tape measure in my pocket. They had a soldier follow us around the museum after a while. One of the kids did come yelling "Dad, we found a Japanese howitzer that has a breech block in it, we could shoot it".

It occurred to me that I would like to have a pic at the same angle.

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