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Author Topic: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market  (Read 1503 times)

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Offline Ireload2

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Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« on: September 06, 2007, 02:27:07 PM »
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Offline trotterlg

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2007, 02:39:26 PM »
That $115.00 MSRP price translates into $99.00 in the discount places.  Not a bad deal I wouuld say.  Larry
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2007, 02:43:52 PM »
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Offline bluebayou

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2007, 02:56:02 PM »
My secondhand experience with the Russian Remington is that they are inconsistent.  Also, Remington did NOT fix one .410 that I sent back 3 times.  We finally gave the customer a new shotgun. 

They lockup very well and are finished better than the NEF, even if they are, well.......ugly.  The point is that they are well polished and the parts, metal to wood, metal to metal, fit well.

That 45/70 double rifle looks pretty sweet though!!!!!!!
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Offline poncaguy

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2007, 03:38:48 PM »
What's the price on the CZ?
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Offline kennyd

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2007, 05:21:28 PM »
I missed any reference to a double.  Where?  It has been one of my wishes to get something I could afford to buy and shoot.
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Offline fanner50

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2007, 04:42:54 AM »
I have imported from Czek Brno in the past so I e-mailed them and this is my response:

Dear Sir,

        I am sorry to inform you, but as far as I know there are currently no plans to export the Brno Effect model to the USA.
I think that you know that our company has a subsidiary in the USA, so you may contact the personnel there and to discuss with them these matters.
The website address is as follows: www.cz-usa.com

Yours faithfully,

Milan Kubele
Marketing
Ceska Zbrojovka a.s.,
Uhersky Brod
Czech Republic
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Offline Mac11700

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2007, 05:01:45 AM »

The rifles I looked at and handled didn't impress me at all...Yup...the lock up was very good...too good...it took both hands and breaking it across my knee to open them..Sorry...I would rather buy a Rossi...than these...but I guess if it's the only thing you can afford...then the price is defiantly attractive..

Mac
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Offline Sourdough

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2007, 06:16:57 AM »
Do they have ejectors or extractors?
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #9 on: September 07, 2007, 06:33:32 AM »
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Offline PartsMan

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2007, 06:39:12 AM »
I have only found one affordable single shot made in the USA.
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Offline McLernon

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2007, 02:28:23 PM »
If NEF would take up the challenge to ship only guns that shoot 1MOA out-of-the-box they could stomp the competition. Why they don't respond to this forum with all the 'fixes' we employ to make our Handi's shoot better, I don't know. Modest cost/price  increases for guaranteed 1MOA should be achievable with modern CNC machinery and fit-up tooling. JMHO.

Mc
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Offline Mac11700

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2007, 02:50:41 PM »
Quote from: McLernon on September 07, 2007, 02:28:23 PM
If NEF would take up the challenge to ship only guns that shoot 1MOA out-of-the-box they could stomp the competition. Why they don't respond to this forum with all the 'fixes' we employ to make our Handi's shoot better, I don't know. Modest cost/price  increases for guaranteed 1MOA should be achievable with modern CNC machinery and fit-up tooling. JMHO.

Mc

Mc...

Don't look for them to ever offer this...even though with a little TLC & elbow grease...most will do this if they are fitted properly...

Why don't they respond...simple...they would be bombarded with questions & PM's  if hey got on here and let it be known they are a NEF employee...Their company policy forbids this from what I am told...There are several NEF/Marlin  employees who do frequent the forum...so they know what is going on...They build a simple fairly accurate inexpensive rifle for the masses...They don't have to compete with companies who offer guaranteed accuracy...If your wanting that...you will have to work at it...to achieve it..

Sure...I would love to see Marlin do a bunch of things that have been suggested over the years...namely a full blown custom shop...and all the goodies that one normally associates coming from it..but...it's not financially viable enough for them at Marlin...to start one...even though there are plenty of people asking for one that shoot only Marlins leverguns...I think it's because of the background of those who are running both companies...It isn't the hunting side of the family that's calling the shots...and if they survive long enough...hopefully things will change...

Mac
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Offline McLernon

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2007, 03:03:31 PM »
Mac:

The mods we are doing to out Hand's are so minor and can have such a beneficial effect on accuracy, like pressure points on the barrel. Surely they could put some bumps on the fore-stock. And making the surfaces and pin center-lines square and parallel where needed is a no-brainer with modern m/c tools. I mean you can hold incredibly tight tolerances today for virtually no extra cost. I think you're right, it's attitude that's all that needs to change.

Maybe they just need more competition. Maybe the Russians are coming!

Mc
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Offline canon6

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2007, 05:42:08 PM »
I am drooling over the CZ ,6.5X57R is real close to perfect for me     ::)   Doug
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Offline Mac11700

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #15 on: September 08, 2007, 10:51:30 AM »
Quote from: McLernon on September 07, 2007, 03:03:31 PM
Mac:

The mods we are doing to out Hand's are so minor and can have such a beneficial effect on accuracy, like pressure points on the barrel. Surely they could put some bumps on the fore-stock. And making the surfaces and pin center-lines square and parallel where needed is a no-brainer with modern m/c tools. I mean you can hold incredibly tight tolerances today for virtually no extra cost. I think you're right, it's attitude that's all that needs to change.

Maybe they just need more competition. Maybe the Russians are coming!

Mc

They could offer more...but..here's what I have found about those "bumps"...some shoot good with a pressure point...others throw them all over the place..I know...I tried the magnet trick myself yesterday...it would scatter my shots every where with it..So...it's best to see how they shoot first...Now..if I could control it...what I would offer would be a barrel channel open up completely to allow all of the barrels to be perfectly free floated...this way..we wouldn't have to sand as much to do this...and adding a pressure point would still be easy to do if needed... ;)

New high performance cnc machines cost a fortune to buy...your not talking about needing or using something most machine shops use...these machines would have to be fast enough and large enough to do major production work...and not just 1 of them either.....Also you have to have folks who are trained how to use them or send them to school to be trained.....You will also software support...since most of the software is proprietary...This cost a fortune at start up...Building a ISO 2006 plant isn't cheap...and while some parts can be made on the smaller cnc machines...they still have to be fast enough for production runs...not just 1 part every 1/2hour as what the smaller usual machine shop cnc cutters produce...Even they cost quite a bit...hopefully they will get the new machines going and quality control improves...

I sincerely doubt Marlin has anything to worry about when it comes to the cheap Russian imports...and I am quite certain they feel the same...I do feel they need to move into the 21 century...and listen to what the rest of the country wants too...not just the Northeast states and those that have been doing their surveys for them in the past...I wouldn't want to see the prices double or triple to make what changes I think they need...but I sure can see the need to have a custom shop for both their Marlin lines...& the NEF lines...That could open up some real possibilities that can migrate over to their standard lines...

Mac

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Offline Freightman

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #16 on: September 10, 2007, 02:33:46 PM »
The Remington Co. hasn't came up with a idea for some time that is the reason they are importing the Russian stuff. I can hear them now "can not compete making gun here" we know better we have Handi rifles. Hope they import a lot of them, when they do not sell Gander Mtn. can run them on special like they did Rossi S_S $129, have a 223 that is just pretty darn accurate, picked up a 4x scope at a garage sale $5 it was a old Weaver I like sales.
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Offline bluebayou

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Re: Seems there are some others looking at H&R's market
« Reply #17 on: September 10, 2007, 03:42:58 PM »
kennyd
The SPR22 was a double rifle in 30-06 or 45/70 in 2006.  I don't see it listed in the specs pages, but here is an active link on the Remington website:

http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/centerfire_rifles/SPR_models/SPR22_specs.asp

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