Effective range of 445 on deer?

[darat100]

I have fallen in love with the 445.  I need some help on effective range.  I am thinking no problems at 150-175.  Sound about right?

I am shooting hornady 180 gr xp over 37.5 gr of 1680.  Shooting 2 inches high at 100yds.  This seems to put me about an inch low at 150.  No probem making the shot, but just not sure how to calculate or find the energy left at a given range.  I know there are plenty of you guys, especially you oklahoma guys, who use them on hogs.  What kind of range can you make a clean kill?

Thanks

[quickdtoo]

Just guessing on the MV, but it looks like the bullet drops well below the accepted 1000ft/lbs energy for deer just past 100yds, using an MV of 2150fps. Seems to me Digger was getting just shy of 2000fps with the 300gr XTP. The 180gr's low BC of .138 kills it for downrange energy, the 240gr or 300gr would likely be a better choice.

Tim

Trajectory for Hornady .430 dia. (44 cal) 180 gr HP/XTP at 2150 Feet per Second
At an Elevation Angle of: 0 degrees
Ballistic Coefficients of: 0.138   0.138   0.138   0.138   0.138
Velocity Boundaries (Feet per Second) of: 1360   1360   1360   1360
Wind Direction is: 0.0 o'clock and a Wind Velocity of: 0.0 Miles per hour
Wind Components are (Miles per Hour): DownRange: 0.0   Cross Range: 0.0   Vertical: 0.0
Altitude: 0 Feet with a Standard Atmospheric Model.
Temperature: 59 F
Data Printed in English Units
Range   Velocity   Energy   Momentum   Drop   Bullet Path   Wind Drift   Time of Flight
(Yards)   (Ft/Sec)   (Ft/Lbs)   (Lb-Sec)   (inches)   (inches)   (inches)   (Seconds)
0   2150.0   1847.2   1.72   0.0   -1.5   0.0   0.000000000
25   2008.1   1611.4   1.60   -0.25   0.26   0.0   0.036096694
50   1871.9   1400.3   1.50   -1.03   1.48   0.0   0.074782476
75   1742.0   1212.6   1.39   -2.44   2.08   0.0   0.116319378
100   1619.1   1047.6   1.29   -4.56   1.97   0.0   0.160984201
125   1504.0   904.0   1.20   -7.52   1.02   0.0   0.209056020
150   1397.9   780.9   1.12   -11.43   -0.89   0.0   0.260797546
175   1301.8   677.2   1.04   -16.46   -3.91   0.0   0.316421106
200   1217.2   592.1   0.97   -22.77   -8.21   0.0   0.376040392

Trajectory for Hornady .430 dia. (44 cal) 240 gr. HP/XTP at 2200 Feet per Second
At an Elevation Angle of: 0 degrees
Ballistic Coefficients of: 0.205   0.205   0.205   0.205   0.205
Velocity Boundaries (Feet per Second) of: 1600   1600   1600   1600
Wind Direction is: 0.0 o'clock and a Wind Velocity of: 0.0 Miles per hour
Wind Components are (Miles per Hour): DownRange: 0.0   Cross Range: 0.0   Vertical: 0.0
Altitude: 0 Feet with a Standard Atmospheric Model.
Temperature: 59 F
Data Printed in English Units
Range   Velocity   Energy   Momentum   Drop   Bullet Path   Wind Drift   Time of Flight
(Yards)   (Ft/Sec)   (Ft/Lbs)   (Lb-Sec)   (inches)   (inches)   (inches)   (Seconds)
0   2200.0   2578.8   2.34   0.0   -1.5   0.0   0.000000000
25   2102.5   2355.4   2.24   -0.23   0.04   0.0   0.034872379
50   2007.6   2147.6   2.14   -0.95   1.09   0.0   0.071377463
75   1915.3   1954.7   2.04   -2.22   1.6   0.0   0.109625213
100   1825.8   1776.1   1.95   -4.07   1.52   0.0   0.149733028
125   1739.1   1611.6   1.85   -6.58   0.78   0.0   0.191824207
150   1655.7   1460.7   1.76   -9.8   -0.67   0.0   0.236025172
175   1575.7   1322.9   1.68   -13.82   -2.92   0.0   0.282463027
200   1499.4   1197.9   1.60   -18.72   -6.04   0.0   0.331263085

Digger's load
Trajectory for Hornady .430 dia. (44 cal) 300 gr HP/XTP at 1950 Feet per Second
At an Elevation Angle of: 0 degrees
Ballistic Coefficients of: 0.245   0.245   0.245   0.245   0.245
Velocity Boundaries (Feet per Second) of: 880   880   880   880
Wind Direction is: 0.0 o'clock and a Wind Velocity of: 0.0 Miles per hour
Wind Components are (Miles per Hour): DownRange: 0.0   Cross Range: 0.0   Vertical: 0.0
Altitude: 0 Feet with a Standard Atmospheric Model.
Temperature: 59 F
Data Printed in English Units
Range   Velocity   Energy   Momentum   Drop   Bullet Path   Wind Drift   Time of Flight
(Yards)   (Ft/Sec)   (Ft/Lbs)   (Lb-Sec)   (inches)   (inches)   (inches)   (Seconds)
0   1950.0   2532.5   2.60   0.0   -1.5   0.0   0.000000000
25   1874.0   2339.0   2.50   -0.29   0.34   0.0   0.039234506
50   1799.9   2157.8   2.40   -1.21   1.57   0.0   0.080072021
75   1728.0   1988.7   2.30   -2.79   2.12   0.0   0.122599967
100   1658.3   1831.6   2.21   -5.1   1.95   0.0   0.166907137
125   1591.0   1686.0   2.12   -8.2   0.99   0.0   0.213082589
150   1526.3   1551.6   2.03   -12.16   -0.84   0.0   0.261214645
175   1464.3   1428.1   1.95   -17.05   -3.59   0.0   0.311387238
200   1405.3   1315.3   1.87   -22.96   -7.36   0.0   0.363676591

[quickdtoo]

That's a start load according to AA, if you pushed it harder maybe?? Kinda shootin in the dark here without some chrono data.

http://www.accuratepowder.com/data/PerCaliber2Guide/Handgun/Standarddata/44Cal(10.97mm)/445%20Super%20Mag%20page%20136.pdf

Trajectory for Hornady .430 dia. (44 cal) 180 gr HP/XTP at 2300 Feet per Second
At an Elevation Angle of: 0 degrees
Ballistic Coefficients of: 0.138   0.138   0.138   0.138   0.138
Velocity Boundaries (Feet per Second) of: 1360   1360   1360   1360
Wind Direction is: 0.0 o'clock and a Wind Velocity of: 0.0 Miles per hour
Wind Components are (Miles per Hour): DownRange: 0.0   Cross Range: 0.0   Vertical: 0.0
Altitude: 0 Feet with a Standard Atmospheric Model.
Temperature: 59 F
Data Printed in English Units
Range   Velocity   Energy   Momentum   Drop   Bullet Path   Wind Drift   Time of Flight
(Yards)   (Ft/Sec)   (Ft/Lbs)   (Lb-Sec)   (inches)   (inches)   (inches)   (Seconds)
0   2300.0   2114.0   1.84   0.0   -1.5   0.0   0.000000000
25   2152.5   1851.5   1.72   -0.21   0.06   0.0   0.033707969
50   2010.5   1615.2   1.61   -0.9   1.15   0.0   0.069762139
75   1874.2   1403.7   1.50   -2.12   1.71   0.0   0.108401078
100   1744.2   1215.7   1.39   -3.96   1.64   0.0   0.149886461
125   1621.2   1050.3   1.30   -6.52   0.86   0.0   0.194494935
150   1506.0   906.3   1.20   -9.91   -0.75   0.0   0.242505650
175   1399.6   782.8   1.12   -14.25   -3.32   0.0   0.294181885
200   1303.4   678.8   1.04   -19.7   -7.0   0.0   0.349737116

[Ditchdigger]

I shoot the 265 gr.Hornady at 2100+ fps. I shot 1 hog at 140 yds.in the hindquarter and it busted the left leg bone,traveled on and busted the right shoulder and lodged under the skin for a total of 37" of pentration. the bullet weighed 252 grs. after that much pentraition. I was using Win. 296 with the load. I also shot some 180 gr. XTP's that were accurate also and chrono'd 2550+ fps. The 445 is trully a hog killer deluxe. Lik2hunt has flattened a whitetail or 2 with his also.  Digger

[quickdtoo]

Here's the numbers for those loads...

Trajectory for Hornady .430 dia. (44 cal) 265 gr. FP Interlock at 2100 Feet per Second
At an Elevation Angle of: 0 degrees
Ballistic Coefficients of: 0.186   0.186   0.186   0.186   0.186
Velocity Boundaries (Feet per Second) of: 1680   1680   1680   1680
Wind Direction is: 0.0 o'clock and a Wind Velocity of: 0.0 Miles per hour
Wind Components are (Miles per Hour): DownRange: 0.0   Cross Range: 0.0   Vertical: 0.0
Altitude: 0 Feet with a Standard Atmospheric Model.
Temperature: 59 F
Data Printed in English Units
Range   Velocity   Energy   Momentum   Drop   Bullet Path   Wind Drift   Time of Flight
(Yards)   (Ft/Sec)   (Ft/Lbs)   (Lb-Sec)   (inches)   (inches)   (inches)   (Seconds)
0   2100.0   2594.5   2.47   0.0   -1.5   0.0   0.000000000
25   1995.6   2343.0   2.35   -0.25   0.34   0.0   0.036637208
50   1894.4   2111.4   2.23   -1.06   1.62   0.0   0.075211436
75   1796.6   1898.9   2.11   -2.46   2.31   0.0   0.115866732
100   1702.4   1705.1   2.00   -4.54   2.32   0.0   0.158754206
125   1612.3   1529.3   1.90   -7.37   1.58   0.0   0.204027888
150   1526.5   1370.8   1.80   -11.04   0.0   0.0   0.251841671
175   1445.4   1229.1   1.70   -15.64   -2.51   0.0   0.302342358
200   1369.6   1103.6   1.61   -21.28   -6.06   0.0   0.355659455
225   1299.5   993.5   1.53   -28.08   -10.77   0.0   0.411893530
250   1235.8   898.5   1.45   -36.16   -16.76   0.0   0.471097880
275   1179.1   817.9   1.39   -45.67   -24.18   0.0   0.533257815
300   1129.6   750.6   1.33   -56.74   -33.16   0.0   0.598279564

Trajectory for Hornady .430 dia. (44 cal) 180 gr HP/XTP at 2550 Feet per Second
At an Elevation Angle of: 0 degrees
Ballistic Coefficients of: 0.138   0.138   0.138   0.138   0.138
Velocity Boundaries (Feet per Second) of: 1360   1360   1360   1360
Wind Direction is: 0.0 o'clock and a Wind Velocity of: 0.0 Miles per hour
Wind Components are (Miles per Hour): DownRange: 0.0   Cross Range: 0.0   Vertical: 0.0
Altitude: 0 Feet with a Standard Atmospheric Model.
Temperature: 59 F
Data Printed in English Units
Range   Velocity   Energy   Momentum   Drop   Bullet Path   Wind Drift   Time of Flight
(Yards)   (Ft/Sec)   (Ft/Lbs)   (Lb-Sec)   (inches)   (inches)   (inches)   (Seconds)
0   2550.0   2598.5   2.04   0.0   -1.5   0.0   0.000000000
25   2393.7   2289.7   1.91   -0.17   -0.1   0.0   0.030357358
50   2242.9   2010.3   1.79   -0.73   0.92   0.0   0.062726703
75   2097.4   1758.0   1.68   -1.71   1.51   0.0   0.097306624
100   1957.6   1531.4   1.56   -3.2   1.6   0.0   0.134321388
125   1823.6   1329.0   1.46   -5.24   1.13   0.0   0.174018625
150   1696.2   1149.7   1.36   -7.95   0.0   0.0   0.216667287
175   1576.1   992.6   1.26   -11.41   -1.88   0.0   0.262546309
200   1464.1   856.6   1.17   -15.74   -4.65   0.0   0.311932075
225   1361.5   740.8   1.09   -21.09   -8.42   0.0   0.365073223
250   1269.4   644.0   1.01   -27.62   -13.37   0.0   0.422152811
275   1189.5   565.4   0.95   -35.49   -19.67   0.0   0.483232573
300   1122.5   503.5   0.90   -44.89   -27.5   0.0   0.548194952

[darat100]

Wow Tim, those numbers sure burst my bubble.  However, looks like just bumping the powder should do what I want.  I hope the bullet stays as accurate for me with the increased velocities.  Thanks for the help you guys.

[JPH45]

darat 100, There are two things to do, first up your bullet weight, then up your velocity. Think of the 445 as a streached, faster 44 Mag, which it is. The 44 Mag is plenty enough for 125-150 yard shooting, the 445 should at least do the same. Not knocking Tim, but the accepted 1000 ft. lbs of striking energy is somewhat negotiable. When I was hunting with my 44 Mag Handi, I was driving a 265 grain cast bullet at 1300 fps. I can assure you that such a load will shoot completely through the lungs of most any deer you'd point it at, and kill it cleanly. The 445 is capable of better energy and velocity than many of the old time black powder rounds and few called them inadequate. Shot placement is everything. I'd look to drive a 265-300 grain bullet at 1800-2000 fps. The Speer 270 Gold Dot is an excellent bullet. I killed two deer with my 44 Mag and that bullet at 1575 fps and should only perform better at 445 velocities. You'll find a very nice ballistics program at www.realguns.com

[safetysheriff]

tim's tables show a zero-degree elevation for the firearm.   so they are not relevant for figuring drop so much for a rifle sighted 'high' at 100 yds.    BUT, the velocity segment is very relevant, because of the design of the xtp.    in other words, FORGET about the 1000 ft/lb 'mantra' with handgun bullets and many times with bullets of 24 caliber and under.    remember, broadheads kill deer without developing even 100 ft/lbs of energy.   if your cartridge will provide 1400 ft/second velocity with that 180 gr' bullet ('terminal velocity' at 175 yrds or wherever) then you are already at the upper limit of that bullets design parameter.....according to hornady's 2006 catalog.    you should have no problem getting that bullet to function properly, unless you try knocking down a monster of a deer.   then i'd say go with a heavier 'xtp' to get more metal and more 'action' at the target.   it could help to knock down and tag that deer if you're in an area with a lot of hunters.   

take care,

ss' 

[Ditchdigger]

I think that everyone that has the 445 chrono'd there 300 gr. load at 1975 to 1977 fps. Thats a little faster than the 45 70  load with Win. factory. I did shoot 1 boar (around 450 pd.) at 160 yds.and got a compleat pastthrough with a 45 70 with the same weight bullet and less velocity.The 265 gr. Hornady is a very good bullet that stays together very well and makes a big hole.Shoot it at 200 yds.and determine how much drop you have,and then go kill a whitail. I use the Sierra load book and nearly max loads in mine.  Digger

[lik2hunt]

I shoot a 265 grain Hornady over 30.5 gr. of Winchester 296. I consider my 445 a 150-175 yard gun on both deer and hogs. I haven't had the opportunity like Digger, to see what it will do to a hog. I did take a big ole doe last year with it though. She dressed out to a whopping 35 lbs.    Put one right behind the right shoulder and it came out right in front of the left shoulder, best eating deer of the season. The bullets performance was excellent, I don't think I caught any dense bone structure however. She made it about 20 yards before folding up. Shot was from about 90 yards.
Mine will shoot 3/4" groups with the load mentioned. According to Point Blank, and I haven't calculated this in a while, but I believe that with a 78 yard zero, it will be dead on at 173 yards according to an average velocity of 2000 FPS. Digger's is averaging 2066 FPS, just checked the data I have on that one. He shoots a half grain more in his than I do.

Here she is.......

[PartsMan]

I know the 1000 foot pound rule and use it myself,
but I think it applies better to small fast bullets that must open or fragment to do there damage.

You put a .44 hole in a lung or heart and they will die very soon.